Non-combat magic

[V_K]

Yes. Exactly. Like in Real Life, where you cannot actually grasp or lift a sword without having proficiency with it. Which is exactly the same mechanic as when you're unable to cast a spell.

Actually I'd consider raping reality in highly specific ways with your mind to be in a different league than swinging a piece of metal around.

Everyone can be a shitty swordsman, but entry requirements for casting *any* spell should be quite a bit higher.

That can vary from setting to setting really. There's a number of fantasy novels, where magic is so common that everyone has some kind of magic gift.

 

[DraQ]

Yes. Exactly. Like in Real Life, where you cannot actually grasp or lift a sword without having proficiency with it. Which is exactly the same mechanic as when you're unable to cast a spell.

Actually I'd consider raping reality in highly specific ways with your mind to be in a different league than swinging a piece of metal around.

Everyone can be a shitty swordsman, but entry requirements for casting *any* spell should be quite a bit higher.

That can vary from setting to setting really. There's a number of fantasy novels, where magic is so common that everyone has some kind of magic gift.

I'm under impression that such settings are usually shit. The closest I've seen that wasn't was Mieville's Bas-Lag where thaumaturgy was relatively common but still what you'd consider qualified occupation, and TES (around Morrowind) that seemed to have overall magic density around that of Bas-Lag.

 

[DraQ]

Interesting topic.

When I elaborated RPG mechanics once, I came to the point of asking: "and what exactly is the difference between a spell which makes 20 damage and a crossbow which makes 20 damage?". Obviously nothing. It was just another form of attack. Eventually this kinda sucks.

I believe it's difficult to get magic usable in RPGs, if it shouldn't have anything to do with combat, however I could imagine that you could strictly separate it like that:
Magicians can only heal, enchant or produce status effects, but they can never do direct damage.

Edit: on a sidenote this system might suck too, because then you could never do an Armageddon spell killing all NPCs in your nearby area, and you could never do solo-runs etc.

Different things are only as much different as they are working differently.

If you want interesting combat magic, you need to make it work differently enough from crossbow or sword, that those methods of attack, even stripped from all fluff down to bare mechanics would still be unmistakeable and have their distinct utility.

Magic in particular can have any quirks imagination will allow and code will accept, because it's magic.

 

[Ranselknulf]

Time travel, dimensional pockets, air pocket for travelling through non-breathable areas.

I'm surprised you don't have a healing / prayer line of non-combat spells. Ressurection, boon, ask for guidance, summon djinni type stuff etc.

 

[V_K]

Yes. Exactly. Like in Real Life, where you cannot actually grasp or lift a sword without having proficiency with it. Which is exactly the same mechanic as when you're unable to cast a spell.

Actually I'd consider raping reality in highly specific ways with your mind to be in a different league than swinging a piece of metal around.

Everyone can be a shitty swordsman, but entry requirements for casting *any* spell should be quite a bit higher.

That can vary from setting to setting really. There's a number of fantasy novels, where magic is so common that everyone has some kind of magic gift.

I'm under impression that such settings are usually shit. The closest I've seen that wasn't was Mieville's Bas-Lag where thaumaturgy was relatively common but still what you'd consider qualified occupation, and TES (around Morrowind) that seemed to have overall magic density around that of Bas-Lag.

I though Butcher's Codex Alera was decent-ish from the mechanical standpoint. Although I didn't read past the first book, maybe it gets retarded later.
Earthsea too probably.

 

[DraQ]

Yes. Exactly. Like in Real Life, where you cannot actually grasp or lift a sword without having proficiency with it. Which is exactly the same mechanic as when you're unable to cast a spell.

Actually I'd consider raping reality in highly specific ways with your mind to be in a different league than swinging a piece of metal around.

Everyone can be a shitty swordsman, but entry requirements for casting *any* spell should be quite a bit higher.

That can vary from setting to setting really. There's a number of fantasy novels, where magic is so common that everyone has some kind of magic gift.

I'm under impression that such settings are usually shit. The closest I've seen that wasn't was Mieville's Bas-Lag where thaumaturgy was relatively common but still what you'd consider qualified occupation, and TES (around Morrowind) that seemed to have overall magic density around that of Bas-Lag.

I though Butcher's Codex Alera was decent-ish from the mechanical standpoint. Although I didn't read past the first book, maybe it gets retarded later.
Earthsea too probably.

IIRC Earthsea would also fall into semi-common bracket - common enough that you're bound to run into some practitioners pretty much everywhere but not common enough for them to be a majority - sort of like with higher education IRL.