Review KotOR sweet nothings at Game Revolution

[Saint_Proverbius]

Tags: Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic

<A href="http://www.game-revolution.com/">Game Revolution</a> has posted <A href="http://www.game-revolution.com/games/pc/rpg/star_wars_kotor.htm">their review</A> of <A href="http://www.swkotor.com">Knights of the Old Republic</a>, giving it an <b>A-</b> score. Here's a clip:
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<blockquote>KOTOR is truly epic in scope as well, spanning seven planets you can visit using your own starship, the Ebon Hawk (which for some reason, is not black). Bioware claims KOTOR has 40 hours of gameplay, but I?ve played it far longer than that. Those guys must have been rushing through as fast as they could.
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Which, by the way, is the wrong way to play KOTOR. There are dozens of side quests you might choose to undertake. There are mini-games here as well, like Swoopbike racing, arena fighting, or a collectable gambling card game called Pazaak. There's more extra stuff here than you can shake a light saber at. </blockquote>
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Must be playing lots and lots of pazaak and swoop races then, because I really can't see it taking <i>far longer</i> than 40 hours to get through this doing all you can get sticking to the CRPG quests and things.
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Spotted this at <A href="http://www.bluesnews.com">Blue's News</a>.

 

[Volourn]

Yup, it took me just over 40 hours taking my sweet time without too much of that extra junk. Also, he forgets to note, that BIO ssays its 30-50 hours on your first time through. BIO has actually beaten it in less than 10 hours during testing (skipping all dialogue, cutscense, adn only doings that absolutely need to be done to finish game).

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Yup, it took me just over 40 hours taking my sweet time without too much of that extra junk. Also, he forgets to note, that BIO ssays its 30-50 hours on your first time through. BIO has actually beaten it in less than 10 hours during testing (skipping all dialogue, cutscense, adn only doings that absolutely need to be done to finish game).

I did the first game in 29 hours, 15 or so minutes. That's what the save game lists as the time just before I spanked Malek. My second game was 24 hours, 47 minutes before Malek.

I've even glanced through some walk throughs on KotOR this morning to see if I missed anything. I really didn't miss too much the first time through except the dark side only character stuff, and didn't miss much the second time just doing the dark side stuff.

 

[HanoverF]

Considering all the bugs I have a hard time believing Bio played it more then ten hours total during testing...

 

[Sol Invictus]

Considering all the bugs I have a hard time believing Bio played it more then ten hours total during testing...

Are you supposed to zing every KOTOR related thread with the exact same complaint?

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Too funny!

 

[Rosh]

Considering all the bugs I have a hard time believing Bio played it more then ten hours total during testing...

Are you supposed to zing every KOTOR related thread with the exact same complaint?

Oddly enough, it almost sounds like a compliment as well.

 

[Sol Invictus]

Yeah, considering the fact that it shut off my PCI sockets and forced a cold restart (power off from main). How the fuck do you miss something like that?

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Didn't NWN have the exact same problem with the same intel chipset motherboards?

 

[JanC]

How about considering that some people take longer than others to complete games? I usually take twice the time it says on the box. Maybe I'm crap, or maybe I just take my time. Who knows? I'm looking forwards to 80 hours of KOTOR fun when I can get my computer working again!

 

[triCritical]

It took me 7 hours to get off Taris, what does that extrapolate to?

 

[Vault Dweller]

I'd say no more then 25 hrs in total, Tri

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

It took me 7 hours to get off Taris, what does that extrapolate to?

20-25, since it's always taken me longer than 7 hours to get off Taris.

 

[triCritical]

Well Dantooine sure feels like it will take a long time and has been for the most part a whole lot less fun.

* The music seems ripped off from Wizardry 8.
* The whole becoming a Jedi was extremely dissapointing. Mostly because there is very limited choice due to the non-existing multi-classing supposedly key to the D20. Not to mention getting ripped by the other Jedi and the councel for killing that chick. LETS NOT FORGET THAT MY CHARACTER IN NO WAY COULD HAVE PURSUADED HER, SINCE THE LACK OF MULT-CLASSING DOES NOT ALLOW ME TO ROLEPLAY A DIPLO-SOLDIER!!!!
* The quest are a lot more one dimensional so far. Kill and kill a little bit to introduce other options. It seems like it would be a lot more difficult for non-melee type of characters.
* Finally the quest themselves feel a lot more dull.
* I just was told that I screwed up in deliberating a case to find a murderer because I caught the murderer, and let the attempted murderer go. Considering I was told to find the murderer and not an attempted murderer I don't know why I screwed up. And considering I knew the outcome from the beginning it was painful going through that whole process.

