UPDATED: In need of JRPGs with good combat (preferrably tactical combat)

[Hobo Elf]

JRPG defines a genre that has nothing to do with japanese made (western style) action rpgs.
Oh and Kings Field the predecessor of Dark Souls was very much inspired by the Ultima Underworld series.
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night, Onimusha DoD are action adventures (with some light rpg elementsd) btw they have nothing to with this anyway.
Just watch these extra credits episodes if you are still confused about the JRPG genre:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_rvM6hubs8

Extra Credits is by dumbfucks for dumbfucks.

 

[Sigourn]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

 

[Sigourn]

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

But it has animu art. Thus it's JRPG.

Animu prevails over everything.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

But it has animu art. Thus it's JRPG.

Animu prevails over everything.

Then we need a new Downs Syndrome RPG category for BioWare and Bethesda games if the art style is an indication for genre.

 

[tet666]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game aka raising sim.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

 

[tet666]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

Raising sim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bishōjo_game

 

[Hobo Elf]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

Raising sim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bishōjo_game

Yeah. Sim / RPG. Stats actually matter in these games as they pretty much define your whole character, much like in any "real" RPG.

 

[tet666]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

Raising sim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bishōjo_game

Yeah. Sim / RPG. Stats actually matter in these games as they pretty much define your whole character, much like in any "real" RPG.

Just because it has stats it doesn't have to be a rpg, there are a lot of other genres using character stats.

 

[Sigourn]

Hello, my good friends. I bring you more lists.

This one I compiled from around three different threads in the Codex.

Games in gold are pretty much the type of games I'm looking for. Something that has intrincate tactical combat (FFT and Tactics Ogre), or difficult combat, or interesting combat (Vagrant Story) that is very enjoyable. It has to be a game that can survive solely on the combat, which is the opposite of traditional JRPGs like the Final Fantasy series.

I await your suggestions on which ones on the blank files should I play.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

Raising sim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bishōjo_game

Yeah. Sim / RPG. Stats actually matter in these games as they pretty much define your whole character, much like in any "real" RPG.

Just because it has stats it doesn't have to be a rpg, there are a lot of other genres using character stats.

Technically every game ever concieved has stats, if we want to go down that rabbit hole. But it's better draw the line between RPG and a non-RPG where in RPGs the stats are visible, can be improved, and, as I already said, heavily influence what your character can and cannot do.

 

[tet666]

Japanese RPG = RPG made in Japan.
JRPG = A sub-genre of RPG that became popular in Japan. It usually has some sort of turn-based combat, heavy emphasis on story, all the characters have predefined backgrounds and personalities, and it needs to have animu art. Not animu "sprites" as that is usually difficult to accomplish, but animu art. Also, almost no choices to make or your choices don't matter at all.

Dark Souls: Japanese RPG.
Final Fantasy: JRPG.
Planescape: Torment: Western RPG, definitely not a JRPG. It gives way too much freedom to the player to be called a JRPG, from everything you can do and everything you can say, shaping your character's personality.

Stop this retarded nonsense at once. Dark Souls is an Action RPG made by Japanese developers. Nothing more, nothing less. There's nothing to be gained by making these arbitrary distinctions between what is a western RPG and what is a Japanese one based on mechanics. And by your definition Princess Maker is not a jRPG because it gives you too much freedom in raising your daughter, shaping her own personality.

Princess Maker is of course not a jRPG, it's a bishōjo life (social) simulation game.

Sim / RPG.

Raising sim
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bishōjo_game

Yeah. Sim / RPG. Stats actually matter in these games as they pretty much define your whole character, much like in any "real" RPG.

Just because it has stats it doesn't have to be a rpg, there are a lot of other genres using character stats.

Technically every game ever concieved has stats, if we want to go down that rabbit hole. But it's better draw the line between RPG and a non-RPG where in RPGs the stats are visible, can be improved, and, as I already said, heavily influence what your character can and cannot do.

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

 

[Hobo Elf]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

 

[Falksi]

As mentioned earlier The Last Remnant us a great game. Yes it's flawed, but it's also a shed load of fun.

 

[tet666]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess, seriously you are the first person i met calling princess maker a rpg.

 

[Hobo Elf]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess.

I think you're confusing larping and playing an RPG.

 

[tet666]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess.

I think you're confusing larping and playing an RPG.

Larping is role playing...
Live action role-playing game

 

[Hobo Elf]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess.

I think you're confusing larping and playing an RPG.

Larping is role playing...

