Eurogamer Retrospective: Vampire: Bloodlines

[Serious_Business]

Except that no post-dos rpg had really good combat, so the point is pretty much useless. I love how people bash on the combat, but seriously, tell me this. How was Ultima 7's combat. It was great, wasn't it. Yeah.

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

VtM:B is the one game that gives me faith that "next-gen" doesn't automatically mean shitty. It has little to no collar grabbing, but goodness, it had some fantastic characters. My girlfriend, who since I'm on the internet is obviously fake, actually sat behind me and watched while I played a few missions and enjoyed herself. I really wish more games were made in the fashion of Bloodlines than emulate Mass Erect.

 

[bhlaab]

VtM:B is the one game that gives me faith that "next-gen" doesn't automatically mean shitty. It has little to no collar grabbing, but goodness, it had some fantastic characters. My girlfriend, who since I'm on the internet is obviously fake, actually sat behind me and watched while I played a few missions and enjoyed herself. I really wish more games were made in the fashion of Bloodlines than emulate Mass Erect.

What, your girlfriend wasn't enthralled by retarded aliens spewing out every ounce of wannabe star wars lore without provocation?

 

[Mackerel]

I had fun with the combat on my Tremere run, making enemies vomit blood or kill each other is hilarious.

 

[cardtrick]

That does sound fun, I was planning on playing a toreador to try celerity for the first time but if you say going melee with it is even cooler I might try a brujah.

Toreador melee with celerity is probably my favorite Bloodlines build. Pump up hand-to-hand a bit, too -- not to use it for itself, but so that you have a decent chance of being able to feed while in combat. Then you can use celerity and blood buff repeatedly to become a melee monster.

Don't bother with Presence, but put a couple of points into Auspex -- the boost to wits helps with hacking, and it's cheaper than increasing the base stats/skills once they get to a certain level. Max out celerity -- it's not too impressive at level 1, but it becomes fantastic as you level it.

Toreadors are great generalist characters. If you're planning only to play the game once, it's the choice that will let you get the most out of the game. If you're careful to hold off on spending character points until you actually need them, and if you use blood buff to boost your physical skills (for lockpicking, etc.) and auspex to boost your mental skills, along with focusing on scholarship and intelligence (so that you can read books for skill points), you'll be able to make pretty much any skill check in the game. (Although to avoid gimping yourself for combat, you'll want to specialize a little bit . . . probably want to use one or at most two of the three dialog skills, for example, and avoid haggling.)

 

[Darth Roxor]

Yeah, the combat and optimization were the worst parts.

This game, to me, is the current incarnation of what a RPG/FPS hybrid should be. It does both reasonably well though the speech is done extremely well.

 

[denizsi]

Whenever I think of Bloodlines, I feel like crying. It was that good. Oh yeah.

I must admit, though, that the way the story ended (in either way) disappointed me a lot. I'd expected a little something more.

 

[The Wizard]

malkavian playtrough. <3

the endings were perhaps a little short, but i found it to be extremely satisfying that in the grand scheme of things, you could beat the game but still fail.

 

[MetalCraze]

Whenever I think of Bloodlines, I feel like crying. It was that good. Oh yeah.

I must admit, though, that the way the story ended (in either way) disappointed me a lot. I'd expected a little something more.

Bah the ending was perfect. A huge fuck you to all people who expected some epic ending with saving the world. I was pleasantly surprised.

It's hard to imagine what would've happened to a "Journey To The Center Of Arcanum" had Troika finished it. It was meant to be another Source game and it could've only ended in the further decline.

I would take a cupful of Troika's decline over anything else though.

Yes.

 

[denizsi]

Bah the ending was perfect. A huge fuck you to all people who expected some epic ending with saving the world. I was pleasantly surprised.

The ending(s) came too quickly for me. I was hoping for some diverse branching in how you reached that point. Also, some parts of the game was too short. Giovanni mansion, for instance.

 

[Wyrmlord]

Bah the ending was perfect. A huge fuck you to all people who expected some epic ending with saving the world. I was pleasantly surprised.

The ending(s) came too quickly for me. I was hoping for some diverse branching in how you reached that point. Also, some parts of the game was too short. Giovanni mansion, for instance.

Yeah, that place seemed shortchanged.

In one of the backrooms, you can overhear a long private discussion between all the mafia heads talking about their recent expansions. Plenty of effort went there (I checked the sound file; it's a whole 20 minutes worth of recording), and yet, you'd expect there'd be a bit more to interact and see around the party, and the people there.

I guess their efforts went a bit too much into the passive elements of the game like the radio and the TV, but having a little more to do with game and its environment in certain locations was something not worked on as much.

 

[bhlaab]

Bah the ending was perfect. A huge fuck you to all people who expected some epic ending with saving the world. I was pleasantly surprised.

The ending(s) came too quickly for me. I was hoping for some diverse branching in how you reached that point. Also, some parts of the game was too short. Giovanni mansion, for instance.

Yeah, that place seemed shortchanged.

In one of the backrooms, you can overhear a long private discussion between all the mafia heads talking about their recent expansions. Plenty of effort went there (I checked the sound file; it's a whole 20 minutes worth of recording), and yet, you'd expect there'd be a bit more to interact and see around the party, and the people there.

I guess their efforts went a bit too much into the passive elements of the game like the radio and the TV, but having a little more to do with game and its environment in certain locations was something not worked on as much.

Pretty big difference writing a script for a couple long audio files and developing long, involved mission-dungeons. I agree that Giovanni's mansion could've been more developed, but I doubt one had a whole lot to do with the other.

 

[haraw]

couldn't get it work with my pc :/ can someone recommend a similar game with not so good graphics? i can't remember anyone ever mentioning anything else than deus ex for instance.

