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In Progress Stupid Dumb Guy Playing Nobunaga's Ambition: Iron Triangle

Joined
Dec 28, 2011
Messages
26
Welcome to the mystical realm of Japan... The year is 1555 and the strength of the Ashikaga Shogunate is waning. Encouraged by the shogun's lack of intervention in the Onin War of 1467, a massive war between the Yamana and Hosokawa clans, feudal warlords across Japan battle their neighbors for supremacy. This era is known as the Sengoku, or Warring States, period and is marked by rise of new lords from nontraditional backgrounds as well as the introduction of guns and Westerners to Japan. It is a time of tremendous change and turmoil. It is a time of conquest.

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It is the time of Nobunaga Oda!

Nobunaga's Ambition: Iron Triangle is a real-time grand strategy game that came out for the Playstation 2 in early 2009. You play as one of a huge amount of daimyo, or feudal lords, in competition for control of the country. The daimyo led armies of samurai to take land and castles from their neighbors, conquering enemies clans and gaining power. Nobunaga Oda was one daimyo who conquered a great deal of Japan but was betrayed by his general Mitsuhide Akechi and killed before he was ever able to complete his dream.

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It'sa me, Nobunaga! Here's a pretty neat portrait of the guy made by a Jesuit priest named Giovanni Niccolo in the 1580s. Clearly there was a Japanese precedent for Super Mario.

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This is the map of Japan in 1555. There are over 50 daimyo, all of whom are playable. I'm going to let you decide who I play as. Let's take a look at all of the daimyo. You can see the daimyo's relative position by matching the symbol next to their name with the corresponding symbol on the map.

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The Kakizaki clan are in the far northeast of the map on the island called Ezo. They start with two guys, neither of whom are particularly great. I've beaten the game with them before, it's awful and takes forever and I'm not going to do it again. They specialize in civil and naval technology, not that it matters since you need three people to research technology and they only have two. Just thought I'd get it out of the way that I'm not going to play this turd under any circumstance.

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Harunobu Takeda, who later changes his name to Shingen Takeda, is one of the most famous figures from the Sengoku period and his battles with Kenshin Uesugi are legendary. The Takeda start out with 2 castles, over a dozen extremely good generals and is easily the strongest clan in the game. In fact, Shingen is probably the single best character. They specialize in cavalry, bow and civil technology. It would definitely be an extremely easy game.

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Kagetora Nagao, better known as Kenshin Uesugi, is the legendary rival of Shingen Takeda and another major player in the Sengoku period. The Nagao also start with two castles and many quality officers, although they're not as good as the Takeda's. Look at his leadership stat - it's 133. Good generals have stats in the 80s and 90s; it's pretty insane how much better he is than everyone else in the game. They specialize in cavalry, siege and engineering. Another extremely easy game.

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The Honganji were a sect of warrior monks called 'Ikko Ikki' that rebelled from the Ashikaga shogunate and took over several provinces. Their officers are all very good and they start with several provinces. They specialize in muskets, engineering, civil and infantry technologies. Another easy game.

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The Miyoshi is another large clan that starts out with two cities, although they're not as strong as the Takeda or Nagao. They start with a large retinue of retainers, many of whom are kin, but many of their best, including Nagayoshi, the daimyo, die fairly young. They specialize in naval, infantry, engineering and civil technologies. Not a difficult game but not a steamroll like with the Nagao and Takeda.

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The Imagawa clan starts very strong but can experience some nasty events that kill off their daimyo and make the game much more difficult. These events can be easily prevented and the game will be very easy if they are, but it might be interesting to see them as well. They specialize in infantry, bow, engineering and civil.

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Motonobu Matsudaira, better known as Ieyasu Tokugawa, founder of the Tokugawa Shogunate, is the reason the Imagawa clan can be both very easy and very difficult. If certain events are triggered, Yoshimoto Imagawa can be killed and the Matsudaira clan can splinter off with most of the Imagawa's best officers. The Matsudaira clan is very easy to play as, since it's basically the best elements of the Imagawa without the worst.

