Game News Broken Hourglass' combat mechanics

[Vault Dweller]

Tags: The Broken Hourglass

<a href=http://www.planewalkergames.com>Planewalker Games</a> has updated the site with The Broken Hourglass' <a href=http://www.planewalkergames.com/content/view/46/1/>combat mechanics</a>. If you like playing with numbers and concepts, do take a look:
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<blockquote>An attack begins with an attacker makes an attack roll. The basics behind this roll are the same whether the attack is issued with a melee or missile weapon, or a spell.
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Here's the formula:
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<b>AR = d100 + Weapon Precision Skill + Tactics + Modifiers - Cover Penalty</b>
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(we use the standard RPG notation for random numbers here: "d100" represents "a random number between 1 and 100, inclusive," as though you had rolled one of those big funny 100-sided ping pong ball dice.)
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Weapon precision skill is a secondary skill representing your proficiency and effectiveness with one of a variety of groups of weapons: bows, blades, hafted (bludgeoning) weapons, and so forth. For a spellcaster it would be the Precision value of Physical or elemental magic (earth, air, fire, water.) Tactics is a secondary group skill reflecting your group's overall tactical aptitude. Modifiers are any miscellaneous bonuses you might be enjoying due to traits, other abilities, or weapon qualities, and the cover penalty addresses bodies and obstructions between attacker and target.
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If the defender is aware of the attacker and the defender has not dropped its guard, the defender automatically selects whether to parry, dodge or deflect (whatever would give the best result, including all modifiers; all are secondary skills) and makes a defense roll. The makeup of the defense roll is slightly different, depending on how the defender tries to avoid the attack.
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You may also wonder why armor has not been mentioned yet. In our system, armor does not make you more difficult to hit—that's a sensible abstraction for a game being played on paper, but we think we can do better. In The Broken Hourglass, armor provides damage resistance. So Damage Dealt is reduced by a flat amount, provided by armor, shield, or a magical source of protection. Better armors provide more damage resistance. Even a well-landed punch to a platemail-clad guard will not injure her. However, that mundane suit of platemail doesn't provide any protection from air magic, so even a simple air incantation will bypass the armor and stand a good chance of leaving a mark.</blockquote>Sounds good and tactical.
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[MacBone]

I think it's interesting that the AR is affected by the group's tactical abilities, which makes a lot of sense in party-based combat. I wonder how much this factors into the overall success or failure of the AR.

 

[Nog Robbin]

Seems to make sense. I guess the armour type is also affected differently by different weapons and attack types? So a slash from a sword against plate may not do much, but a piercing attack may? Wheras a blow from a mace (crushing/bludgeoning) may do a lot of damage, but less through padded armour?

 

[HotSnack]

The game sounds better and better the more I hear about it, and now I'm really curious about the "soft" skills they'll be later revealing.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Interesting.

 

[denizsi]

I like armor not making you harder to hit. Wouldn't it be better though if it made you somewhat easier to hit, depending on the armor and an armor skill if there is one?

defender automatically selects whether to parry, dodge or deflect (whatever would give the best result, including all modifiers; all are secondary skills)

So, characters always know what's best for them in a given situation, ie. no risk of "bad/wrong choices" in combat ? Nice as is but I think there is some more room for improval.

Considering, or assuming, that player won't be making that decision himself or herself, that might not be bad though, right?

What do you think, should player be able to choose what to do, provided that there are more than one possible advantageous outcome to any of the choices and the possibilities are made known to the player? What about bad judgement, ie. success chances of actions represented slightly twisted based on skill, so higher the skill, better the judgement?

 

[Sarvis]

Ugh. Was sounding promising until I checked out their FAQ. Real time with pause instead of turn based. I hate RTwP.

 

[Nog Robbin]

What do you think, should player be able to choose what to do, provided that there are more than one possible advantageous outcome to any of the choices and the possibilities are made known to the player? What about bad judgement, ie. success chances of actions represented slightly twisted based on skill, so higher the skill, better the judgement?

Good question - after all, a well timed parry or dodge may open up the opponent for a counter attack, though it doesn't sound as if this is taken into account. Instead the computer uses the most defensive option (optimum defense roll) to determine the best course of action. At least that's how I read it. If there are no follow on consequences for a defender to dodge or parry a blow for a subsequent attack I guess it doesn't matter, however, if dodging a blow would leave you in a better strike position then sometimes you may want to attempt a dodge, despite you not being as good at it as parrying. Guess we'll have to wait and see...

I agree with the armour affecting how easy you are to hit also. While it is argued that armour isn't as inflexible as many make out, there can be no argument that moving around unarmoured is going to be significantly easier than when wrapped in something protective and even slightly restrictive. Likewise, lighter and more supple armour would effect your mobility less than heavy and/or rigid armour. Does the game include armour skills? So a novice in heavy armour would be more likely to be hit than a seasoned campaigner who is used to moving in the same armour?

