Proving Calis right (and responding to DU)...

[Calis]

On a completely unrelated note, now about implementing a "retardedness police" headed by VD (or not)? They would attack retardedness (for instance stuff like spacemoose's "joke) in any form with rude but brilliant arguments. The more active posters could report cases of retardedness, and then a police officer would be called in to take care of the idiot in the Saint Proverbius way. He would not relent until the retard is shown the error of his ways or flees, or both. If the retard responds with spam or non-arguments it would be obvious to all he is prime dumbfuck material.

Obviously, this is more than a single person can handle, so why not make giving a rope to trolls to hangs themselves official? Form a kind of moderator militia?

A lynch mob, that's a pretty good idea. I'd suggest some changes to your idea though:
It should be some kind of "secret" lynch mob. Meaning the lynch-mob coordination gets done in a private forum. People get invited to the lynch mob by PM and will be expected not to reveal their membership, so that none of the other posters will ever know! I don't know who should get to decide membership. I'm also of the opinion that being a newsie, moderator (or possibly even admin) should not guarantee membership of this lynch mob or access to their forum. Of course, this would leave whichever administration of the Codex is in place at the time vulnerable to a coordinated revolt by mean, analytically-strong posters, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
I propose we start talking about this hypothetical secret lynch mob forum as if it's already a fact, as a first concrete step in scaring the dumbfucks smart.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I'm sorry, but I don't get this.

WwtS: "I think VD's contributions actually do count for something. He who pays the piper calls the tunes. Giving him "permission" to post news but no admin duties is akin to the ex-wife who magnanimously tells her ex he's more than welcome to pay child support but needs to kindly shut the fuck up when it comes to how the kids are raised. Sorry, bitch, it doesn't work that way and most decent people know it."

Hope that helps. I've always like WwtS's way with words.

Ah, there we have it then. It's about pride! That's understandable, but all the wiggling about was unnecessary (well, maybe not).

Nope. Using Walks' analogy, is the father's interest to be involved in raising the kids a matter of pride or something else?

 

[VonVentrue]

I'm for anything that moves this forward in a sensible fashion. If we can actually make something work out of this...well, that would be double plus great, especially given where we seemed to be not so long ago.

Great. Please sort it out without kicking out anyone or cutting yourselves off from a common bond that connects all members of the Codex...

 

[DarkUnderlord]

I made a general comment indicating that I'm not planning to be here forever. You make it sound like I was about to leave the site.

There's the more recent comments by you but there is a comment by you in the staff forum back around about February I think that you were considering stepping down or words to that effect. I'm trying to find the exact post where I saw it again but I found it yesterday when I was going through the older stuff.

Point is, I didn't find a post that gave any conditions on when you'd leave, just that you were making us aware you were suggesting it and that it might happen sooner or later. I mean, I don't know how I'm supposed to take someone who says they're stepping down / thinking about stepping down other than that they're going to step down at some point. I'm also aware you and Calis had an e-mail conversation about before all this happened so... I dunno? What are you doing? Coming back on board so you can step down next week sometime?

For the record, I would have left only if there was another strong "front page" admin. The site meant too much to me to leave it without finding and training a suitable replacement first. I thought that Role-Player will eventually take my place, but that didn't happen.

No, it didn't and we've been unfortunate in that respect. Maybe people felt too intimidated by you though and making a clean break in the middle of an e-drama crisis will work for the better and give some of the new guys the space to make their own stamp on the news. I'm not necessarily saying that's a good thing, I'm just being hopeful that maybe this will work out in the long run.

I wasn't going to throw out any paying customers, but some pot-smoking kids who would get too bored occasionally and vandalize the place.

VD: Everything is subjective. That's not the point. The real question here is do you agree with me - at least in 80% - what's stupid and what isn't, who's a moron and who isn't. If you do, then we are in consensus and can work together toward a common goal. If you don't, then I'll be the first to tell you not to give me the admin powers back.

No. Nobody else on staff believes Spacemoose deserved to be threatened with a ban for posting his, what you considered tasteless black humour remark. Nor that he deserved to be given a second and "final warning" for replying with "u can't b serius?". Throwing out the "retards" is one thing, throwing out someone specifically for a remark you don't like is entirely another. Then there was his remark in the Role-Player thread which again, none of us feel warranted the kind of meaning you wanted to place on it.

Well, you would have had this opportunity if you didn't throw me out so quickly. You could have emailed or PM'ed me to discuss the situation, but you were too busy beating me in public. The simple truth is, I wasn't given an option to explain, discuss, or present my position properly.

