Growlanser

[SCO]

edit: wayfarer of time for the PSP

This is a insanely long game isn't it. Surprisingly interesting combat scenarios at times, though i think that phase is over now (overlooted ^__^)

Also 50+ endings? What they were thinking, though most of them are just variations on what girlfriend/boy you dated and choose at the end so it's not like it's imperative to see them.

Lots of dumb backtracking, though probably not as much as Legend of Heroes.

But the most bizarre design is that it uses inventory 'key items' as items to be used out in the gameworld (on other npcs mostly) without really having the best interface for it. For instance, unlike adventure games/sophisticated rpgs there is no real quest journal, and the way it is usable (go out into a separate screen to use the item while standing in front of someone) is really not very direct. The furlough system is also weirdly fail-prone. I thought they were trying for re-playability but this feels like a example of how C&C can actually make a game worse because the choices are not isolated from other choices making a murky haze of narrative (have i flattered this broad enough to get into her pants now or the game is waiting for a trigger later for more stuff?).

Still, it's a quite interesting classical jrpg, also good to see that invisible random encounters are still dead, fuck that shit.

 

[abnaxus]

Isn't this series half dating sim?

 

[SCO]

Yep. Only not really, it's just a jrpg with 'dating sim' (quests) bolted on top; which they use to multiply the endings. Good ending, less good ending, bad ending, evil ending 1, evil ending 2, route-1 20 lovers endings, route-2 20 lovers endings, forever alone ending, etc. In fact, besides the 2 routes and evil/good stuff, i probably should call them 'epilogues' not endings.

Also, forgot, ridiculous anime big breast/occasional furry character design of course, but no sex scenes or anything (though there is disturbing shit there, like the furry pedophilia implied in one of the possible 'girlfriends' that was obviously added at the last moment for the furry lobby since there is no trace of the species in the gameworld).

 

[Karmapowered]

Of the 5 (6?) tomes of the Growlanser series, the 4th one is indeed the only one worth mentioning/discussing.

THE GREAT

The ring/skill system. While it is fairly grindy (but not mind-numbingly so), it gives players food for thought on how they wish to plan out their character progression and prioritize tactics to be used in the battles to come. It's quite unique, and I suspect LoH:TiTS to have copied part of it. I wouldn't mind to see it used again in other games.

THE GOOD

Boss battles. Some of them are quite demanding, or hard to figure out, as they should be. More often than not, they require clever positioning and use of skills. For example, part of your team may collect loot inside chests that are only accessible during combat, while the other part holds the enemies at bay. Don't expect being able to stand in front of bosses spamming your DBZ-style combos to win.

THE REST

I didn't like the art style. I didn't like the horrendous English transcription (I don't dare to call it a translation) and voice-acting (playing with the undubbed version of the game is advised). I didn't like that in some (and too many) mandatory missions I had to "rescue" stupid-ass NPCs with only suicide on their mind. This one seems to be a trend in jRPGs of that age (see Langrisser, Shining Force), which unfortunately leads to those missions being sometimes won thanks to a more favorable RNG while only player skills/tactics should matter.

As a story-fag, I didn't like any of the NPCs, each of them coming with their own despicable and ultra-clichéd personalities, except maybe the mercenary brute (can't remember his name atm) and the countess (which proved to be the main asset of my team, even better than the MC, since faster moving). I didn't like that the game *forced* me to play my team as some goody two-shoes idiots (even on the "evil" path, hello Nippon Bioware 1), enduring various degrees of verbal abuse in front of aforementioned NPCs, when I would have just punched them in the face if I could. To give you a short example, the (adoptive) family of the MC gets slaughtered early in the game by some army types, and the MC captured. During the interrogation that follows, the player has the choice to join the army ("are you seriously suggesting I join your goons to help you right after killing my family ?") or... join the army (since the "NO" dialog option is basically a fake one, hello Nippon Bioware 2).

Yes, it has dating sim elements, but to be fair, these are tame, not the focus of the game (except in which ending you get) and can be largely skipped. The familiar system was mildly interesting, since it provides bonuses if you finish your missions with "golden" ("complete", instead of "cleared") status, which is harder to achieve, and there is a way to lose your familiar about mid-game if you don't pay attention.

As SCO said, the game has its fair share of moments during which it manages to unnecessarily confuse the player. Instead of checking for the presence of an item in the inventory of the MC to initiate or fulfill a quest, the player has to actually use that item from within a menu, without any hint of the game at which time it should be used. So you have the option to play the game with a guide (which I loathe) or risk permanently screwing parts of it, should you miss a crucial event.

IS IT WORTH PLAYING ?

In spite of all its flaws, I would say that the game is worth an attempt if you are a player of the completionist type and *if* you are able to make abstraction of the all the ultra-clichéd animu that the Growlanser fans are so fond of (especially the NA ones it seems, according to the Atlus boards). The interesting gameplay can make up for it, and be rewarding for some players like me, but it's probable that it won't be the cup of tea of the majority of the Codexians. If you plan on fast-forwarding the text, playing with a guide is recommended, so that you don't miss on the opportunities at better gear or NPCs to recruit. Finally, avoid the rest of the Growlanser series like the plague. They are even worse in their clichés, with a gameplay that is largely inferior to this one.

