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Preview IGN previews Stronghold 3: NWN2

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
Joined
Jan 7, 2003
Messages
28,044
Tags: Neverwinter Nights 2; Obsidian Entertainment

<a href=http://www.ign.com>IGN</a> has blessed us with a <a href=http://pc.ign.com/articles/725/725416p1.html>NWN2 preview</a>, a stronghold game with RPG elements, based on the latest demo and a chat with MCA.
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<blockquote>First, the castle needs workers. Throughout the course of the game leading up to the stronghold's acquisition, players will meet certain NPCs clearly dissatisfied with their station in life. After players are castle owners, these NPCs can be recruited to labor in the stony abode. Some may agree to work with no strings attached, others may need convincing, and yet more will require special tasks to be completed before they sign on as your servant. Chris mentioned most of these NPCs will be located in major metropolitan areas, such as Neverwinter, and be relatively easy to find. A few may be more out of the way. Each recruit contributes to a specific aspect of the stronghold's augmentation. Among the many possible employees, there are miners, priests, architects, blacksmiths, and farmers, to name a few.
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Since the demands of adventuring are so great, players won't be able to hang around their stronghold all the time. A work foreman of sorts will need to be given commands on how to run the base's day to day operations. As an added wrinkle, some NPCs will be better at their jobs than others, so players will need to choose carefully when assembling their workforce. Once a decent amount of employees are in place and performing their required tasks, orders can be given to the foreman to alter work habits, giving more attention to varying aspects. By speaking with the foreman in the stronghold, it will become more obvious what tasks require attention, as status reports are given detailing exactly how things are going.
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As the workers perform their tasks, the stronghold will build up into a more powerful, multifaceted structure. Its growth will prompt mercantile trading lines, and an inn can be built up as well. Taxes will need to be collected, revenue managed, and guards assigned for protection. Visual differences will appear, showing the stronghold as a more formidable, hardy structure than when it was first discovered. All this is in preparation for certain events that happen during Neverwinter Nights 2's story, called mass battles.
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From what we were told, these mass battles are basically stronghold assaults. If players haven't taken the time to properly manage their castles, they'll have a much harder time surviving. Obviously the main character and three possible companions aren't going to be able to hold back an army. The stronghold provides the solution, giving the player the ability to train armies. Army management is conducted through the foreman, who can be told to ease up on training or train extra hard, and be especially harsh. Army morale is affected by these sorts of decisions, but different approaches to training need to be made in order to level up the forces as much as possible, as well as give them better weapons and armor. Based on what orders are issued, it could eventually be made clear that certain sergeants are on the take, or the numbers and strengths of your units could be diminished. In other words, if you're not paying attention and erratically issuing orders, your armies are going to get mad.</blockquote>Awesome.
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Spotted at: <A HREF="http://www.rpgdot.com">RPG Dot</A>
 

YourConscience

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Well, actually this really is awesome. Something like this I always wanted. It's almost innovative!

Nevertheless it's only almost, because basically it's a sims ripoff. But anyway, more of such genre-blending, please!

But, please, no creappy flying-carpet-need-for-speed or a FPS using magic from some established franchise such as Might & Magic - oh wait....
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
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Messages
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If the stronghold is as good as it sounds, there's a good chance it'll be the best part of the NWN2 OC. WOWSERS!
 

Kraszu

Prophet
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There is good chance that it will best part of nwn2 oc even if it will suck.
 
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YourConscience said:
Well, actually this really is awesome. Something like this I always wanted. It's almost innovative!

Nevertheless it's only almost, because basically it's a sims ripoff.

How many different varieties of crack have you been smoking?
 

Andyman Messiah

Mr. Ed-ucated
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YourConscience said:
Well, actually this really is awesome. Something like this I always wanted. It's almost innovative!

Nevertheless it's only almost, because basically it's a sims ripoff.
More like a Suikoden (best j-rpg ever, hands on) ripoff, really.

But yes, sounds freaking awesome.
 
Joined
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This all sounds full of possibilities, well to me it doesnt but you people seem to be reading something else entirely. You just know the implementations is going to involve a few dialogue choices that loop back on themselves, with the same events happening anyway.
 

YourConscience

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@StraitWhatever: You know, even if it's a cheap dialogue-triggered assault on your base, err stronghold, - even then it's awesome. Because basically it turns the perspective around: Usually the rpg player invades the home of some bad guys and cleanses it. This time around it's your stronghold, that's being visited by some bad guys.

Or with other words, it reads like the addition of some dungeon keeper game-play to an otherwise rpg. Especially if one isn't so fond of the rpg-parts of that game, this might add some value to the game.

Of course, the implementation could be so bad that it doesn't add any value at all, but then again, shit happens, you know? Also, no reason to be insulting.
 

Jason

chasing a bee
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This seems like a bad idea. It reminds me of when shooters have a driving level that you have to bear with just to get back to the "real" game. If I wanted a castle building sim (and I don't), I'd buy a castle building sim.

Plus, maybe Obsidian should develop a complete RPG before they start branching out into other genres.
 

Vault Dweller

Commissar, Red Star Studio
Developer
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Messages
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baby arm said:
If I wanted a castle building sim (and I don't), I'd buy a castle building sim.
Don't be so close-minded. How else would you learn about other genres? In the future mini-games would actually be mini-demos of other exciting games that you can purchase and keep playing without exiting the first game. How awesome is that?!
 

