Preview Game Zone brings us Bloodlines preview and free fanfic to boot

[Spazmo]

Tags: Troika Games; Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines

<a href=http://www.gamezone.com>Game Zone</a> is #7 in line to <a href=http://www.gamezone.com/gzreviews/p22186_03.htm>preview</a> Bloodlines. But for extra credit, they've thrown in a few paragraphs of narrative! Hooray!<blockquote>One of the starting missions in the Santa Monica area is to find a ghoul named Mercurio. He has been badly beaten, and the item he was entrusted with has been taken. He will ask you to retrieve it. Now, if you go in and call him names, and tell him you will report his incompetence to the prince, when you return, he may be waiting for you with a knife. However, if you cover up his incompetence, he may be able to get you better deals on weapons and other items as you progress into the game.</blockquote>Ooh, a knife. Real shiny, I bet.
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[Volourn]

"He has been badly beaten, and the item he was entrusted with has been taken. He will ask you to retrieve it."

I wonder what the reaction would be if this quest was mentioned in a BIO game preview.


R00fles!

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

I wonder what the reaction would be if this quest was mentioned in a BIO game preview.

Probably not that bad considering the rest of the quest description that you conveniently left out. Were it a simple "go fetch this for me" with no other options available, it would get frowned on, sure. But not just if it was Bio, but anyone. "Yay! Another 'get me this item' quest!"

 

[Seven]

Beat me to the response. Yeah, there's more to it than go fetch. Plus it does show how your decisions can impact the future of your play experience.

 

[Volourn]

"Probably not that bad considering the rest of the quest description that you conveniently left out."

Nonsense. That isn't the quest. That's the result of the quest. the quest is to go fetch his lost item. *yawn*


"Were it a simple "go fetch this for me" with no other options available, it would get frowned on, sure."

Of course, BIo's 'fetch it' quests tend to be more than just fetch x item as well.

That changes nothing except proving that you are as much an embicle as ever.


once again:

"He has been badly beaten, and the item he was entrusted with has been taken. He will ask you to retrieve it."

That's a fetch it quest. there is noa round that simple fact no matter how you try to cover it up.

I repeat: "He will ask you to retrieve it."

Once more for those who can't read:

"HE WILL ASK YOU TO RETRIEVE IT."

That's a fetch quest. It's a hrd cold reality.

The quest itself don't bother me; but the reaction to it. If anyone but troika did that quest, they'd be called on it. Period.


"Plus it does show how your decisions can impact the future of your play experience."

All well and good and that's a positive but it is still a fetch quest.

 

[Seven]

What're you deliberately trying to miss the point; it's not set up as: go fetch, come back, and get reward.

You see, fed-ex/fetch quests are what is described above; this particular quest has more to it than that. Of course you've already conceded that you won't acknowledge that, so what's the point...

 

[errorcode]

That changes nothing except proving that you are as much an embicle as ever.

and he misspells imbecile....priceless

 

[Volourn]

"and he misspells imbecile....priceless"

Cum on. It has to be worth at least a few dollars...

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

*points to Seven's second post*

Stop name calling and get the whole picture, Vol.

Sure, it starts as a fetch this quest, but can turn into a "you didn't gimme so I fuck you up" situation.

There are countless generic fetch this quests in NWN that have no impact like that. You either return the item and get your reward, or you don't and the NPC sits there the entire time waiting for you to return the item with no other consequences coming of it even if you go to them and select every dialogue option BUT the one that gives them the item.

No impact on the game world. The Bloodlines one has impact on the game world. That's what we're pointing out here.

 

[Volourn]

Good for it. It's still a fetch quest.


"Stop name calling"

I will when others do.

 

[Second Chance]

I have to agree with Volourn. There are heaps of "go fetch" item on bioware games that in the end get you lower prices at one store. Is the fact that the ghoul can attack you back such a big difference? I bet no other NPC ever mentions that other ghoul or the fact that you helped/killed him...

It's always the same go fetch quests, wish we could have a good dungeon crawl for a change...

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Errrr.... no. It's not like that.

Getting the lower prices is your reward. But what if you don't return the item? Prices don't go up. Nothing happens. That's the point I'm trying to convey here. The Bloodlines quest mentioned above has consequences if you do not return the item. And, if they plan on pleasing the VTM crowd, it WILL have consequences later in the game.

Like maybe you enter into some deal with the ghoul's progeny and what you did affects how things go. Or let's say later on you find yourself being hunted because you fucked it up.

We'll just have to wait and see about all that, but for now my point is either choice has a significant impact on your game experience.

So what if I don't return that NWN quest item and get lower prices? Not like the lower prices are anything to write home about anyways.

 

[Kamaz]

Well, for me its totally unimportant wheather this is fetchme quest or not. Main quest in Fallout was to bring Waterchip - fetchme quest. But Fallout was much more superior than BG or BG2 - I guess you have to admit that. So, who cares is it fedex quest or not, the game is good and that is everything that counts here.

 

[Volourn]

"But Fallout was much more superior than BG or BG2 - I guess you have to admit that."

LOL No, I don't. I'd admit they're about equal; but two very different reasons.

 

[dojoteef]

"But Fallout was much more superior than BG or BG2 - I guess you have to admit that."

LOL No, I don't. I'd admit they're about equal; but two very different reasons.

I'm just curious, but what did you like about BG and BG2 that makes you say they are roughly equal in quality to Fallout? What are these two very different reasons.

I personally thought the BG series of games were good games (I bought them and their expansions), but I did enjoy Fallout much more than the BG series. I felt that I had more freedom to roleplay in Fallout. It seemed less intent on being an "action" RPG than the BGs.

 

[Volourn]

"I'm just curious, but what did you like about BG and BG2 that makes you say they are roughly equal in quality to Fallout? What are these two very different reasons."

