Mask of the Betrayer '15

[Ivan]

cast cunning eagle/fox to increase my diplomacy and intimidation. convinced wizard was a bad move.

 

[Seari]

I like taking my time in exploring an area, not having to rush because of a stupid mechanic.

 

[Seari]

Also going infront of Mulsantir just to feed on spirits every time you're low is fucking boring.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I like taking my time in exploring an area, not having to rush because of a stupid mechanic.

You can. Exploring an area won't do much to the Spirit meter, you really have to think about it when travelling.

 

[Stompa]

I like taking my time in exploring an area, not having to rush because of a stupid mechanic.

You don't need to fucking rush anything, just supress your hunger if it bothers you so much. Couple of supresses and spirit meter slows down to a crawl, giving you enough time to do everything you want. If you don't want to do that, deal with consequences of your choice.

 

[Black]

I see a lot of idiots here defending the Spirit Eater thing. That was by far the worst mechanic I ever seen in any RPG I played.

Are you one of those pro games journos who got buttblasted by a simple mechanic?

 

[Average Manatee]

The Spirit-Meter thingy

I have to mention the spirit meter because it was criticized in every review for being confusing, hard, and just not fun. Well, guess what? It's a pretty damn good feature and an excellent moron indicator. If you failed to understand this feature, odds are you’re a fucking moron. Sad, but true. Let's blame the clearly failed education system and the leniency toward degenerates in your homeland.

Anyway, a handy guide to the spirit-meter.

The game revolves around your condition. Some say it’s a curse, some say it’s a gift. You are a spirit-eater. You consume spirits and sometimes souls (if you choose the evil path). Game mechanics-wise, your condition is represented via two meters: % level of your spirit energy (100% is good, 0% is dead) and your hunger level. The higher your hunger level is, the faster the spirit energy level drops. The lower your spirit energy level is, the heavier your stat penalties are.

- STAT PENALTIES?!! WHAT THE FUCK?!!! THIS GAEM SUCKS!!!!

Now that you understand the basic idea, here are the two basic paths the game offers.

The good path: You consider your affliction a curse. You suppress your hunger, thus significantly slowing your need to feed. Eventually you acquire “good” feats like Eternal Rest, which allows you to grant rest to undead spirits and restores your spirit energy without increasing your hunger. Soon (very soon) your hunger is pretty much at zero and you focus on the rest of the game.

The evil path: You realize that you've been given a power and that only a fool would give it up. You devour spirits and eventually learn to devour souls. You gain very powerful spirit essences (to craft VERY powerful items) this way and once you fully unleash your gift, you gain significant combat bonuses.

So, what does it all mean? It means that if you are a good person, you can pretty much ignore this feature by suppressing your hunger and enjoy what it adds to the dialogues. If you are an evil bastard, you can "go with the flow" and become a powerful being through the special spirit essences, feats, and abilities. However, all that power - and that's the brilliant part - comes with a price. You must constantly look for spirits to feed on to stay alive. Compare that to Knights of the Old Republic, for example, where the difference between good and evil is purely cosmetic as both sides are equally balances and it doesn't cost you anything to join the Dark Side.

The only problem with the spirit meter is the alignment adjustments. Whenever you make a spirit system related choice, you gain a few alignment points, becoming more Lawful, for example. Since the DnD alignment system is a subject to many interpretations, some players would disagree with how the spirit system handles your alignment. I don't think it's a big deal, to be honest, but if you care a lot about this aspect, I suggested getting a mod that can remove and change the adjustment to fit your own alignment beliefs.

Also it bears mentioning that time only really passed while traveling and resting. Opening chests and standing around pondering whether the +5 sword of bumfucking was better than a +6 sword of shitpounding did not.

 

[Ivan]

I don't know what the fuck you guys are talking about...but...I'm getting raped by Red Wizards. One my lightning bolts does minimal damage. What the fuck am I doing wrong. I lowered it to ez and i'm still getting hammered.

I was hoping I could breeze thru the shit combat and get to the story bits, like in Torment.

 

[Average Manatee]

What's your build and stats?

MotB is an easy game, but that's assuming you know D&D. In general direct damage spells are mediocre in D&D, and if the enemy can make their saving throw (watch what your spell targets and know which classes get what saving throws) direct damage spells are pathetic unless you like resting every encounter. Lightning Bolt in particular is shit because it caps out at level 10 IIRC (10d6 damage), which is just a joke

 

[hoverdog]

against red wizards use Lesser/Great Missile Storm (you can also fill higher level slots with increased/maximized versions of it).

