NWN2 Mod - Alignment Poll

[oldmanpaco]

I hate alignment in NWN. You end up either LG or CE. The problem is neutral choices DO NOT MOVE YOU TOWARDS NEUTRAL ALIGNMENT. I have no idea why this mechanic has never been implemented in any game.

That being said I have no real desire to implement an alignment system. I would prefer to keep track of actions as opposed to alignment.

Case in point: I, as a LG char, sent that family to be eaten by those ape things in MotB. I shifted a total of 20 point towards evil but still retained my LG status. I then killed all the apes so no one would know what I did. Still LG.

Honestly what is the point. Actions that are publicly know should effect reactions from people. Alignment is for suckers.

If you have an opinion let me know.

 

[Malakal]

Cant it be done in four directions? +Law, +Good, +Evil, +Chaotic? Then You have a lot more possibilities open and even one quest could give player boost in two different directions depending on player actions during.

 

[Freelance Henchman]

I hate the alignment system. All of it.

 

[Sceptic]

Cant it be done in four directions? +Law, +Good, +Evil, +Chaotic?

I don't think so. The engine thinks in terms of 2 variables only (law/chaos and good/evil). A +law automatically means -chaos.

That being said I have no real desire to implement an alignment system. I would prefer to keep track of actions as opposed to alignment.

You mean by singular actions determining the alignment? sounds good in theory, but the problem is that you get a disconnect between small and big actions: either both will cause a shift (so you're evil no matter the magnitude of the action) or only the big one shifts (so the small evil action isn't evil after all). Though... now that I think of it you could just add 6 variables to the game: lawful, neutral, chaotic, good, neutral, evil. Increment the appropriate variable depending on player action. Alignment is determined by the highest value (one from lawful/neutral/chaotic, the other from good/theotherneutral/evil). This means not only that it's possible to stay neutral by always picking neutral actions, but that the more neutral you are the more difficult it becomes to shift away from neutral (something that the system always lacked)

 

[oldmanpaco]

You mean by singular actions determining the alignment? sounds good in theory, but the problem is that you get a disconnect between small and big actions: either both will cause a shift (so you're evil no matter the magnitude of the action) or only the big one shifts (so the small evil action isn't evil after all). Though... now that I think of it you could just add 6 variables to the game: lawful, neutral, chaotic, good, neutral, evil. Increment the appropriate variable depending on player action. Alignment is determined by the highest value (one from lawful/neutral/chaotic, the other from good/theotherneutral/evil). This means not only that it's possible to stay neutral by always picking neutral actions, but that the more neutral you are the more difficult it becomes to shift away from neutral (something that the system always lacked)

You are way over complicating things. I mean you pick your starting alignment because you have to then I ignore it from there on out.

Example - You can sleep with the mayor’s wife. If you decline I would flag the global var 0. If you do it and don't get caught - var=2. If you get caught - var=3. This variable would be referenced by only the people who it would be relevant to. This could be looked at when talking to the Mayor, the wife, and random people in the town. The people in the next town don’t give a crap who you are sleeping with and thus will never reference the var.

With alignment your decision has (in theory) a lasting effect on every person you meet.

 

[Sceptic]

You are way over complicating things. I mean you pick your starting alignment because you have to then I ignore it from there on out.

Well yeah I am, but I like my idea. Of course if you want to do away with alignment entirely then that's even better.

 

[oldmanpaco]

You are way over complicating things. I mean you pick your starting alignment because you have to then I ignore it from there on out.

Well yeah I am, but I like my idea. Of course if you want to do away with alignment entirely then that's even better.

You idea has merit and scripting it into the NWN2 engine would not even be that difficult. You would just need to have 6 global variables that would be updated as opposed to the alignment itself. You would call the script from the conversation (or death script) and update the correct variable, run the checks, and set the players alignment if one alignment passed the other. Or skip the part where the character page updated and just keep the alignment scores as a hidden variable.

That being said I think doing away with alignment all together is the best option.

 

[Murk]

I like that option Paco, similar to how the Gothic games would just keep track of actual stuff you've done and use that against/for you, I'd say likewise that's a good idea.

Alignment in general is terrible and serves as nothing but spell factors and class requirements, imo.

 

[Sceptic]

You idea has merit

Thanks. The details you described is exactly how I imagined it, too.

That being said I think doing away with alignment all together is the best option.

Sounds good. The way you want to do things sounds like a lot more work but ultimately more specific consequences are much better than an all-encompassing alignment. Can you script out alignment entirely out of char creation, the way you can limit classes/races? If not all you'd need to do is have a note in the readme about how alignment is inconsequential and players only have to pick one because of toolset limitations.

 

[oldmanpaco]

Can you script out alignment entirely out of char creation, the way you can limit classes/races?

I can't script my way out of a paper bag.

Classes can be modified through simple 2DA list manipulation. I believe char creation is hardcoded.

Basic scripting is in itself not difficult. When you try to adjust the basic game components it can get a little harder.

Dramatic Popcorn offered to help with scripting if/when I get to that point.