Why does everyone hate morrowind?

[yipsl]

I'm retarded/a TES forum member. Please make me understand why everyone here hates Morrowind so much. I liked it.
That game is the reason i'm going to buy Oblivion. I don't care how many things they've added, taken out, dumbed down or dumbed up, or how good the (p)reviews are. Or what the devs tell us or how good the screenshots/trailers look.
I've spend 5 minutes of my life on this forum and it seems that all the members ever does is bashing a game they haven't played.

Excuse my crappy english.

I'm an official forum member too, since March 2002 or thereabouts. I had to answer yes, because I liked Morrowind. I did not love Morrowind the way I love Daggerfall.

Morrowind had worse NPCs in many respects in its generation than Daggerfall had in 1996. While the work they put into the world was great, I really don't like the Dunmer and Morrowind province. The only worse time in TES I could imagine would be gaming in Valenwood among the unthrappa eating passive agressive Bosmer.

My hopes for Oblivion are still high, but I'm not really a fan of mainstreaming to bring gamers in. I'm a fan of hardcore genres for the die hards that gain converts by being true to their roots. Thus, though many FPS games have added RPG elements, they aren't RPGs and miss the mark when they're played like one. TES has too many FPS fans who play it like it was Battlespire, and their choices often get the dev's attention more than those of CRPG fans.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

Pay attention to the game you are playing. The guy made you an impossible offer. He doesn't want to make you Horator. The Girl doesn't care that much, for her it's a whole leap up. You should come back now and then and read the feedback. It's not much but it's something.

... and I don't want to really be the Hotpotato or the God of the Never-never but how else am I supposed to finish the main plot when everything else I do results in a little box telling me I've stuffed up? I also couldn't care less whether the girl wants it or not either. I'm against slavery. IT IS WRONG AND SHOULD BE ABOLISHED. I am a just warrior who shall SMIGHT ALL YE TRADERS IN HUMAN FLESH but oh sure, I'll buy that one girl because, you know, the girl doesn't mind and it's not as if it's really harming anyone because, you know, the guy's an idiot and conning idiots is A-okay and who wants freedom when they can be married to an areshole anyway?

... but I'll save all the other slaves, honest. Apparently those one-dimensional ones we are allowed to free, whether they like it or not.

You are not a reborn god.

Yeah I am. I've even got a cult to worhsip me and if I'm not a God or not divinely connected in some way, how was I reborn? I'm like Jesus and I should be worshipped as such. Even by the heathens for fear of my wrath.

 

[Rat Keeng]

I think the slave quest goes well with the quest to steal a dwemer artifact, which there's supposed to be some law against. Then again, you also have to defile a grave and help a necromancer perform her vile experiements, which is illegal as well, so i think any notion of being a noble hero type, is more or less thrown out the window right from the start.

 

[Proweler]

But the point of this is, why include such a weird quest in the first place?

Welcome to Morrowind, Land of the Drow.

Then why can't I join up with Dagoth Ur and take revenge?

Because Dagoth actually believes that crap.

If I'm not a God or not divinely connected in some way, how was I reborn?

Azura needed a handyman, somebody to fix her divine screw up. You just destroyed the most powerful artifact in the world and the four most powerful gods. Why do you think those Daedra are invading now?

So what did you think of your rp experiance as a real Dumbfuck?

But that's just arguments on the storyline. There was definitely a lack of choice. It was done a lot better in the expansions.

 

[Chefe]

Morrowind sucks balls and blows penis. End of discussion. The developers on that project should go crawl in a hole, eat shit, and die.

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

I liked it, no suprise to those who read my posts here. Why? For one because I accepted it as what it is instead of what I might have imagined it to be after DF. Because I appreciate the switch to a landscape worth exploring, I tried in DF and that was the most dissapointing aspect of that game. I appreciate the immersive graphics of the newer games. I enjoyed the lore, liked the unusual setting, learning about the place. Liked the main story so-so. Too linear. Had oodles of fun modding (no masochism here, Balor, you are so dramatic! ). Expansions brought some better quests, the original ones were mostly (although not all) meh.

Of course none of this holds a candle to chefes eloquent explantion why Morrowind is really a terrible, terrible game...

 

[Chefe]

Especially the part about the developers, right?