Yeah sorry, the thread was on page 9 before I replied. Last I checked the Codex it was down because Calis was restoring "yesterday's backup". The next day I wake up and find an e-mail where Calis took away your admin access for a while so you could have a breather. I then pop 'round the forums and find a 9 page thread, where you've very clearly stated your demands and given your ultimatum. I replied because that's what I do and here we are.

Your picture explains everything more clearly than your posts.

Yup. I've still a bit of the LULZ in me and I don't want to see this place turned into some individual's version of a Nazi Concentration Camp.

You mean the 'Wasteland' forum from DAC I presume Koby?

I don't even lurk there. How bad is it 'down' there?

Believe me when I tell you that you do not want Retardo Land unlocked for the LULZ. If this place attracts people for the lulz as it is, unlocking Retardo Land would be opening the flood gates. And really, DAC is where I go for most of my scat porn posting lulz. The Codex is where I come for more serious discussion but still safe in the knowledge that I can tubgirl someone with a hidden link if I so desire. One of those has a certain artform to it where you need a brain to see the humour in it, the other is just scat porn.

I doubt that many people here think of me as unreasonable, impossible to deal with guy.

I do. I tried reasoning with you in the Staff Forum of all places over the interview thing and you threw a whiney tantrum, stamped your foot down and said "fine, see if I care".

PS. Why vrok is still dumbfucked? To honor my memory? If I was so wrong and out of line and completely fucking crazy, why hasn't it been fixed yet? Don't tell me you are still deciding it.

See, it's shit like this that only reinforces my belief that you've got no idea what you're doing. You dumbfucked him. Didn't you have a good enough reason for doing that? Oh wait no, we've got to go out and blame everyone who disagrees with us because you can't handle a conversation.

PS. Why vrok is still dumbfucked? To honor my memory? If I was so wrong and out of line and completely fucking crazy, why hasn't it been fixed yet? Don't tell me you are still deciding it.

We haven't talked about it yet. At all.

Liar. You said very clearly he should undumbfucked and I agree. I said I just wanted to finish off my code that pulled out all the lists of dumbfucks so I could finally get control of them and figure out how many ended up with the tag and why.

See VD, Calis and I believe in doing things right the first time. Not in acting like a retard and banning, tagging and then whinging about it because nobody else agrees with us. And for the record, we've come up with our rules. We've just been waiting for your response to the conditions we'd let you back in under. Seeing as you're demanding a full return and things being done your way, I think it's very clear where we all stand. The answer is no.

Do you agree that Spacemoose shouldn't have interrupted a serious discussion about rather dramatic events and kids being dead with his "only 8? weak!" lulz comment? If you see nothing wrong with it, then yes, I'm lacking alotta imagination. If you agree with me, then we are on the same page.

Nobody agrees with you about that. Nobody. And when I say nobody, I mean not even most of the non-retarded forum-ites agree with you. The fact that you can't see that and that you're completely and utterly unwilling to compromise on the matter, is the problem. Let me make it clear, I'm not talking about the images he posted. I'm talking about his initial comment which so offended you that you felt it was ban worthy. And the fact that when he asked if you were for real or not, you warned him with a ban again. If you're not willing to admit that you were wrong on that point, then we've got nowhere to go.

No, we're going to do it openly.

To avoid endless quoting and other crap: Shagnak, you want us to meet in the middle? You agree that things were mishandled? Fine. Let's try that again. We're going to start a new thread and discuss everything in the open. Since we are discussing what concerns everyone, people have the right to know what's being discussed and what each admin's position is. That's my requirement. Not good enough? We're done talking then.

If it's acceptable, start a new thread and post your position and your opinion on what needs to be done and how. Each admin will do the same. Then we'll start comparing positions and discussing things. Everyone will be welcome to participate and offer well thought-through opinions. The admins will delete stupid posts and spam.

Hey VD, have you been reading this thread at all? Shagnak and I have made it very clear to you the terms you get to come back under. That's our compromise. You've responded by very clearly sticking to your ultimatum that either Spacemoose and company go or you go.

It's clear you've made your decision. Thanks for all the work you've put into the Codex over the years and I wish you all the best.

 

[xedoc gpr]

none of you have been able to show me how I've been spamming since I've become mod,

Serioze Business

 

[Lurkar]

Jesus christ, the drama. Anyways, my two pennies.