Hopefully this rut is temporary.

 

[krathax]

Hmm, maybe I am slow or a very inefficient RPG player, but I have 35+ hours into KOTOR and I have not played a lick of the card game or swoop racing other than the plot demanded. Perhaps some ppl just jam real good through games, I tend to stop, look around and actually read what NPCs are saying.

Krathax

 

[Volourn]

Huh? Tri? You could very well play a dimplo-solider., I sure was able to; and I wasurely able to persuade. Guess what, it's your own fault for not being able to build a character who could not complete that quest without killing her.

As for the trial; well; I dunno; but allowing an attempted murderer go is not a good thing. Don't worry; I let one of them go too. Heh. As for killing being the only solution on the planet - no more than any oher planet. As for the quests being dull; or the the music being ripped off; meh for the quest ; and music; I didn't play Wuzardy 8 so i can't compare.

 

[triCritical]

Huh? Tri? You could very well play a dimplo-solider., I sure was able to; and I wasurely able to persuade. Guess what, it's your own fault for not being able to build a character who could not complete that quest without killing her.

MY FAULT!

Whose to say that I wanted not to kill her. The problem is that Bioware obviously intended for the player to not kill her, and that is just not possible for all characters. It just shows that they just aint that good at making the open ended quest. Not as good as Troika at least (BTW, I just said that to piss volourn off).

The nerve of people to say that it is my fault, I mean you really have to have some serious sac to say something like that. BTW the only way for a soldier to be able to get persuade, at least enough to persuade her, is to have a Int of 12. And IMHO, why would a character that smart be a soldier? HOWS THAT FOR ROELPLAYINGE!

As for the trial; well; I dunno; but allowing an attempted murderer go is not a good thing. Don't worry; I let one of them go too. Heh.

The guy wants me to choose who murdered him, and its pretty damn obvious from the beginning. I did my job, they just didn't right a good puzzle, simple as that. Look if you are on trial for murder, and find out about bank fraud, you can't convict the guy of bank fraud if he is indeed guilty of murder in the same case. I mean its kind of stupid. It tries to teach you some big jedi lesson, but in the end its juvenile.

As for killing being the only solution on the planet - no more than any oher planet. As for the quests being dull; or the the music being ripped off; meh for the quest ; and music; I didn't play Wuzardy 8 so i can't compare.

I found that on Taris, I could hack droids and computers, which minimized the killing considerably. This seems to be more like NWN in design, which is really a shame. As for the rest of my complaints. Its just a let down from Taris, which I really liked.

 

[Volourn]

1. I thought that everything shouldn't be possible with every character. You can still complete the quest just not in the "ideal" way. The quest is open ended. For starters you can show her that she's not acting "properly' via persuade; or just kill her. Either way; you complete the quest. It's better than being forced to kill her.

What does intelligence have to do with persuadw hich is charisma based? Also, I'd say to use weapons skillfully, and the various things; a soldier should at least be some what intelligent.

It is a "big jedi lesson". Firts off, it's not an "official" trial; second, it teaches you that the obvious answer isn't always the right one. Heck, this si the second example where you can not compete a quest perfectly in KOTRO and still complete it. That's a good thing, imo.

There's only quest on Datooine that forces you into mindless killing (not counting randome encounters with the "animals' on the planet which you can void by staying away from them, and that's the Mandolians. The others either have the possibility of very little combatt (the two families); or none at all (the trial & the droid). Seriously, you are overreacting.

Other than the random monster s; there's really not that much fighting on the planet. heck, the Sewers, and the random gang attacks alone on Taris have more...

As for liking it more or less; I can't argue that much.

 

[triCritical]

1. I thought that everything shouldn't be possible with every character. You can still complete the quest just not in the "ideal" way. The quest is open ended. For starters you can show her that she's not acting "properly' via persuade; or just kill her. Either way; you complete the quest. It's better than being forced to kill her.

