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still having fun with skyrim
- Thread starter crufty
- Start date
It's a required part of the chosen leveling system. Either you gain experience into what you do, like the TES games, or you gain experience that goes into a leveling pot. The last time Bethesda tried to solve skill grinding they came up with a retarded level scaling scheme.
Skyrim with sneak and archery plays like a decent open world Thief game, which I have to respect. At least until you turn mega-over-powered at around level 20.
And overall it's a hell of a lot better than Oblivion, which I also have to respect.
And overall it's a hell of a lot better than Oblivion, which I also have to respect.
This is true, but it must be noted that being better than Oblivion is not exactly a high bar to set.
I'm not one to bash Skyrim overmuch, though - if Steam tells it true, I've played it for 92 hours, which is more than I get out of most games. I also enjoy sneaking around and shooting stuff - although I have to wonder whether the archery seems nicer than it really is due to the melee combat being so atrocious.
I think it's legitimately quality for the most part. Sneaking will always be a bit derp because realistic AI wouldn't be fun, but the game makes it feel pretty solid and the pleasing feedback from hitting someone with a solid arrow to the chest just can't be denied. Melee really is terrible, yes... I would say if you're not playing an archer or a dual-wield mage/sword character you likely enjoy tedium. Still, combat was never a TES staple or where the quality was at.
Which has been a problem for the series post Morrowind, as they've tried to incorporate more and more combat into the games.
Luzur
Good Sir
Horus
Arcane
I Reeaaalllllyyy hate this song.
Zewp
Arcane
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2012
- Messages
- 3,594
That and the fact that everything in Skyrim has to be fucking majestic. In the time it took me to finish collecting all the ingredients for my first Mages guild quest in Morrowind you could have saved the world and become the arch-mage in Skyrim.
DraQ
Arcane
I don't know, I had fun with stealth in STALKER. It had none of that "I'll think that the armed guy I've looked at for full 5s was just a rat" nonsense we had in Deus Ex, nor "whatever killed two other guys and shot me in the ass was probably just wind" we've seen in TES: IV-V.
The only problem was that it was not really obligatory at any point.
Skyrim could defnintely use some longer (as in indefinite if you're still in the location) and more thorough searching, otherwise it turns into "shoot, run, hide, wait for AI to give up, repeat" exercise.
I think most people just don't want to be punished for their mistakes so endlessly. They want that 10 second reset so they can be sneaky again.
DraQ
Arcane
I think most people are morons.
I also think "want" and "enjoy" are two completely different things in games.
Shoot-hide-wait-repeat loop can't support enjoyable gameplay. It's just too fucking derp - you do exact thing, in exact same place, waiting somewhere around a minute every iteration 'till you run out of targets.
Good stealth mechanics shouldn't work like that. Good stealth mechanics should involve several alertness levels:
1. normal
2. suspicious - investigate, something suspicious just happened, but not necessarily something that can't be blamed on natural causes (slight movement noise, glimpse, missing object, comrade missing for a short time)
3. alerted - active search, something happened that can't be blamed on natural causes (loud noise, projectiles, attacks, people disappearing, corpses, too much suspicious events)
4. alerted suspicious - like 2, only while already searching for player, treated more seriously
5. contact - player located, lock and load.
2 and 4 are short term states and can be handled by single separate flag.
Elevated alert states should propagate from NPC to NPC on proximity, and once alertness level rises to "alerted" it shouldn't fall below it unless player leaves the location for prolonged amount of time and it gets reset or partially reset (or unless the likely culprit gets eliminated via kill, capture or escape, so getting a stealthy follower and having them visibly run off or letting them die by enemy hands should - after certain period - reset the AI to normal).
Also, attacks, bumping, manipulation and other forms of interaction should propagate the instigator's id to inanimate objects (and from objects carrying such id to further objects), so, for example, bowling guards with explosive barrels should count as attack.
This way there can be tradeoff - do I kill this guy using element of surprise, knowing that it will increase chances of detection in the long run, or just ghost by? Do I create a distraction or try to not attract attention? Etc.
I'm not disagreeing with you. When I said "AI has to be derp because realistic is no fun" I meant fun as in "what the people who pay think is fun" and what-have-you. I think the average vidjya game playur wants to fuck up, run to a corner, then try again as if he never fucked up.
Black Shogun
Educated
Skyrim's ok. But it was overpriced. Next time I'm waiting for a Steam Sale until I buy it.
Zewp
Arcane
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2012
- Messages
- 3,594
I loved how I'd shoot someone in the face with an arrow in Skyrim, then one minute later "was probably just my imagination."
And by loved I mean I thought it was total bullshit. Skyrim is using more or less the exact same sneaking system that was in Morrowind, just tweaked a bit. I mean, even Thief's sneak system was a lot better than what we see in Skyrim. At least the guards in Thief assumed that you escaped them if they couldn't find you, unlike Skyrim in which arrows flying full force into their faces "must have been the wind"
And by loved I mean I thought it was total bullshit. Skyrim is using more or less the exact same sneaking system that was in Morrowind, just tweaked a bit. I mean, even Thief's sneak system was a lot better than what we see in Skyrim. At least the guards in Thief assumed that you escaped them if they couldn't find you, unlike Skyrim in which arrows flying full force into their faces "must have been the wind"
Black Shogun
Educated
Why does everyone hate that song? I don't find it that bad. It's better if you get the translation for it, and realize that the guy is actually making fun of the entire beverly hills, high stakes lifestyle that most of these celebs want to be living.
The animation is actually pretty decent - wasn't expecting that.
Zewp
Arcane
- Joined
- Sep 30, 2012
- Messages
- 3,594
I had the misfortune of just discovering "Hearthfire" on steam, currently #1 best seller
I thought it odd that Bethesda actually released it for only $5. Thought they were going to overcharge on this one two.
Black Shogun
Educated
I had the misfortune of just discovering "Hearthfire" on steam, currently #1 best seller
I was just coming to the forum to report that....
5$ for something that a free to play mod would give me?
I had the misfortune of just discovering "Hearthfire" on steam, currently #1 best seller
This backs up the "very few people prefer mods" theory.
I had the misfortune of just discovering "Hearthfire" on steam, currently #1 best seller
This backs up the "very few people prefer mods" theory.
No Mods for Dirty Conslortated Peasants.
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