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The Hojo clan is another extremely powerful faction with a lot of very good generals. Ujiyasu Hojo has several sons, all of whom are good, and has Tsunashige Hojo under his command, a cavalry general nearly as good as Shingen Takeda. The Hojo start out allied with the Imagawa and Takeda and usually steamroll the Kanto region. They specialize in infantry, naval, engineering and civil technologies. Another very easy game.

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Yoshishige Otomo, better known as Sorin Otomo, was the lord of northern (or I guess western) Kyushu. He starts out very strong with two cities and the retainer Akitsura Hetsugi, one of the only officers in western Japan who is truly comparable to Shingen Takeda and Kenshin Uesugi. They specialize in siege, infantry, engineering and civil. It's also interesting to note that Sorin Otomo converted to Christianity.

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The Saito clan only starts out with one castle but is in a very good area and has a large number of very good generals. There's an event where Yoshitatsu kills his father Dosan and takes control of the clan, but Yoshitatsu dies of illness fairly early on as well, leaving the clan to an incompetent son. They specialize in infantry, siege and civil technologies. A pretty easy game!

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The Mori clan, led by Motonari Mori, is easily the most powerful clan in western (I guess southern??) Japan. His sons are all extremely good and he has a number of other very good retainers. He's also surrounded by people who are very easy to defeat. The only real threat in the area is the Otomo, who are easy to box in. They specialize in bow, siege, naval and civil technologies. If you've ever seen Kurosawa's film Ran, it's based off of Motonari Mori. Another easy game.

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Here we go, a clan that might be interesting to play as! The Ashina clan has a good daimyo but are in Nagao territory and are susceptible to attacks from forces that are much stronger. The Nagao, and possibly the Takeda, will always be a looming threat, so it will be necessary to expand to the east and north before they do. They specialize in cavalry and civil technology. It would probably be a pretty hard game.

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Shimazu are on the southern tip of Kyushu and start out very strong. All of their officers are very good - some of the best in the game - and they specialize in muskets, which are the best weapons. It's probably the easiest clan to play as.

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The Anto are a small clan in the northeast of Japan. Their neighbors to the north, the Nanbu, are pretty powerful and there's very little breathing room between them and the Nagao. Their officers are mostly pretty bad, although the daimyo, Chikasue, is good and it's possible to get more good officers by attacking the Mogami. They specialize in naval and civil and have an alliance with the Kakizaki. It's a very difficult and interesting game!

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Hell yeah. The Nagano start out in the worst possible spot - right between the Takeda and Nagao. They have a number of very good officers, including Nobutsuna Kamiizumi, who has the highest valor (or strength) in the game. The daimyo, Narimasa, is great but very old though and it's important to make solid gains before he dies. They specialize in infantry and engineering. It is an extremely difficult game but very fun.

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The Chosokabe are the strongest faction on the small island of Shikoku. Kunichika is a very good daimyo but his son, Motochika is one of the best officers in the game. He has a few good generals, the best of whom are his sons, and has an easy time unifying Shikoku. They specialize in infantry, siege and civil technologies. A pretty easy game.

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The Nanbu are the most powerful clan in the far north. They start out with two castles but have mostly bad generals. A game as the Nanbu is definitely not difficult because they start out so much more powerful than any of their neighbors, but they also can't compare to clans like the Shimazu or Takeda. They specialize in infantry and cavalry technology.

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Yeaaaaaah!!! The Ota clan (not the Oda clan!) is by far the hardest clan in the game and without fail gets wiped out within the first three months. They're positioned right between the Nagao, Hojo and Takeda, the three strongest clans in the game. Their officers are all pretty bad except for their daimyo. They specialize in infantry, siege and engineering. A game as the Ota would be extremely difficult.

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The Satake clan starts out moderately strong and is in an area that isn't too difficult to conquer. The daimyo is fairly good but is ill and usually doesn't live too long. He's got a son on the way though...! They specialize in infantry and civil technology. A game as the Satake would be pretty fun and not too easy.

