Vault Dweller said:
Don't blame Lucas, blame the idiots who buy this stuff. As for Ewoks and Jar Jar sure they were annoying, but there are plenty of SW stuff that's great or good including some games like TIE fighter, Dark Forces, and Jedi Knight.
You have to blame Lucas, it's *his* enterprise *his* content
it's not like- for example: Peter Jacksons LotR's turned out rated G, Orcs were cute,
Gandalf was Santa Claus and Sauron was played by Pee Wee Herman, we all could say "screw! Jackson, at least we have Tolkien to fall back on, Such is not the case with Star Wars, It Lucas creation, He choose the path, How to market it, how and who he wanted to identify with it.
Funny, you see the jury has been out for me on Star Wars for so long, I have never played any of those games- I still could never get past the Ewoks in 1983.
I used Fallout as an example of a setting that was implemented good and bad, but certainly it couldn't be compared to SW in terms of popularity and brand recognition. My take is just because something is getting dumbed down and ready for mass market doesn't mean that we should forget about everything that was good and ignore what could be done. Take DnD for example and that good vs evil thing that WotC got going in order to market it as a family product, it's stupid, I hate it, I won't buy, but it doesn't mean that DnD sucks overall.
Point being, That the core setting of Fallout was good, it's fallen into bad hands over time
and it *is* what it is. Same goes for D&D, it's deteriorated over time due to corporate mis-managment, not due to its creator
Again Star Wars actual proprietor is the problem, he is and has been in 100% control of the franchise while his intial idea may have had promise- money, sucess, whatever, turned it to shit. While you can ignore all the bad shit, I can't- it's all part of the same thing.
When you were playing KotOR weren't you worried that Jar Jar or Ewoks were going to suddenly appear?, especially when it was made by Bioware...with their *wacky* Canadian sense of humor. I'd be expecting the worst.
Wrong analogy. DS was never good to begin with.
point being- most *any* setting can "be repaired" of it's faults by an individual, but you cannot fix the larger issues you'll never have control over.
thereby, it will always suck-
I'm not very clear on that free ride thing. Can you give me an example of that?
Sure, given what I've mentioned about the franchise in general and the fact it's been developed by Bioware, whom we both know has been seriously lacking in the
"being able to deliver the goods" department..this game should be held to the highest standard possible, from what I read it's a got a few different endings and didn't ship with too many noticable bugs and all of sudden HOLY SHIT- it's game of year???
so here's the question- is the game really "that" good, or is just the competition overall so mediocre that people just forget what a good game is-
Is it being heralded out of some sort of nostalgic desperation for Star Wars?
As Spazmo says "everyone just loves Star Wars" , so is an average game magically now a stellar game just because it's says Star Wars on the box?
You'll have to tell me....but the "profesunhl reviewrz" are acting like somebody reinvented the wheel. Here at RPG Codex I was expecting a bit more criticial analysis.
Why should we care about Lucas' commercialism? How does that relate to KOTOR? It didn't have any Ewoks, Jar-Jar, or any other cute character Lucas is planning to sell next, so what's the point?
Think I answered this above, but in case I wasn't clear, it's all implicity tied together
you cannot play "apples and oranges" with different Star Wars products and then go complain about the shitty state of computer or RPG gaming.
I mean people will just assume rip Atari an new asshole (deservedly so)
as take a drink of water yet somehow LucasArts gets a pass?
If you are talking about Atari screwing ToEE, that's different.
Again, LucasArts wants to make console games they can port to PC for people that don't know any better, they aren't interested in making better PC games,
even thou KotOR seems to be the exception to the rule, remember it came out on Xbox first.
Everyone who's pissed about the shitty state of Fallout, or BIS closing should realize that morons at interplay are all taking there cue from people like LucasArts
"lets make console games, they are geared toward a younger fanbase that are less critical and spend there parents money easier!, PC gamers are an older crowd and hard to please, they have *standards* fuck them" !,
I mentioned Atari simply as another shitty company, they just have a higher negative profile right now...IF you give a shit about indpendent developers getting the chance to make better PC games, you won't give people like LucasArts your money-
Something started to smell long time ago. Like I said the problem lays with the media and consumers not with titles like KOTOR. Is KOTOR a terrible game? No. Should reviewers maintain some integrity? Definitely. But as long as morons are happy and like to read overhyped and overly positive reviews regardless of the flaws, the situation wouldn't change. If there wasn't KOTOR they would have hyped something else, like Bloodmoon or Deus Ex 2: Less is More.
So true, call it like you see it-
I just hope I can point out that the success of this game has larger negative ramifications for those of us that want to see smart, well made adult oriented PC games.
As long as everyone holds the game to the same standard they hold everything else to, that's the best you can hope for-