1) DU, you're looking like a bit of a dick. Well, not just a bit of one. I'm not privy to the inner council drama, I didn't really pay much attention to the bannings, and I wasn't here for TEH REVOLUTION, so I can't really say which of you is right or wrong, but I can say that you're looking like a much bigger asshole then VD is.

2) I have no problem with the lulz so long as they're funny. And it really hasn't been that funny for awhile. The General Discussion is rapidly turning into a forum-version of /b/, and it's just as shitty and unfunny.

 

[Jedi_Learner]

You are not even trying to settle this DarkUnderlord. Your dealing of this event is extremely poor.

 

[Calis]

(stuff)

Can I take this as a "No, I don't agree with the Calis-amended ruleset for a new thread, either" ?

As for the vrok issue, so you did. Shit's moving pretty fast, so I'm playing the "it's been a long day(s)" card.

 

[Vault Dweller]

PS. Why vrok is still dumbfucked? To honor my memory? If I was so wrong and out of line and completely fucking crazy, why hasn't it been fixed yet? Don't tell me you are still deciding it.

See, it's shit like this that only reinforces my belief that you've got no idea what you're doing. You dumbfucked him. Didn't you have a good enough reason for doing that?

*I* had, but since nobody thought that I was right, which is why I'm no longer an admin, shouldn't you correct my wrongdoings and undumbfuck an innocent man?

And for the record, we've come up with our rules.

Too funny. "We don't like your stupid rules, so we came up with our own rules! Take that, bitch!" I mean, you do want to be taken seriosly, DU, don't you?

We've just been waiting for your response to the conditions we'd let you back in under. Seeing as you're demanding a full return and things being done your way, I think it's very clear where we all stand. The answer is no.

Failed your reading comprehension roll?

Do you agree that Spacemoose shouldn't have interrupted a serious discussion about rather dramatic events and kids being dead with his "only 8? weak!" lulz comment? If you see nothing wrong with it, then yes, I'm lacking alotta imagination. If you agree with me, then we are on the same page.

Nobody agrees with you about that. Nobody. And when I say nobody, I mean not even most of the non-retarded forum-ites agree with you.

Fair enough.

Hey VD, have you been reading this thread at all? Shagnak and I have made it very clear to you the terms you get to come back under. That's our compromise. You've responded by very clearly sticking to your ultimatum that either Spacemoose and company go or you go.

It's clear you've made your decision. Thanks for all the work you've put into the Codex over the years and I wish you all the best.

Thanks. Best wishes to you too!

 

[Slylandro]

Is there anything wrong with just reinstating VD as an admin, but from now on, he waits for at least one other admin to OK a ban? (The same would go for all other admins, not just VD. Just that I'm guessing VD would more likely ban someone than the other admins). To allow for instant reactions and Saint style moderation, the admins should reserve the right to dumbfuck a poster without any need for consensus. The reason (said something offensive, derailed a thread, doesn't contribute to RPG discussion, disagrees with me, looked at me funny, etc) shouldn't matter. That's the way Saint would have had it. Anyone who breaks the NSFW rule could still be immediately temp banned without waiting for consensus, of course.

In this alternative scenario, VD would just have dumbfucked SpaceMoose on the spot instead of warning him that he could be banned (because he would not be able to do this without at least another admin agreeing), and if SpaceMoose ended up posting the images still, a temp ban. Then VD would just wait a couple days for the other admins to OK a permaban, if he discussed it with SpaceMoose in private and no compromise could be reached.

What keeps this from working?

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Can I take this as a "No, I don't agree with the Calis-amended ruleset for a new thread, either" ?

Gah come on guys... VD gave an ultimatum. Sure, my replies haven't made anyone calm down but VD started this off with an ultimatum, in the first thread, where he very clearly said:

Now, the reasons for me stepping down. If I stay, I'll have to ban a lot of motherfuckers.

Now none of us, NONE OF US, are willing to accept those terms. Why? Because NONE OF US believe that Spacemoose should've gotten this:

he only got 8? weak WEAK

Spacemoose, if you insist on acting like a moron, find another forums. That's a warning.

*waiting for the local liberal fags to start fighting teh tyranny and claiming that the joke was funny.

holy shit. u cannot b sirius

Second warning. Instead of the third warning, you'll be banned.

Hint: Stop being a retard and all is forgiven.

VD has out-right refused to admit he was wrong. VD believes adamantly that what Spacemoose did above was a terrible, terrible thing and it's stuff like that that needs to be stopped at all costs.