 

[deus]

I never played Daggerfall and still thought Morrowind was terrible. The big reason for me was the complete lack of difficultly. Maybe it's just me, but Seyda Neen and the surrounding area were the only places I ever needed a health potion. Somewhere between levels 10 and 15, nothing was even mildly challenging anymore. Someone brought up the monster tables, but those end somewhere around level 15 which is pathetic considering I finished at level 30 without min/maxing any of my skills.

Others have gone over the wiki "dialogue" and the signpost nature of most of the NPCs.

Too many skills were practically useless. Armorer, Enchant, Speechcraft, Alchemy, and probably a few more increased way too slowly and had their uses too infrequently; as a result, they were completely useless unless your race gave bonuses to those skills. Speechcraft was just useless considering how infrequently disposition mattered unless it was terrible. It was just plain work to raise those skills unless you wanted to spend tens of thousands of gold just to bring them to a useable level.

The enviroment was mostly bland. There were a few good places like Ald Ruhn or the Telvanni areas, but too much of the island was either black rock or brown dirt. The Dunmer tombs could have added something if most of them were more than three or fours rooms with a few low-level undead guarding worthless trinkets. The Daedra ruins were better, but they were still too small and easy. At least the loot was better.

The story's linearity could be excused if it made sense for it to be linear, but it didn't. I'm supposed to be the reincarnate of Nerevar, yet I'm also supposed to defend the people that murdered me and made themselves gods. Christ, even Rayman 2 had an ending if you decided to be evil. It's not like a token "evil" ending would have been so hard to do. Just something like Dagoth Ur taking over and everyone being miserable with a shadowy version of your character gloating while being tortured or something like that. I don't really want to namedrop Fallout, but something along the lines of the movie that played if you revealed the location of the vault is minimum I expected. Considering the backstory, joining Dagoth Ur or defeating both the Tribunal and Dagoth Ur are realistic paths the story could have taken and should have been accounted for.

 

[Chefe]

Yes, of course deus, we've all said this many, many times before.

However, Bethesda is stupid, and doesn't realize that they don't have to account for all possible options in the next game, and instead just choose one and run with it.

It's not entirely their fault though, they've got a ton of fans who are, arguably, dumber than dirt. I remember one thread on the ES board that struck a chord a while back, where a "fan" posted that Oblivion should feature a whole new slew of legendary items because his character in Morrowind had all the other ones. Dumbass. These kinds of people would be like "OMFG MY CHARACTER JOINED DAGOTH UR WHY DOES IT SAY THE NEREVARINE SAVED MORROWING???WTFQ!!!!"

Fucking idiots. I am beginning to see that it's not entirely Bethesda's fault though. They just need to realize that they can ditch the fools and still survive, by taking on the intelligent... or at least the moderately intelligent. Oh well, maybe TES IX.

 

[Fodel]

Because people play the main plot and not play mods, people is stranger, and retard.

I enjoy playing My Morrowind. :D

Un saludo

 

[Lumpy]

Pay attention to the game you are playing. The guy made you an impossible offer. He doesn't want to make you Horator. The Girl doesn't care that much, for her it's a whole leap up. You should come back now and then and read the feedback. It's not much but it's something.

... and I don't want to really be the Hotpotato or the God of the Never-never but how else am I supposed to finish the main plot when everything else I do results in a little box telling me I've stuffed up? I also couldn't care less whether the girl wants it or not either. I'm against slavery. IT IS WRONG AND SHOULD BE ABOLISHED. I am a just warrior who shall SMIGHT ALL YE TRADERS IN HUMAN FLESH but oh sure, I'll buy that one girl because, you know, the girl doesn't mind and it's not as if it's really harming anyone because, you know, the guy's an idiot and conning idiots is A-okay and who wants freedom when they can be married to an areshole anyway?

... but I'll save all the other slaves, honest. Apparently those one-dimensional ones we are allowed to free, whether they like it or not.

You are not a reborn god.

Yeah I am. I've even got a cult to worhsip me and if I'm not a God or not divinely connected in some way, how was I reborn? I'm like Jesus and I should be worshipped as such. Even by the heathens for fear of my wrath.