All in all, I think there are better options if you're interested in jRPGs with decent/good gameplay.

 

[yes plz]

While Wayfarer of Time does probably have the best gameplay (though, the ring system and battle system only change slightly throughout the series, with it being pretty uniform and only being slightly improved/refined with each new iteration), I actually prefer 2 and 3 to it (localized into English by Working Designs as part of a pack called Growlanser Generations). I just thought Wayfarer went on for way too long (I think it's nearly a 60 hour game if you do everything), with the gameplay becoming rather stale two-thirds of the way through and the bland cast and story becoming unbearable.

As for Generations, GL2 (known as The Sense of Justice) has a branching plot with at least three completely unique branches (one of which is only accessible if you did perfectly during the first half-dozen or so missions), all of which also have variations to them depending on your choices throughout their story and how well you do during the missions (it's fairly easy to botch the MC's original goal of becoming a highly ranked knight by not perfectly completing most of your missions). The cast and story aren't anything special, though at least they aren't as horrible as Wayfarer of Time's (except for one of GL2's party members, Hans... he can go die in a fucking fire).

GL3 (Dual Darkness) is more of a standard JRPG, with a bigger focus on exploring towns and (mostly randomly generated) dungeons. Unlike the GL2, it doesn't have a branching plot, though one neat thing it does is make it so that there aren't really any truly unwinnable fights in the game; while there are a couple that feel like they're impossible, you actually can win and the game will acknowledge it instead of pretending you failed. For storyfaginess, it's probably the best of the series - it's cast and story are fairly decent (though, of course, you have to have a high tolerance of weeboo animu crap to enjoy it, though it isn't as bad as all the others in that regard, even its character designs are toned down compared to the likes of Heritage of War and Wayfarer of Time).

Sadly, while Working Designs provides great localized scripts for the games, their English VOs are pretty bad, usually laughably so. GL2 is easily the worst of the two when it comes to English voice acting but neither are anywhere near great. For those looking to emulate them, PCSX2 plays them fairly well, though last time I tried them they liked to randomly freeze when attempting to save or load, but with the use of save states it wasn't a huge problem.

Oh, and there's Heritage of War. I found it to be fucking horrible. It's extremely dull and slow moving, with easily the worst cast of characters and story (which doesn't even become anywhere close to interesting until the final hours because it was the first part of a two part game... and we never got the second part). If you love Growlanser's gameplay you might be able to find some enjoyment in it but I wouldn't recommend picking it up.

I'd probably rank the English released ones as: Dual Darkness > Sense of Justice > Wayfarer of Time > Heritage of war. I've heard the first game in the series is the best for storyfags but we never got it, though I believe there is a full script translation out there, just nobody's ever bothered to hack the game and insert it.

As for the dating system, generally in Growlanser it's more... helping to complete character x's story arc over the other characters than actually dating, at which point by the end character x will realize she wuvs the MC so vewy much.

 

[Karmapowered]

Being the storyfag that I am, and relatively tolerant even towards "excessive" jRPGs, I wanted to play the series for both the gameplay and story.

I started with the 5th, but had to stop. Then continued with the 2nd/3rd ("Generations" pack), but had to stop again. I couldn't bring it on me to proceed. Finally, I was told the 4th one was the best one gameplay-wise, gave the series another chance and was rather pleasantly surprised (perhaps in contrast to all the previous suffering).

Just to be accurate (EDIT: and we might disagree here), the gameplay (ring/skills system) in the 5th has little or nothing to do with the one of Wayfarer (which is unique in the series). To me, 5th = a reset to the system of the 2nd/3rd game. I still have no clue why they chose to dumb down what in my mind made the strongest asset of their game.

 

[yes plz]

Right, Heritage of War is quite different. I thought it had the ring system but looking up a walkthrough, it replaces it with an ability point system (and some sort of plate connecting system) or some such. Guess I hated it enough to block most of it from memory. I don't know why they ditched a system that worked pretty well.

And, yeah, the Growlanser as a whole is a fairly average JRPG series. Their stories and characters range somewhere between horribly bland and okay, and the gameplay is usually interesting and somewhat enjoyable, though generally not enough to sustain their incredible length. I think their biggest problem is that they tend to play it safe and not be particularly ambitious; they're pretty much something you play when you want a JRPG but have played through everything else, or at least all the usual suspects.

 

[TigerKnee]

Whoa all these people hating on Satoshi Urushiha's art.

Anyway, I never particularly liked this series. I preferred 2 because it was more in the SRPG vein rather than the JRPG vein, but that's just me. 4 would be the next best one but that's because the rest of the series is snooze.

Growlanser's just way inferior to Langrisser IMO.

 

[Coriolanus]

How do I get Wayfarer to work on PPSSPP? My fonts are fucked.

 

[SCO]

Put the official PSP fonts into the .ppsspp/ms0/font dir (i think, something like that).

The official fonts you must find by your own effort... somewhere. Works for other games too. For instance, it's the only way to play JeanneD'Arc on both emulators (still broken on ppsspp though).

 

[Coriolanus]

Oh, ty.