 

[Cimmerian Nights]

Well Vampire the Masquerade : Redemption isn't horrible - but it's gameplay has more in common with a FPS Diablo than it does Bloodlines. More Action/Adventure than RPG really.

So called "mature" game designers really need to take a look at Bloodlines content. It had some really dark, edgy, seedy stuff in it. Snuff flicks, cannibalism, serial killers etc. It works so well - I honestly want to take a shower after I'm in some of those locations like the porn studio and the peep show. They took "mature" a lot deeper than the usuall approach of "there's titties and we say fuck a lot it's teh machooor!"

 

[bhlaab]

couldn't get it work with my pc :/ can someone recommend a similar game with not so good graphics? i can't remember anyone ever mentioning anything else than deus ex for instance.

If you can't run a source engine game it's probably time to upgrade.

Only thing that sort of comes close is STALKER and that's even more intensive

 

[MetalCraze]

Of course if by close you mean nothing in common but first-person perspective.

 

[Dionysus]

Bloodlines falls from its pedestal after 15-or-so hours, but the journey to that point is as mesmerising as you're likely to see. At its best, it's a glorious, grand, mature piece of design, still unsurpassed in its niche little field.

I'm a fan of the game, but this is way overboard. Deus Ex is a very similar game that is much better. Bloodlines falls from its pedestal by the fifth mission in the first chapter. The mission design is inconsistent for much of the game, until it becomes consistently bad near the end. The writing is OK, but the ending doesn't really jibe with the railroading that the player is forced to endure throughout the game. I had fun with it, but I'll always remember it as more of a missed opportunity than a great game.

 

[phanboy_iv]

That's...an unusually excellent article. I wish that guy had reviewed Oblivion, frankly.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

That does sound fun, I was planning on playing a toreador to try celerity for the first time but if you say going melee with it is even cooler I might try a brujah.

Toreador melee with celerity is probably my favorite Bloodlines build. Pump up hand-to-hand a bit, too -- not to use it for itself, but so that you have a decent chance of being able to feed while in combat. Then you can use celerity and blood buff repeatedly to become a melee monster.

Don't bother with Presence, but put a couple of points into Auspex -- the boost to wits helps with hacking, and it's cheaper than increasing the base stats/skills once they get to a certain level. Max out celerity -- it's not too impressive at level 1, but it becomes fantastic as you level it.

Toreadors are great generalist characters. If you're planning only to play the game once, it's the choice that will let you get the most out of the game. If you're careful to hold off on spending character points until you actually need them, and if you use blood buff to boost your physical skills (for lockpicking, etc.) and auspex to boost your mental skills, along with focusing on scholarship and intelligence (so that you can read books for skill points), you'll be able to make pretty much any skill check in the game. (Although to avoid gimping yourself for combat, you'll want to specialize a little bit . . . probably want to use one or at most two of the three dialog skills, for example, and avoid haggling.)

If we're talking combat only I'd say toreador is the most firearms able clan in the game. I played gangrel first and the game was a cakewalk. The I went with a ventrue and the game suddenly got quite hard, ran out of money very often to buy ammo but overall the combat was better as an fps.

 

[Gay-Lussac]

I don't think the writing or the characters are that great. What I like about it is chiefly the voice-acting and the XP system.

I think the voice acting goes into the characters folder quite nicely. Guy that did LaCroix was absolutely superb.

Lacroix was my favorite too along with Smiling Jack. I'm surprised he doesn't get mentioned more often. I also like how the game railroaded you through it's actual mechanics (i.e. Lacroix uses dominate on you if you refuse one of his tasks)

 

[Gay-Lussac]

Bah the ending was perfect. A huge fuck you to all people who expected some epic ending with saving the world. I was pleasantly surprised.

The ending(s) came too quickly for me. I was hoping for some diverse branching in how you reached that point. Also, some parts of the game was too short. Giovanni mansion, for instance.

Yeah, that place seemed shortchanged.

In one of the backrooms, you can overhear a long private discussion between all the mafia heads talking about their recent expansions. Plenty of effort went there (I checked the sound file; it's a whole 20 minutes worth of recording), and yet, you'd expect there'd be a bit more to interact and see around the party, and the people there.

I guess their efforts went a bit too much into the passive elements of the game like the radio and the TV, but having a little more to do with game and its environment in certain locations was something not worked on as much.

You could really tell they meant to do a lot more with that area specially if you attack everyone at the party and that big bad giovanni boss comes out of nowhere.

 

[SCO]

Should have included diablerie. That would have been a nice opportunity. If it had consequences of course. Faction change to Sabbath? Antribu pc? They could keep most of the endgame, just the hells hotel and some speech would be different.

 

[Shevek]

FINAL ANAYSIS: Great game brought down by it's major flaws hence why it misses out on any legit 'top 10' lists.

Legit? It makes my top ten easy. But, hey, whatever.

 

[Imbecile]

FINAL ANAYSIS: Great game brought down by it's major flaws hence why it misses out on any legit 'top 10' lists.

Legit? It makes my top ten easy. But, hey, whatever.

Clearly you aren't legit! It was a great game, but the combat was largely atrocious, there were respawning bad guys, and the last 1/3rd was average at best. Thats flawed enough to fall out of my top 10. I guess it depends on how much you like the excellent dialogue.

 

[VentilatorOfDoom]

I genuinely like to know what was so terrible, horrible, atrocious about the combat?
Too easy? Too difficult? What was it? Was it the fact that button mashing does not suffice to be real badass if you don't have the stats? Please tell me.

ps: respawning was removed by Wesp's patch. PATCH!