Does anyone here agree with that?

No?

Right, then we're done here.

There's consensus and there's over consensus. It's time to post "teh rulez" and move on.

 

[xedoc gpr]

I don't think saying "Kay VD Cya" is what I would call willing to compromise....

Okay, we've had the big blowout drama. Now just reinstate VD and he's not an idiot, he's not going to do something like that again after this hassle, he's just too proud to say that in this thread.

Jeez, DU, I can excuse Calis because he doesn't pretend to be cool but seriously, you have done barely a fraction of what VD did for the site so why do you keep talking in this high and mighty manner? You speak as if you're the decider and head of the site whereas in terms of actual commitment VD has done way more and I would say is a way bigger part of RPG Codex.

 

[dragonfk]

Jesus christ, the drama. Anyways, my two pennies.

1) DU, you're looking like a bit of a dick. Well, not just a bit of one. I'm not privy to the inner council drama, I didn't really pay much attention to the bannings, and I wasn't here for TEH REVOLUTION, so I can't really say which of you is right or wrong, but I can say that you're looking like a much bigger asshole then VD is.

+1

Vault Dweller wrote:
Do you agree that Spacemoose shouldn't have interrupted a serious discussion about rather dramatic events and kids being dead with his "only 8? weak!" lulz comment? If you see nothing wrong with it, then yes, I'm lacking alotta imagination. If you agree with me, then we are on the same page.


Nobody agrees with you about that. Nobody. And when I say nobody, I mean not even most of the non-retarded forum-ites agree with you. The fact that you can't see that and that you're completely and utterly unwilling to compromise on the matter, is the problem. Let me make it clear, I'm not talking about the images he posted. I'm talking about his initial comment which so offended you that you felt it was ban worthy. And the fact that when he asked if you were for real or not, you warned him with a ban again. If you're not willing to admit that you were wrong on that point, then we've got nowhere to go.

Please do not speak on my account, because I did agree and if I recall correctly there was a specific poll wheter or not Codexers want VD-style moderation and guess what, most of votes were in favour of VD. Also can I point that writing "Nobody" and shortly after "Not even most of the(...)" does not go well with each other, there is pretty big difference in meaning.

I am not stating that RPGCodex did not need any changes, but I think that everyone can agree that this whole affair should have not ended like this.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

My compromise was that VD comes back on, has an equal say in who gets banned and who doesn't (which is what, for the record, "the rules" always were) but he doesn't get his admin powers back. IE: The only change from the way things were before is that VD doesn't have access to the little part of the forum where he gets to ban people, thereby forcing him to discuss it with the rest of us before any action is taken.

VD's compromise was that he comes back on board with full powers and we do things his way and ban a bunch of mother-fuckers.

One of those is an actual compromise. The other one isn't.

... or have I missed something because I'd really like to know if I've missed something.

 

[sqeecoo]

I'm sorry, but I don't get this.

WwtS: "I think VD's contributions actually do count for something. He who pays the piper calls the tunes. Giving him "permission" to post news but no admin duties is akin to the ex-wife who magnanimously tells her ex he's more than welcome to pay child support but needs to kindly shut the fuck up when it comes to how the kids are raised. Sorry, bitch, it doesn't work that way and most decent people know it."

Hope that helps. I've always like WwtS's way with words.

Ah, there we have it then. It's about pride! That's understandable, but all the wiggling about was unnecessary (well, maybe not).

Nope. Using Walks' analogy, is the father's interest to be involved in raising the kids a matter of pride or something else?

You are not required to "shut the fuck up when it comes to how the kids are raised" but to coordinate your plans and decisions with the mother(s), and if you are outvoted by the majority of your peers, accept that decision (although you are free to argue against it). Also, although they feel that you have proven untrustworthy, they are willing to allow you to come back from you much-too-hastily imposed exile (divorce) if you are willing to promise to cooperate. Feeling insulted is justified, but pride can be the only reason for refusing that decision.

A lynch mob, that's a pretty good idea. I'd suggest some changes to your idea though:
It should be some kind of "secret" lynch mob. Meaning the lynch-mob coordination gets done in a private forum. People get invited to the lynch mob by PM and will be expected not to reveal their membership, so that none of the other posters will ever know! I don't know who should get to decide membership. I'm also of the opinion that being a newsie, moderator (or possibly even admin) should not guarantee membership of this lynch mob or access to their forum. Of course, this would leave whichever administration of the Codex is in place at the time vulnerable to a coordinated revolt by mean, analytically-strong posters, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.
I propose we start talking about this hypothetical secret lynch mob forum as if it's already a fact, as a first concrete step in scaring the dumbfucks smart.