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The Arima clan starts out as one of the weakest on Kyushu. Their daimyo, Haruzumi Arima, is good but the rest of their officers are just wretched. Haruzumi is pretty old and the early Arima game relies completely on him. If he dies before substantial gains are made, it's game over. They specialize in muskets and naval. A game as the Arima would be hard but pretty fun.

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The Satomi clan are just south of the Ota. They have the Ota as a buffer from the Takeda, but eventually they'll have to face the much stronger Hojo or Takeda. Their officers are all fairly good and they've got room to expand to the east. The Satomi specialize in naval and infantry and would make a fun and challenging game.

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Yeah! The Suzuki are another clan that starts out with very few officers in a poor location. They're not under immediate threat and they're allied with the Honganji, but it takes a while to build up any momentum with the Suzuki. They specialize in muskets and even get a unique musket skill.

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The Date are the second strongest clan in the far north. They've only got one castle, but they have a fairly large retinue of officers, many of whom are pretty good. They also get Masamune Date, one of the most famous and competent personages of the Sengoku period, but that's in 1580 so the game will almost be over by then. They specialize in engineering, civil and cavalry tech. It would be a moderately difficult game, but not too bad.

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The Ryuzoji start out next to the powerful Otomo clan, who are a big threat. They have a lot of top tier military generals though, so it's not too difficult to hold them off and eventually defeat them. It's easy to expand to the south before you take on the Otomo. They specialize in infantry, cavalry, bows and muskets. It would be a pretty easy game.

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The Soma are in an area that's not quite in the Nagao's range of influence and not quite in the Nanbu's range of influence. Their daimyo is pretty good and he has a few good officers too, but there aren't many and their neighbors are pretty strong too. They specialize in cavalry. The Soma would probably be a pretty difficult and interesting game.

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I really don't know much about the Kitabatake! They start out pretty close to the Imagawa and Oda clans. They usually get wiped out fairly early, but they have a few good generals and it might be possible to expand to the west before they fight the Oda and Imagawa. They specialize in infantry, bow and naval. I think a game as the Kitabatake would be moderately difficult.

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The Saionji start out on Shikoku. None of their immediate neighbors are particularly strong, but they're ultimately in the intersection of the Mori, Shimazu, Chosokabe and Otomo, so once things have started up, it could get really dangerous. Their officers aren't great or terrible, they're pretty average. They specialize in cavalry and bows.

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Yoshiteru Ashikaga is the actual shogun of Japan, although his authority and importance has diminished to the point where he can no longer keep the various daimyo in check. The Ashikaga have a few good generals, but they're near powerful enemies like the Honganji, Oda and Miyoshi. They specialize in infantry, bows and civil technology. A game as the Ashikaga would be moderately difficult.

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The Tsutsui clan is a small clan in between the Miyoshi and Oda. One of its generals is extremely good and it's not hard to get a few more good general that are nearby, but they're in a tight spot between a number of powerful enemies. They specialize in bow and civil tech. A game as the Tsutsui would be moderately difficult. Oh yeah, and Junkei Tsutsui is 7 years old.

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The Sagara start out just north of the Shimazu on Kyushu, but also have an alliance with them. The alliance only lasts a few months, but it will give them enough time to prepare for the inevitable onslaught. If the Sagara can survive the Shimazu's first attack, they stand a chance. The daimyo is old and his heir hasn't yet come of age, but his son is pretty good. They specialize in siege, infantry and civil. A game as the Sagara would be pretty hard, but not overwhelmingly difficult.

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The Uragami start with a lot of officers but most aren't that great. The only real threat nearby is the Mori, though, so it's not hard to expand. Most of the generals in the area they're in aren't very good, so it's hard to build up any momentum before taking on the Mori. They specialize in infantry, siege and civil tech. A game as the Uragami would be moderately difficult.

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...but! It's possible to exile Munekage Uragami and install Naoie Ukita as the head of the clan. This might be an interesting alternative!

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The Oda clan is in the exact center of Japan and can expand in any direction. Nobunaga is the game's titular character and has extremely good stats, as well as a number of very good generals under his command. He's near the powerful Saito, Imagawa and Takeda clans but the Oda clan is on par with most of them. The Oda specialize in infantry, muskets, engineering and civil technologies. A game as the Oda would be very easy.