You didn't want to be Hortator and Nerevarine? But you have to in order to get Wraithguard from Vivec. Of course, if you didn't know, you can always steal Wraithguard from Vivec. So you don't really have to do all the Hortator stuff.
Then you'll have to find somebody who can activate it, like a Dwemer, and just get Keening and Sunder and go to Dagoth Ur.
Or you can just get Keening and Sunder without Wraithguard, but if you're not fast enough they might kill you.

And you're not a god. You're the incarnation of a general who is expected to kill Dagoth Ur, so that's why people worship you. But in fact, it's not certain whether you really are Nerevarine or not. Many think it's just a bunch of lies Azura tells you, and the Nerevarine Cult, to trick you into killing the Tribunal.

 

[OverrideB1]

And somewhere along the way, that should have been an option - to discover that Azura is playing you for 'dumbfuck of the year' and provide some valid choices as to how to deal with that revelation:

Do you continue playing along in the hope of glory?

Do you go off and reveal Azura's plans to the Tribunal?

Do you go off and join the Big Bad?

Or do you say 'fuck it' and retire to raise Wickwheat until the world folds in on itself?

See, this was the big problem with MW (as is often remarked here): the whole main quest was on rails and there was no way to deviate from it. Sure, there was a back path, but that STILL didn't offer any viable alternatives to "kill the big bad". And, quite frankly, I don't anticipate much more of the MQ in Bethesda's latest offering...

 

[Lumpy]

And somewhere along the way, that should have been an option - to discover that Azura is playing you for 'dumbfuck of the year' and provide some valid choices as to how to deal with that revelation:

Do you continue playing along in the hope of glory?

Do you go off and reveal Azura's plans to the Tribunal?

Do you go off and join the Big Bad?

Or do you say 'fuck it' and retire to raise Wickwheat until the world folds in on itself?

See, this was the big problem with MW (as is often remarked here): the whole main quest was on rails and there was no way to deviate from it. Sure, there was a back path, but that STILL didn't offer any viable alternatives to "kill the big bad". And, quite frankly, I don't anticipate much more of the MQ in Bethesda's latest offering...

True. Morrowind's main plot was great, but the way it was implemented (the main quest) sucked.
But joining Dagoth Ur? No way. Nope. It wouldn't work. How would a future return to Morrowind be? "You know, Dagoth Ur might have nbeen killed by the Nerevarine. But maybe he wasn't. Maybe he oined him. Hey, I'm just a dumb fucker who has no idea what happened. I suck." And the NPC kills himself.
There should always be only one ending. But several ways to reach that ending. And Morrowind somehow offered that.
What was really bad about the main quest was that, even though you were the most important person in Morrowind by the end, you'd go to Red Mountain by yourself. And you'd kill an army by yourself.
I hat it when armies are spread around the final dungeon so that the player takes them one by one. In a realistic world, the hero would have stood no chance against the whole corprus army, without an ormy of his own. (Which he could easily obtain from the houses and tribes he was the fucking leader of.)

 

[OverrideB1]

Why does there need to be only one ending? Future games can retcon the history to suit what is needed since each is "a fresh new experience, built from the ground up, with no references to the previous game" - isn't that how the mantra runs?

Daggerfall has multiple endings: hell, even KOTOR managed multiple endings. But, somehow, TESIII cannot.

There are a number of possible scenarios that could have ended the game rather than just "uber hero kills big bad".

 

[Twinfalls]

It's not entirely their fault though, they've got a ton of fans who are, arguably, dumber than dirt. I remember one thread on the ES board that struck a chord a while back, where a "fan" posted that Oblivion should feature a whole new slew of legendary items because his character in Morrowind had all the other ones. Dumbass. These kinds of people would be like "OMFG MY CHARACTER JOINED DAGOTH UR WHY DOES IT SAY THE NEREVARINE SAVED MORROWING???WTFQ!!!!"

Fucking idiots.

But joining Dagoth Ur? No way. Nope. It wouldn't work. How would a future return to Morrowind be? "You know, Dagoth Ur might have nbeen killed by the Nerevarine. But maybe he wasn't. Maybe he oined him. Hey, I'm just a dumb fucker who has no idea what happened. I suck." And the NPC kills himself.
There should always be only one ending.

HAHAHAHA.

Ahhhhh.