Mr. Teatime

Liturgist
Joined
Jun 25, 2003
Messages
365
Seriously this seems pretty cool. Skies of Arcadia, one of my favourite console RPGs: one of the best parts of this game was having your own island and ship, and going round the world recruiting people to lend their special skills to your crew. Either an expert cook, or special engineer, or whatever. It worked really well. Of course the best part was you had met these NPCs throughout the game, and they had new stuff for you to do once you had reached the point in the game where you needed a crew.
 

Gambler

Augur
Joined
Apr 3, 2006
Messages
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Yeah, we don't need no castles. We need a game where you can go into the deepest dungeon around and flank the hell out of those skeletons.

And castles? Who need those stupid castles? Main character must not be a part of the game wold anyways. He must be an adventurer that does fed ex quests. That's the only true way.

It reminds me of when shooters have a driving level
Yeah, like Mafia did?
 

Kraszu

Prophet
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It can be good actually and I doubt that gameplay will be like in castle building sim, you will assaying peapole to task and it can be done in rpg manner, like in bg2 but more advanced.
 

Jason

chasing a bee
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Yeah, we don't need no castles. We need a game where you can go into the deepest dungeon around and flank the hell out of those skeletons.

And castles? Who need those stupid castles? Main character must not be a part of the game wold anyways. He must be an adventurer that does fed ex quests. That's the only true way.

So the only thing keeping an RPG from being a shitty dungeon crawler is having mini-games?
 

Gambler

Augur
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Messages
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So the only thing keeping an RPG from being a shitty dungeon crawler is having mini-games?
Mini-game is something that plays differently from the rest of the game, and has very limited effect on it. This whole thing does not sound like it. Not that I'm afraid of mini-games, mind you. If they are not boring, and are well-integrated, then I have nothing agains them. You spend one third of Space Rangers 2 playing various mini-games, and that is what makes the game interesting.

BTW, did you whine about the car in Fallout 2 as well?
 

Jason

chasing a bee
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The car in FO2 was just an added convenience. It didn't suddenly turn into a mandatory "run your own auto repair shop" management sim. You may be right that the castle situation is more than a mini-game and all that. But it doesn't sound like something I want to play and has dropped NWN2 from my "Must Play" list down to my "Maybe" list.
 

YourConscience

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Well, it might have dropped it from your list, but it has entered my list. So all is balanced. :)

In fact, there are examples, where mixing genres worked well, one excellent is the aferomentioned Mafia. Another famous example is Jagged Alliance 2. In fact, in both cases much of the gameplay came from the nice combination of various elements. For me at least.

However, either it fits naturally together like in Mafia or you need to provide a proper interface for it like in Jagged Alliance. What I fear most currently is, that managing your castle might become as cumbersone as managing an own carrier in X3. Instead of just clicking some building-icon and plaing it where it belongs it seems you'll first have to go through some kind of dialogue and all that. Or imagine you want to order your army to reinforce those guys at the west wall and for that you have first to find the corresponding commander, then tell him what you want and finally hope that those poor guys at the west wall didn't die in-between.

But seeing them die because you saved on their equipment or were too lazy to train them properly is a cool thing. :)

Other examples of bad interfaces for genre-mixes are the Battlecruiser series or the Battlezone series.
 

Stark

Liturgist
Joined
Mar 31, 2004
Messages
770
baby arm said:
This seems like a bad idea. It reminds me of when shooters have a driving level that you have to bear with just to get back to the "real" game. If I wanted a castle building sim (and I don't), I'd buy a castle building sim.

Plus, maybe Obsidian should develop a complete RPG before they start branching out into other genres.

I disagree. there are just so few quest varieties before Obsidian exhaust themselves and start recycling simple fed-ex quests again. Having to manage a castle (with side quests to recruit NPCs, managing recruits, and all) is a nice way of extending quest varieties in the game.
 

burrie

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I think this is a mini-game that I'm going to enjoy. It seems to be worked into the storyline to begin with, so there's already a good reason to take a break from adventuring and work on the castle(instead of suddenly taking out a deck of cards and play some silly Black Jack game).

Furthermore, I always wished to have an option to actually lead some folks around a bit when getting to some higher levels, instead of simply going into a higher-level dungeon with higher-level creatures. Let my player help with controlling the world a bit, and give me something to customise aside from the character. This may turn out to be an interesting feature.

For the record, anyone seen the vids of the siege battles? If not, here you go.[/url]
 

Voss

Erudite
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Messages
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Wow. That was an informative set of links. Mostly it told me that the loading times suck ass.


@Stark- start recycling fed-ex quests? What makes you think they've done anything else?
 

merry andrew

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Vault Dweller said:
In the future mini-games would actually be mini-demos of other exciting games that you can purchase and keep playing without exiting the first game. How awesome is that?!
This is true. My favorite part of the KotoR series is when you make an escape in your ship and get to gun down your pursuers. Now I play a lot of those 'take a picture of brad pitt and get a free webcam!' games.
 

DarkUnderlord

Professional Throne Sitter
Staff Member
Joined
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Messages
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Vault Dweller said:
All this is in preparation for certain events that happen during Neverwinter Nights 2's story, called mass battles.

Vault Dweller said:
Totally. Will it make the game worth picking up though? I never bothered with the first NWN.
 

YourConscience

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Kingcomrade: Show me how baby arms 40$ are more worth than my 40 EUR? Last I checked, the Euro was more worth. So in fact, it is me who is more worth. :P
 

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