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The Aso start out just south of the Ryuzoji and Otomo on Kyushu. Their officers except for one aren't very good, but they start out allied with the Otomo so it's not hard to ride their coattails and steal victories from them. They specialize in bows. A game as the Aso would be fairly difficult.

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The Jinbo start out in between the Nagao and Honganji. None of their guys are good or noteworthy in any area. They're bad and completely forgettable. They specialize in bows and civil. A game as the Jinbo would be very hard, but also not very interesting.

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The Mitsugi, who change their names to the Anekoji early on, are just south of the Jinbo and north of the Saito. Their officers aren't very good either, but they're not as awful and boring as the Jinbo's. They're also in a significantly better and more defensible position. They specialize in bows and siege. A game as the Mitsugi would be pretty hard.

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The Hatakeyama are to the area north of the Jinbo and Honganji. They control a port that borders the Nagao and are often the Nagao's first target. Their officers aren't good and they're in a bad spot, but they're a lot more interesting than the Jinbo. Fuck those guys. They specialize bows, naval and civil technologies. A game as the Hatakeyama would be very hard.

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The Kimotsuki on Kyushu are to the southeast of the Shimazu. They're far away from the Otomo and have room to expand, but the Shimazu are a very dangerous threat and usually wipe them out pretty early on. Kimotsuki officers aren't great, but also not too bad either. They specialize in infantry and are allied with the Ito. A game as the Kimotsuki would be pretty difficult.

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The Rokkaku are in the center of Japan in between the Ashikaga and Saito. Their officers aren't good and they're in between forces that are much more powerful. It's a really difficult position to defend, too, because they're in the direct center of so many other people. They specialize in bows. A game as the Rokkaku would be very hard.

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The Yamana are just north of the Uragami. They're somewhat close to the Mori, but not close enough that they need to worry too much. The people around them aren't very strong and it's easy to expand, but despite having a lot of officers, the Yamana don't have anyone that's too good either. They specialize in infantry. A game as the Yamana would be difficult.

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The Amago clan are to the north of the Mori and east of the Ouchi clan. They have quite a few officers and some of them are fairly good. They need to be careful, though, because the Mori are very powerful and usually expand to the north very early. The Amago specialize in infantry and civil technologies. A game as the Amago would be difficult.

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The Utsunomiya aren't really near anyone that powerful, but aren't too powerful themselves. Their neighbors are the Date, Satake, Soma and Ashina, although after a while the Nagao usually draw close. Their officers are more politically oriented, so fighting is difficult, but it's also not too hard to get decent generals as well. The Utsunomiya specialize in infantry and civil technologies. They'd be fairly difficult.

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The Ito aren't far from the Shimazu or the Otomo and it's not hard for the Mori or Chosokabe to expand nearby either. Their officers are fairly average and they don't have many, but it's also possible to employ a few nearby ronin as well. The Ito could be interesting! They specialize in cavalry. A game as them would be difficult.

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The Shiba clan are just south of the Nanbu in the far north and are absolutely terrible. Their retainers aren't good politically or militarily and they have a terrible daimyo whose heir is also terrible. Their neighbors are stronger and occasionally fight, so it's possible to take advantage of their weakness and leech off of them when they're fighting. They specialize in siege. A game as the Shiba would be very hard.

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The Hatano start out in a decent position - nobody around them is very strong except for the Ashikaga. Although they don't have many generals, they're all very capable and good at fighting except for the daimyo. It's tough to build momentum because none of their officers are good at politics, but they are good at fighting which might make up for it. They specialize in infantry and cavalry. A game as the Hatano would be difficult but pretty interesting.

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The Kono are the northernmost clan on Shikoku and are wedged between the Chosokabe, Miyoshi and Mori. Their neighbors to the west, the Saionji, aren't powerful and would be easy to expand into, but the Kono don't have very many officers. What officers they do have are fairly good and it's possible to get more good officers early on. They specialize in naval and bows. A game as the Kono would be difficult.