 

[jcompton]

Instead the computer uses the most defensive option (optimum defense roll) to determine the best course of action. At least that's how I read it.

That's correct.

Does the game include armour skills?

Strictly speaking, no--there is no value called "Armor Proficiency" rated from 0-100 (as our other skills/abilities work.)

There are three ways a character can mitigate the encumbrance penalty they might be incurring from armor (aside from "wear lighter armor", that is):

- Raise Carrying, the secondary ability which governs how much bulk-weight a character can carry without penalty.

- Raise Strength, the primary ability which feeds into Carrying.

- Take the Armor Optimization trait, which reduces the effective bulk-weight of armor for the wearer.

 

[sheek]

I don't like the 'single roll to hit' in any RPGs. I think it's mostly a legacy of D&D.

My preferred system is one where you allocate dice rolls to attack, defence, reactions or whatever. Dice rolls represent 'action points'. So you can allocate two dice to an attack or a die to two attacks etc and your opponent does the same - each attempt to strike in a round is dealt with separately meaning you can take out an opponent in one turn if you're lucky. Combine that with some kind of Rolemaster shock/blood loss system and you have realistic combat.

I know why it's not popular in PnP and that's "too many numbers". I thought the main advantage of CRPGs is that you can have as complex a system as you want. So why do they keep serving us up the same generalized d100/d20 tripe?

 

[Jim Kata]

I think it's interesting that the AR is affected by the group's tactical abilities, which makes a lot of sense in party-based combat. I wonder how much this factors into the overall success or failure of the AR.

To me it implies real tactics will have no effect, such as flanking and such. Since it is rtws, I guess we already know the answer to this, though.

 

[sheek]

Yeah sounds like a bad idea. I would prefer that the tactical element indirectly affects AR. Eg that proximity to another party member increases your parry chance from attacks coming in that direction (attacker must be more cautious). Or morale benefits from having allies. If your characters are off fighting in the four corners of the map they are not going to be of help to each other.

 

[Human Shield]

I know why it's not popular in PnP and that's "too many numbers". I thought the main advantage of CRPGs is that you can have as complex a system as you want. So why do they keep serving us up the same generalized d100/d20 tripe?

Agreed, the most complex PnP systems should show up on computer format.

 

[Sarvis]

I don't like the 'single roll to hit' in any RPGs. I think it's mostly a legacy of D&D.

Actually nothing wrong with a single roll, but you need to do it right. For example, the defender should have some ability to prevent the attack, and the damage done should depend on how good the hitroll is rather than on it's own roll. It's kinda funny actually, I got in an argument once at the BioWare forums with some people who kept saying that D&D was great because it kept dice rolls to a minimum. I proposed an alternate system that would cover more of the variables and add realism, and ended up _reducing_ the number of dice rolls by taking away the damage roll.

:shrug:

My preferred system is one where you allocate dice rolls to attack, defence, reactions or whatever. Dice rolls represent 'action points'. So you can allocate two dice to an attack or a die to two attacks etc and your opponent does the same - each attempt to strike in a round is dealt with separately meaning you can take out an opponent in one turn if you're lucky. Combine that with some kind of Rolemaster shock/blood loss system and you have realistic combat.

Could be interesting, but would probably be hard to balance.

I know why it's not popular in PnP and that's "too many numbers". I thought the main advantage of CRPGs is that you can have as complex a system as you want. So why do they keep serving us up the same generalized d100/d20 tripe?

Because it's reminiscent of D&D, and D&D is well known enough to move games off the shelf.

 

[sheek]

Because it's reminiscent of D&D, and D&D is well known enough to move games off the shelf.

Many modern RPG gamers don't know what D&D is and most would not care what the system is... as long as there are few stats and there's lots of hair style and clothes customizations. Also the majority of games make up their own (shitty) rule systems.

 

[denizsi]

If you made an action game that looked unbelievaby good and added in stats that affect nothing at all, I wonder if it would work with morons anyway, like "teh best RPG!". Kind of like the crosswalk buttons in some cities (I've read that majority of cw buttons in some cities, including NYC, have been ineffective since 70s, kept on location just for the placebo effect).

 

[Jim Kata]

If you made an action game that looked unbelievaby good and added in stats that affect nothing at all, I wonder if it would work with morons anyway, like "teh best RPG!". Kind of like the crosswalk buttons in some cities (I've read that majority of cw buttons in some cities, including NYC, have been ineffective since 70s, kept on location just for the placebo effect).

Todd Howard, that you?

Actually oblivion is already like that. The game is the same whether you are level 1 or level 30.