A lot of people will disagree with you. And no one is schizophrenic enough to larp as you, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself and yourself, yet, Wizardry is still, without a doubt, an RPG. But you're not projecting make believe personalities on the party members. They're simply characters with stats that you use to hammer at the enemy. LARPing also doesn't have stats.

 

[tet666]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess.

I think you're confusing larping and playing an RPG.

Larping is role playing...

A lot of people will disagree with you. And no one is schizophrenic enough to larp as you, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself and yourself, yet, Wizardry is still, without a doubt, an RPG. But you're not projecting make believe personalities on the party members. They're simply characters with stats that you use to hammer at the enemy. LARPing also doesn't have stats.

You are literally playing a role not yourself... also all World of Darkness Live Action RPGs have stats:
https://tentacle.net/~prophet/lock/NWoD/Mind's Eye Theatre - Vampire the Requiem.pdf#[{"num":1595,"gen":0},{"name":"Fit"}]
From the new Vampire book can't find the old books online atm.

 

[Hobo Elf]

It's not your Character though there is no rp here you don't play the princess you raise her.

For all intent and purpose, it is your character, since you are the one in charge of making the big decisions that affect the course of the game.

Edit: Cleaning up the quotations.

That still doesn't make it a rpg since as i said there is no role playing involved you play her father/teacher whatever managing her life not the princess.

I think you're confusing larping and playing an RPG.

Larping is role playing...

A lot of people will disagree with you. And no one is schizophrenic enough to larp as you, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself, yourself and yourself, yet, Wizardry is still, without a doubt, an RPG. But you're not projecting make believe personalities on the party members. They're simply characters with stats that you use to hammer at the enemy. LARPing also doesn't have stats.

You are literally playing a role, also all World of Darkness Live Action RPGs have stats:
https://tentacle.net/~prophet/lock/NWoD/Mind's Eye Theatre - Vampire the Requiem.pdf#[{"num":1595,"gen":0},{"name":"Fit"}]
From the new Vampire can't find the old books online atm.

WoD is a bit of a weak example and you're shooting yourself in the foot here for bringing it up. The larp rulleset is, from what I remember, an (almost) literal translation of the WoD PnP which is also more larpy than any other PnP rule system. The stat rules are also non-eforced and White Wolf encouraged people to ignore them and just use the setting, which a large portion of White Wolf fans do. If you talk to WoD players (I have) it won't be unusual for them to tell you that they completely disregard the stats as it's detrimental to the flow of their larp.

Live Action Role Playing ≠ Role Playing Game.

Edit: I'll just say it plainly. Most WoD fans are larper degenerates of the worst kind and shouldn't be used as an example of a healthy RPG connoisseur.

 

[flyingjohn]

I love that even jrpg threads devolve into "What defines a rpg?" mess.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Eh, I don't feel that this what we've been doing. More like we are trying to find the boundaries of where an RPG could be and still be an RPG, instead of trying to come up with an uncompromising definition of an RPG. If we did that then the amount of games that we consider to be RPGs would get slashed by 90%. And it always comes down to if the person is a storyfag or combatfag.

 

[tet666]

Eh, I don't feel that this what we've been doing. More like we are trying to find the boundaries of where an RPG could be and still be an RPG, instead of trying to come up with an uncompromising definition of an RPG. If we did that then the amount of games that we consider to be RPGs would get slashed by 90%. And it always comes down to if the person is a storyfag or combatfag.

True I'm a storyfag so that may be the reason we disagree on this, i'm also a bit of a genre nazi so shit like this is hard to ignore for me.

 

[Ash]

Oh and Kings Field the predecessor of Dark Souls was very much inspired by the Ultima Underworld series

Got a source on that? They don't share much in common except that they are first person RPGs. It's likely as Underworld was a influential game, but I'm certain you're simply unaware of the extensive history of hardcore (in terms of difficulty) Japanese action games with lite RPG systems.

Castlevania: Symphony of the Night action adventures (with some light rpg elementsd) btw they have nothing to with this anyway.

Symphony is arguably more of an RPG than Dark Souls. Symphony has more RPG gameplay systems, but Souls has very mild character interaction and C&C.

Anyway, none of these games are much an RPG. Souls is a Japanese action game in the vien of the hundreds of other hardcore Japanese action games with RPG lite systems out there, especially commonplace in the 90s early 2000s.

If Severance is an RPG then the moniker RPG means nothing. It has levels so it is an RPG? No.

Exactly. Same for Dark Souls. It's a typical Japanese action game with lite RPG systems.