 

[Deleted member 7219]

The Spirit-Meter thingy

I have to mention the spirit meter because it was criticized in every review for being confusing, hard, and just not fun. Well, guess what? It's a pretty damn good feature and an excellent moron indicator. If you failed to understand this feature, odds are you’re a fucking moron. Sad, but true. Let's blame the clearly failed education system and the leniency toward degenerates in your homeland.

Anyway, a handy guide to the spirit-meter.

The game revolves around your condition. Some say it’s a curse, some say it’s a gift. You are a spirit-eater. You consume spirits and sometimes souls (if you choose the evil path). Game mechanics-wise, your condition is represented via two meters: % level of your spirit energy (100% is good, 0% is dead) and your hunger level. The higher your hunger level is, the faster the spirit energy level drops. The lower your spirit energy level is, the heavier your stat penalties are.

- STAT PENALTIES?!! WHAT THE FUCK?!!! THIS GAEM SUCKS!!!!

Now that you understand the basic idea, here are the two basic paths the game offers.

The good path: You consider your affliction a curse. You suppress your hunger, thus significantly slowing your need to feed. Eventually you acquire “good” feats like Eternal Rest, which allows you to grant rest to undead spirits and restores your spirit energy without increasing your hunger. Soon (very soon) your hunger is pretty much at zero and you focus on the rest of the game.

The evil path: You realize that you've been given a power and that only a fool would give it up. You devour spirits and eventually learn to devour souls. You gain very powerful spirit essences (to craft VERY powerful items) this way and once you fully unleash your gift, you gain significant combat bonuses.

So, what does it all mean? It means that if you are a good person, you can pretty much ignore this feature by suppressing your hunger and enjoy what it adds to the dialogues. If you are an evil bastard, you can "go with the flow" and become a powerful being through the special spirit essences, feats, and abilities. However, all that power - and that's the brilliant part - comes with a price. You must constantly look for spirits to feed on to stay alive. Compare that to Knights of the Old Republic, for example, where the difference between good and evil is purely cosmetic as both sides are equally balances and it doesn't cost you anything to join the Dark Side.

The only problem with the spirit meter is the alignment adjustments. Whenever you make a spirit system related choice, you gain a few alignment points, becoming more Lawful, for example. Since the DnD alignment system is a subject to many interpretations, some players would disagree with how the spirit system handles your alignment. I don't think it's a big deal, to be honest, but if you care a lot about this aspect, I suggested getting a mod that can remove and change the adjustment to fit your own alignment beliefs.

Also it bears mentioning that time only really passed while traveling and resting. Opening chests and standing around pondering whether the +5 sword of bumfucking was better than a +6 sword of shitpounding did not.

VD gets it right, as usual (at least when it comes to gaming).

Dumbfuck mainstream reviewers harped on about not being able to explore because of the spirit eater, and it just isn't true. I didn't expect to see that lie repeated on the Codex.

 

[Andkat]

Do the Red Wizards have any protective buffs on them? Try throwing a dispel magic or a spell breach onto them before unloading with your offensive spells.

Given the starting level of your character in MotB, lightning bolt should also be one of your weaker spells (given that you start at a level high enough to cast level 8 or 9 spells I think?). Additionally, what is your Int and do you have any spell focus feats in evocation? If your spell DCs are too low (Int bonus adds to your spell DCs), then the wizards might just be making a lot of their reflex saves for spell damage. Base spell level also factors into these DCs, so a chain lightning or a delay blast fireball (level 7 spells IIRC) is intrinsically harder to dodge than a lightning bolt or a fireball (level 3 spells). If you really want to cheese fights, fill as many slots as you can with Bigby's Grasping Hand and Bigby's Forceful Hand- these can stunlock your opponents without a save (only spell resistance is allowed- make sure to get the penetration feats) and trivialize many encounters. The missile storm lines of spells are also great against opponents who can consistently make reflex saves against evocation and conjuration spells (i.e., rogues or Red Wizards specialized in evocation/conjuration ).

Finally, if you are really getting into trouble remaking as a Wizard/Red Wizard of Thay (prestige class) can let you get hyper-specialization bonuses in your college of choice (Evocation is probably best for MotB given the slew of spirits and undead in the game who don't care about Enchantment, offensive Illusion, or Necromancy, Abjuration/Divination do nothing offensively, Transmutation or Conjuration are fine), which will provide a pretty significant boost to your spell DCs overall. Notably, Red Wizards get both Bluff and Intimidate as class skills, which coupled with your high Int (high as it can go ideally) should give you the ability to have many effective dialogue options plus highly effective spellcasting. Wizard/Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep is a another good choice in this vein (Diplomacy as a class skill, and the discounted Metamagic feats they get are quite powerful and useful- empowered spells at only +1 higher casting slots are a big deal), and you could quite conceivably do both.