 

[foneco]

I instaled Morrowind in October 2002 and since then I think only for 2 weeks I stoped playing it.
Morrowind give Me what no other game, the freedom of choosing from a vast range of mods and try the most, keeping those I really enjoy.
Mods that allow me to play as a Prostitute (fucking and watching the clients fall down to the floor exausted and getting money for it), as a vampire, biting and turning anyone into my slaves, as a fisherman, playing only to get fishs to cook and survive, to a horse trainer, breading the best till the Ultimate horse is created, as a thieth, as a necromanter, summoning creatures from the dead bodies of the npc's i killed before, commanding aliens, fighting them as a predator, building furniture and/or clothes to decorate my new house, castle, island and so on!!!!
That's is what Morrowind it's to Me, a never ending object of pleasure.
That's what I expect for a game to be, being a Rpg or whatever.

 

[Twinfalls]

Morrowind ...mods... allow[ed] me to play as a Prostitute (fucking and watching the clients fall down to the floor exausted and getting money for it)

...That's is what Morrowind it's to Me, a never ending object of pleasure.

Sounds more like you're a never-ending object of pleasure to the whole of Morrowind lol1

 

[foneco]

:wink:

 

[Crnobog]

I love it when a random kiddie from the tes forums comes here, posts some topic about "omg why teh marrowand hatrid?!?!!!" never to return again, and yet next day the topic will span 5+ pages and still going

 

[Balor]

Because it's PHUN to chew this over and over .

Well, anyway, due to nature of Codex, such topics usually derail into completely irrelevant (and, usually, much more interesting) since like page 2 or so .

 

[VenomByte]

The redeeming feature for Morrowind is the construction set. I got bored senseless of the vanilla game after about a week, but with enough of the right mods it's not such a bad experience.

I play with somewhere around 80 mods that:

Fix Beth's shitty levelling system
Fix Beth's broken economy (as much as is possible)
Adjust the horrendously unbalanced difficulty settings
Add a bunch more skills (such as climbing)
Replace Bethesda's lacklustre terrain textures, clothing, faces, hair, bodies, etc.
Add some quests which are actually interesting.
Add a bundle of new gameplay features, such as classical vampire style embracing.
God knows what else that I can't remember.

I will be getting Oblivion in the hope that again there will be enough modders out there willing to fix the no doubt broken game which will be released. I just hope to hell it's not as buggy as it was with MW. I don't think I can face tracking down a whole new set of 'features' all over again.

 

[Balor]

Yea, I hope so too... no matter what GBC says about lack of masochism in modding for Morrowind, my point still stands - you must either enjoy suffering, or don't work with MW's CS .

 

[GhanBuriGhan]

Yea, I hope so too... no matter what GBC says about lack of masochism in modding for Morrowind, my point still stands - you must either enjoy suffering, or don't work with MW's CS .

Or maybe I am just tougher than you Nah, I guess I simply don't have anything to compare it to except the template system for building quests in Daggerfall - and compared to that TESCS is awesome. I am not a programmer either, so I have nothing to compare the script system to. I just know the CS allowed me to do some amazing things, so I liked it.

 

[Micmu]

For example, even the "click click click" scripting language/system in Warcraft 3 World Editor is WAY more powerful than TESCS's.
CS has no object reference variables (pointers), no arrays, no iterators, no string variables, etc... It doesn't even have logical operators!
Has generic error messages without line numbers, useless functions, undocumented limitations, bugs...
For me, it was indeed a nightmare to do something more complex right and required a LOT of patience & (re)trying.
But OK, at first it wasn't their intention to release it anyway (neither is primary goal, just bonus), so I don't mind.
But it sucked the life force out of me! ...and I persisted.
(Btw, GBG, thanks for the manual.)

 

[HardCode]

I enjoyed MW ... it was fun the first time. Replay is almost non-existant, and mostly for the faults in the game as expressed countless times here. Sure, if those faults didn't exist, even the first time through would have been more fun.

What really burns my ass is that Oblivion is not only NOT fixing the faults, but intentionally adding new ones. Nothing is better than taking a fun game and making it suckier, eh? Why bother fixing shit and making the next version better? Oh, I have that answer: ADHD console kids = $$$

Fuck Oblivion for making the same mistakes and introducing greater levels of mistakes. The old cliche goes, "If you fool me once, shame on you. If you fool me twice, shame on me."