It would all be fine if just about every jedi leading up to the quest didn't tell you that the correct way of doing things is to convert the dark side to the light. Its a copout, basically they tell you what you need to do, and since not all characters can do it you have to kill her. The caveat being if you kill her they tell you that you fucked up! In Arcanum their are several ways to see Gilbert Bates, each very different and not so obvious. This KotOR quest is essentially boolean, with only one correct solution, persuade. Its just bad open ended design.

What does intelligence have to do with persuadw hich is charisma based? Also, I'd say to use weapons skillfully, and the various things; a soldier should at least be some what intelligent.

You will not be able to put skill points into persuade if you are a soldier and don't have a least an Int of 12, because its a cross class skill. I don't know is KotOR like ToEE in that it lets you put in half points. I don't remember seeing adjusment arrows for my crossclass skills after the first level.

When my dad was drafted, they all had to take IQ test, the smart ones like my dad didn't go to NAM.

It is a "big jedi lesson". Firts off, it's not an "official" trial; second, it teaches you that the obvious answer isn't always the right one. Heck, this si the second example where you can not compete a quest perfectly in KOTRO and still complete it. That's a good thing, imo.

The obvious answer points to Rickard, that is why you have to go to that whole drawn out thing about lie, motive and what not. The point is they try to fool you and its pretty obvious who actually did it. Its obvious from the initial info they give you the one that looks more innocent is actually the killer. I was right for the onset.

Second, just because the killer says the other guy was going to try as well, does not mean he actually was. What is this Minority Report?

There's only quest on Datooine that forces you into mindless killing (not counting randome encounters with the "animals' on the planet which you can void by staying away from them, and that's the Mandolians. The others either have the possibility of very little combatt (the two families); or none at all (the trial & the droid).

You can avoid them if you stealth solo, but then you might not have enough fire power for the fights, which IMO is a huge drawback to their stealth system. Other then stealth there is no sure fire way to avoid the hounds, which is pretty stupid, and they are pretty tough. Furthermore, to get to the other quest you have to go through the hounds, so there goes that idea.

Other than the random monster s; there's really not that much fighting on the planet. heck, the Sewers, and the random gang attacks alone on Taris have more...

Random gang attacks to not even comare to the hounds. And the sewers did have a lot fighting and were definately the worst part of TARIS, and one of the most implausable sub-plots and stories. Fortunately, I found the other aspects of Taris greatly outweighed this con.

 

[Volourn]

1. Sad. Not all characters are capable of persuading her she's mistaken in what she has done; or that what she has done is forgivebale. How horrible.

2. You can't do have a skill point; but you can save skill points for the enxt elevl for when you do. That's what i did when I was a soldier. Worked out fine for me. Plus, by the time you reach her you'll probably have one level of jedi so there's at leats one more point.

3. True. This is surely acase of a twist for the sake of a twist and that's why i fell for it just like you. Still, still a nice quest, nontheless.

4. The hounds only charge you if you get to close 9I presume it's close to aspot range/check. I never found them that hard. easy in fact. Oh well..

5. Go gangs go!

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

Thought I would add my two cents on this whole Jaheera thing. From what I've heard, nothing got removed from the Xbox version when they brought it to PC. If that is the case, then you CAN persuade her back to the light side even without the persuade skill. Look at your dialogue options and choose wisely. I managed to get it right after a couple of tries and did bring her over without using persuade. As a bonus, you get more lightside points and experience doing it that way. It took a couple of tries to get it right though, but it CAN be done. At least in the Xbox version. You just have to say the right things.

 

[Volourn]

Otaku to the rescue.. I never knew that as I DID use the persuade skill...

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

I lured her back to the light without using persaude either, the first time I tried. GO ME!

Regardless, allowing multiclassing would have been a hell of a lot better overall.

 

[Vault Dweller]

LETS NOT FORGET THAT MY CHARACTER IN NO WAY COULD HAVE PURSUADED HER, SINCE THE LACK OF MULT-CLASSING DOES NOT ALLOW ME TO ROLEPLAY A DIPLO-SOLDIER!!!!

Wanna hear something funny? There are lines that always roll [success] even if you have zero persuasion, and there are lines that still allow you to persuade even if you failed all the checks. Suffice to say, if it's important you can always be persuasive no matter what you skill is. It's a Bio game after all. :wink: They wouldn't let silly things like stats and skills to stop you from having fun

Hopefully this rut is temporary.

Nope, eagerly awaiting for more rants

 

[Volourn]

I agree with that SP, and have said as much.