 

[Sothpaw]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

I have completed Mysteries of Westgate and found that another average D&D romp, worth one playthrough I suppose.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

There's lots of good stuff in the OC, slithers of reactivity here and there, and the Trial is truly excellent. I also enjoyed most of the Crossroad Keep stuff. Way better handled than the stronghold in PoE.

 

[Seari]

I don't see a point in it, since spirits just respawn infront of Mulsantir. It makes it a boring chore.

edit: I guess it prevents people from rest spamming or something.

 

[Sothpaw]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

There's lots of good stuff in the OC, slithers of reactivity here and there, and the Trial is truly excellent. I also enjoyed most of the Crossroad Keep stuff. Way better handled than the stronghold in PoE.

I agree. The trial is good and the Crossroads Keep at least gives gold a purpose for the first time I can remember in a D&D game. I had probably 500K in gold when I got to the keep and spent every piece of it immediately.

 

[Black]

The trial is good up to the point when you realize it's just bullshit LOL TRIAL OF COMBAT LOL

 

[Andnjord]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

There's lots of good stuff in the OC, slithers of reactivity here and there, and the Trial is truly excellent. I also enjoyed most of the Crossroad Keep stuff. Way better handled than the stronghold in PoE.

I agree. The trial is good and the Crossroads Keep at least gives gold a purpose for the first time I can remember in a D&D game. I had probably 500K in gold when I got to the keep and spent every piece of it immediately.

The trial? That damn trial who just ignores all your hard work and just forces into a freaking duel!? My warlock ass is still tender from that god damn duel. That said everything else about that trial was good indeed, just...not the end of it...

 

[Deleted member 7219]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

There's lots of good stuff in the OC, slithers of reactivity here and there, and the Trial is truly excellent. I also enjoyed most of the Crossroad Keep stuff. Way better handled than the stronghold in PoE.

I agree. The trial is good and the Crossroads Keep at least gives gold a purpose for the first time I can remember in a D&D game. I had probably 500K in gold when I got to the keep and spent every piece of it immediately.

The trial? That damn trial who just ignores all your hard work and just forces into a freaking duel!? My warlock ass is still tender from that god damn duel. That said everything else about that trial was good indeed, just...not the end of it...

You still get a reputation depending on whether you were found guilty or not guilty at the Trial. And your conversation choices and historical choices affect the verdict. The duel doesn't matter too much, that's really just something that happens afterwards, though it would be nice to have been able to skip it somehow. I got the dwarf to fight in the duel for me, so there's that.

 

[AetherVagrant]

Also - I swear the story in DA:I was lifted right out of NWN2.
Except the quests in nwn were better, the combat less boring.
...I did end up giving everyone boots of speed though. so much walking.

 

[ArchAngel]

I see a lot of idiots here defending the Spirit Eater thing. That was by far the worst mechanic I ever seen in any RPG I played.

Are you one of those pro games journos who got buttblasted by a simple mechanic?

No, I just didn't want to play all my characters as Lawful Good paladins so I can ignore this mechanic. When I removed it, MotB became playable. In the end the game was more playable than OC, but not to levels everyone praises it. I enjoyed PST much more for a game less focused on combat.

 

[ArchAngel]

I am playing through NWN2 for the first time now. Tried it at launch but didn't like my character and scrapped the playthrough. Currently at the end of Act 2. The combat is below average and the camera is bad. That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim. I would say it is worth one playthrough given the reward at the end of the tunnel (MOTB).

There's lots of good stuff in the OC, slithers of reactivity here and there, and the Trial is truly excellent. I also enjoyed most of the Crossroad Keep stuff. Way better handled than the stronghold in PoE.

I agree. The trial is good and the Crossroads Keep at least gives gold a purpose for the first time I can remember in a D&D game. I had probably 500K in gold when I got to the keep and spent every piece of it immediately.

Both Trial and Keep were shit. A bit better than PoE but not much.

 

[prodigydancer]

That said, while the OC is certainly a below average crpg, it does not sink to the shit levels of DAI or Skyrim.

It's hard to sink to the level of DA:I because it's rock bottom but Skyrim was infinitely more interesting and convincing than NWN2 OC.

 

[AetherVagrant]

ouch

 

[Sothpaw]

The trial? That damn trial who just ignores all your hard work and just forces into a freaking duel!? My warlock ass is still tender from that god damn duel. That said everything else about that trial was good indeed, just...not the end of it...

My bard cast invisibility and just hit the guy while he couldn't see me.

It's hard to sink to the level of DA:I because it's rock bottom but Skyrim was infinitely more interesting and convincing than NWN2 OC.

Infinitely more? Skyrim? I can see if you like it more in your opinion but that is some hardcore hyperbole there.