I agree with everything you said. Being a part of the lynch militia would give no authority. It's just that arguing *all* the dumbfucks to death is more than a single person can handle. So we could have a semi-organized group of able volunteers who pledge to respond to cases of dumbfuckery. That way, when someone says something bash-worthy we could have a mechanism of tasking someone to bash him with persistence and dedication.

What is bash-worthy as well as who gets to be a member of the militia could be decided by the site admins, and kept secret if you like.
Currently people who say stupid things are sometimes put down, but are more often answered with "lulz" or half-hearted insults or arguments. Depending on militia member activity and dedication, we could only handle big things this way ("Oblivion is great!") or also lesser silly jokes like Spacemoose's. This way we could task people to beat someone into the dust. If they get beaten instead - well, that's the beauty of the codex.

I actually think that the one who decides what is "retarded" and signals the call to arms for the militia members could be someone somewhat nazi-oriented, like VD. Excess activity of the militia, unlike over-moderation, could only lead to interesting discussions.

After a call to arms is signaled, a militia member could volunteer for the task (via PMs or a secret subforum), although everyone is of course free to participate. Urgent cases could have a member assigned directly.

I see two options.

You can have the militia happen "naturally" and be non (or semi) formal, acting "on its own" via PMs and relatively unsupervised by the admins. In this case you just need a leader with an eye for retardedness - someone who notices winnable battles and directs the troops. It wouldn't matter if he was overenthusiastic, on the contrary. Everything would happen naturally. This would be great, but it's unlikely to happen spontaneously.

Or you can make it more formal, and controlled by the adimns and similar to what you outline in your post. In this case you could have a (secret) subforum where admins or authorized "spotters" post possible retarded targets, and members volunteer for the job. In this case, the more targets available the better: not all need be responded to.

Membership could be fairly liberal: anyone with a good history that is dependable, active when needed, and skilled enough. Something like a codex "inner circle".

 

[Vault Dweller]

Shagnak, do you see now what I meant when I said that the new system doesn't work? I have no interest in becoming Dark Underlord's bitch and, unfortunately, that's the only real offer on the table.

It's still amusing that DU disregards other admin's wishes *again* (what strike is it now?) and does only what he wants to do, while blaming me for acting unilaterally.

 

[Joe Krow]

You folks do know that no one here takes you as seriously as you seem to be taking yourselves, right? It's a forum about rpgs for fucks sake. If anyone has a right to get pissy it's VD. He's put more time into this place then the worthless lot of you. However, VD, bro, let it go. You've proved your worth well beyond any of these idiots. Show them the class they lack. Stupid is the new grumpy. LULZ

 

[MountainWest]

I wouldn't at all be surprised if all of those guys were comfortable with "moderate" moderation. (Maybe "moderate" is the wrong word?

Indeed. I don't want the Codex to become a blessed fairy land where everyone hugs and kisses, where a curse causes the almighty admin to strike down the guilty devilspawn with his banhammer. Not at all. I love the harsh climate on these boards. As a matter of fact, without the permission to call a dumbfuck a dumbfuck - and worse - it wouldn't be the Codex I have come to know and love (in my admittedly short time here). The harshness must stay, in my opinion.

But that isn't really the issue. The issue it seems are the lulz. And here's where I side with VD (though I think he's on the same page as me on the harshness as well). The majority of the lulz aren't the slightest witty or funny. They're legion of lazy crap: lolcats, global warming jokes, free market jokes, picard-pictures and on and on in a never ending wave of unfunniness. Now, you might say that just because I don't think that's funny doesn't mean others do. Problem is, if a monkey with a bag of feeces enters a ballpark where four lions are discussing quantum physics, odds are the monkey will take his bag and disappear faster than he can say lulz. If the monkey on the other hand enters a ballpark where four other monkeys are throwing feeces at each other, well, he's a fucking monkey - with a bag of feeces - it's quite obvious what will happen. The monkey stays.

I see new faces every other day coming in throwing their feeces. It's worrying. You know, I was hesitant to start posting when I first joined the Codex. I was afraid of making a fool out of myself. I wouldn't have dreamed of posting fucking lolcats, that's for sure. Combine that with the fact that I joined only one and half years ago and the question is: What the fuck has happened in these one and half year, this short period of time, that's made the new recruits not fear posting crap?