Fallout had far greater freedom, your choices matter more in a much more 'tangible' way, and it's always nice to shoot people with guns.

BG has a better, more personal story that wasn't simply a large 'fetch it' quest, and much more advanced npcs, and it's always nice to play a dwarf who wacks people with a big bad axe.

 

[Jora]

Lenard on fed ex quests:

We have alot of different types of quests in Bloodlines, involving such things as following clues, gathering information, finding explosives to blow up a warehouse (oops, a little too specific there), killing things and people for fun and profit, etc. The most ironic thing about the whole 'fed ex' thing is that I remember playing a fairly successful RPG (that shall remain nameless) right after reading a review of it that said there were virtually no fed ex quests in it at all, and the first thing I needed to do was to find something for someone and bring it back to them. If that's not a fed ex quest, then I could unequivocally state without reservation that we have absolutely no fed ex quests in Bloodlines :D .

http://vnboards.ign.com/Bloodlines_Inn/b22439/77347879/p2/?47

So they seem to at least be aware that making too many fed ex quests might not be a good idea. I loved the quests in Arcanum (the gnome conspiracy, the peace negotiations between Caladon and Tarant, the Stillwater Giant quest etc.) but there wasn't a single quest in TToEE that I can claim to have really enjoyed.

 

[dojoteef]

BG has a better, more personal story that wasn't simply a large 'fetch it' quest, and much more advanced npcs, and it's always nice to play a dwarf who wacks people with a big bad axe.

I have a slightly opposite perspective on the BG series of stories. I find them to be too contrived and very dispassionate. It's the same type of story rehashed over and over. While sometimes it's possible to create an amazing story using the same mold, I don't think BG did that. In fact my favorite fantasy book series The Wheel of Time is that same type of story. The most unlikely of people at the beginning of the story turns out to be a powerful person who has to save the world from evil. What makes the story good though is the characterizations and the depth of culture that he imbues the people with. BG just didn't do that for me.

Instead I find it refreshing when a unique story is told such as PS:T or Fallout. They tend to be much different than focusing on how powerful you're character has to become in order to overcome all odds. And I don't think the Fallout story can be characterized as just some big 'fetch it' story. It's much more personal. Your character needs to do it in order to save those people he cares for (and possibly himself as well). Despite the fact that the Vault needs the waterchip, that doesn't demean the story in my opinion.

Some very good stories have been told that you would essentially call fetch it stories. One good example is Saving Private Ryan. If you think about it the movie is just that. Fetching Private Ryan from the battlefield, but it turns out to be much much more. So I think calling Fallout just a big fetch story to be an understatement.

Though I admit playing as a dwarf with a big axe is at times very fun :D

 

[Volourn]

"The most unlikely of people at the beginning of the story turns out to be a powerful person who has to save the world from evil."

That isn't BG's story though.


"Instead I find it refreshing when a unique story is told such as PS:T or Fallout."

While PST's story is great, and Fallout's solid neither one is n example of an unique one. Sorry.

 

[Jed]

Yeah, and if you think about it, The Lord of the Rings is actually just one big "anti-fetch it" quest. Hmmm...

Personally, I would draw a distinction between a "fetch it" and a "fed-ex" quest. In a "fed-ex" quest, you go get something and bring it back or take it to another NPC, reward (cash or loot and/or XP) on delivery. Nothing else. No consequence if you don't deliver. BioWare games are full of these.

A "fetch it" quest can be cool and worthwhile if done right: Options to take the item and use it yourself, sell it to someone else other than intended for a higher price, espionage, blackmail, ransom, etc. Especially if there are rival factions involved. And there should always be a consequence for non-delivery: hostility or distrust from the NPC that gave you the quest, police or mercenaries hunt you down, or perhaps your reputation as a dependable courier decreases to the point that some of the more rewarding "fetch its" become unavailable to you, or the rewards decrease in general, or maybe no one will even trust you enough to do business with you. Lastly, for some (but not all) of the quests, there should be a deadline involved.

Sorry all these distinctions will go over your head, Volourn. I know your binary brain can't handle subtlety, but I hope others here will get something out of this post.

 

[Volourn]

"Personally, I would draw a distinction between a "fetch it" and a "fed-ex" quest. In a "fed-ex" quest, you go get something and bring it back or take it to another NPC, reward (cash or loot and/or XP) on delivery. Nothing else. No consequence if you don't deliver. BioWare games are full of these."

There's also a lot of fetch it quests in in BIo games too. Next.

There's also a lot of fex ex quests in Troika games. Next.

Stop being a Troika fanboy.

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Stop being a Troika fanboy.

No.


Next!

 

[Volourn]

LOL

You win.

 

[whitemithrandir]

Actually... Let's take Volourn's favorite game: NWN.

1. Fetch the waterdavian creatures.
Does it count as "fed ex"? Yes, it is. Is it a linear "fed ex"? Yes it is. Can you complete the game without doing this "fed ex" quest? Surely.... not. Henceforth, this quest is a good example of "fed ex" gone wrong, since it destroys the whole illusion of freedom in the RPG.

Or how about KOTOR?

2. Find the starmaps. Same logic as above, linearity masked in the pseudo-freedom of choosing the order of planets to visit.

Let's visit good ol' fallout 2:

3. Find the GECK. Is it fed-ex? Oh yes, most definitely. Does it infringe upon the freedom aspects of the game? No.

You see, Volo-san, you're making the generalization that all fed-ex quests are bad, which is simply not true. Fed-ex quests aren't, in their ground state, more interesting nor less interesting than other types of quests, such as killing rats in the basement. It all depends on the dev's spin on the quest and how it relates to the game as a whole. Bioware's got a sad history of doing this, this you cannot deny.