I think it's the unrestricted unwitty unfunny lulz. I really do. Here, an example on what I think is good... fuck that. Here's how I want it to be and I'm sure this is how you envision it when you say that the lulz stay:

*serious post*
*serious post*
*serious post*
*serious post*
*Witty lulz*
*lol*
*serious post*
.
.
.

Here's how it is, with healthy dose of exaggeration:

*serious post on everything from politics to philosophy*
*serious answer*
*global warming lulz*
*picard lulz*
*WAT ARE YOU? SOME KIND OF NAZIE WAIT I GO GET LULCATS AMIRITE?!"
*free market lulz*
*lulz to up the postcount*
.
.
.
*yawn*


This needs to be stopped, if you don't want the whole ballpark over run by monkeys. If a thread is started with a lulz, then sure, lulz away. If a serious post is starting the thread, then you tell the monkeys to get the fuck out. That's my opinion.

And, I have to comment on the lulz that started it all. The famous "only 8? WEAK!". Is that dark humour? No, really? Is it? In a thread where a finn has stated that he thought it was a tragedy what happened to his country men the day before, is "only 8? WEAK!" humour at all? Fuck man, it's childish. Only a retarded kid would think that was funny. "Dark humour.." If that's the famous dark humour of the Codex then I can live without it.

There's a place and time for all kind of jokes. I said it in the other thread, I'm no prude. It's just that that particular joke didn't belong in that particular thread.

Did Spacemoose need to be warned, though? No, not in my opinion, not on a healthy forum. Problem is, there's to many monkeys. If you let one get away with throwing feeces then the others will join. So in that sense, yes, he needed to be told to get the fuck out of the thread. VD, in my opinion, had the right intentions but went too harsh too soon (which wouldn't have been a problem if Spacemoose hadn't acted like a fucking crybaby).

Now, since I'm such a slow typist I'm sure my rambling is even more redundant than it was before, but there you go.

 

[Briosafreak]

Nobody agrees with you about that.

If DU is talking about admins yeah, if it's about everyone than let's hold on, I agreed with him on that.Just wanted to make that clear, sorry to barge in, carry on.

 

[sqeecoo]

Did Spacemoose need to be warned, though? No, not in my opinion, not on a healthy forum. Problem is, there's to many monkeys. If you let one get away with throwing feeces then the others will join. So in that sense, yes, he needed to be told to get the fuck out of the thread. VD, in my opinion, had the right intentions but went too harsh too soon (which wouldn't have been a problem if Spacemoose hadn't acted like a fucking crybaby).

Let me just say this sums up my view of the SM situation almost perfectly. Good job MW. The other part of your post is also great. While my "moderator militia" suggestion might help with the retardness (perhaps in the sense of SM's post), it can't help with the lulz *spam*.

On the other hand, I agree with DU that we don't need to "solve" this problem in any radical way, although some kind of push in the other direction would be nice.

 

[spacemoose]

if Spacemoose hadn't acted like a true revolutionary guerrilla

 

[somnium]

Darkunderlord if you thought for a long time that there was something wrong with the moderating style of vd then why didn't you say/do something earlier? They way i see it vd did most of the moderation and news posting of the forum for about a year or more.
In all that time i hardly saw you post any news item, or try to Handel a problem in the forums. You left that to vd and when it's has all gone to shit you blame it all on him.
Because he tried fixing things where you didn't. Yes some thing might have gone better if they where differently handled. But since you did almost nothing all this time you are not really in a position to criticize/bash him like you do.

And for the record i agree with vd that this place needs a somewhat stricter set of rules and less toleration against the lulz crowd. But of course i am just a lurker and don't count for a real poster.

 

[xedoc gpr]

VD doesn't have access to the little part of the forum where he gets to ban people, thereby forcing him to discuss it with the rest of us before any action is taken.

That's stupid and childish. You guys are grown-up boys, you don't need to put a leash on people. If everyone wants VD to not ban people immediately he wouldn't. If he disagrees than he can post.

Besides, what happened to "listening to admin consensus". So far VD, Shagnak and Calis all wanted a separate thread to have an intelligent discussion on this. You're ignoring it and not letting it happen.

 

[kingcomrade]

if Spacemoose hadn't thrown a temper tantrum

 

[spacemoose]

if kingcomrade's sense of humor was not tragically stunted to posting wh40k and 4chan macros