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The Isshiki are just north of the Hatano. Their officers aren't good and they have very few of them. Their best officer, Yoshimichi Isshiki, is in line to be daimyo and has decent musket skills. None of the people in the area are particularly strong, but they're mostly stronger than the Isshiki. The Isshiki specialize in muskets, but they're the only clan in the region that does. They would be pretty hard.

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The Kanto Ashikaga are a cadet branch of the main Ashikaga line. They used to be major players in the region until the Hojo came and destroyed them and the Ogigayatsu Uesugi. They're close to the Hojo, but they're also allied with them which means they don't need to worry too much about that front. They're extremely weak and need to focus on building up, but they have a handful of good political officers that will help. Everyone around them (except for the Ota, who will get killed in a few months) is much stronger, so they need to be extremely careful. They specialize in bows and civil technology. A game as the Ashikaga would be very difficult but pretty fun and interesting.

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The Asakura start out in between the Azai, the Honganji and the Isshiki. They're allied with the Azai and the Isshiki are very weak, so the only group they really need to look out for is the Honganji. Most of their officers are bad, although they have one retainer named Soteki Asakura whose lowest stat is something absurd like 85. He's very old so you need to make solid gains before he dies. They specialize in infantry and civil technology. A game as the Asakura would be moderately difficult - they have a great starting position.

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The Azai are in between the Saito, Asakura and Rokkaku, although they're allied with both the Saito and Asakura, which allows them to concentrate on the very weak Rokkaku. They have few officers, but the ones they do have, except for the daimyo, are good. The daimyo has a son on the way as well...! They specialize in infantry and cavalry. A game as the Azai would be moderately difficult.

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Although the Ouchi start with two castles, they're in between the Otomo and Mori. Both of their castles are very weak and all of their generals except for one, Harukata Sue, are average to bad. The Ouchi's entire strategy relies on Harukata or else they'll be swallowed up very quickly. The Ouchi start allied with the Otomo (the daimyo are brothers) but the alliance expires soon and the Otomo will attack immediately. They specialize in infantry and civil. Games as the Ouchi are very difficult.

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The Mogami start in between the Nagao, Anto and Date. The Nagao are war machines and almost always swallow up the tiny and weak Mogami immediately, so it's important to rely on the alliance with the Date. The Mogami has very few retainers and the daimyo is awful, but both are pretty good political officers. Yoshimori's also got a son on the way who could change everything. If we can hold out for the son, maybe everything will be okay....!!!!! The Mogami specialize in cavalry and civil technology. They're very hard.

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The Akamatsu start out in between the Honganji, Uragami and Yamana. They're also not far from the Miyoshi and Mori. They're in a tight spot and don't start with any particularly good officers, but except for the Honganji, their neighbors aren't fantastic either. Like with the Mogami and Azai, a son may save the day! They specialize in bow and civil technology. A game as the Akamatsu would be very hard.

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It's safe to say that the Ichijo has the single worst daimyo out of them all. In fact, he may just be the worst character in the game. The Ichijo starts out incredibly weak and close to the Chosokabe, Shimazu, Mori and Otomo. Their officers, though, are pretty decent and may be possible to make a comeback. They specialize civil technology. A game as the Ichijo would probably be extremely hard, although not as hard as the Ota.

So those were the available clans. There are over 50 so take your time in deciding which one you want to see me play. I can imagine this mostly doesn't mean anything to you, so I can answer questions about the game as well.

Pick something difficult!!
 
Unwanted

Kalin

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Dumbfuck Zionist Agent
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Go for Yoshiteru Ashikaga, the rightful Shogun!

Plenty of enemies around to make it challenging, too.
 

Saark

Arcane
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A Beautifully Desolate Campaign
Glad to see you get this together that fast, I really enjoyed reading your last LP and I have high hopes for this one as well. I vote Kanto Ashikaga.
 

Renegen

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Ouchi or Ashikaga. Cool game, it looks just like a modern RotTK.
 
Repressed Homosexual
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It's quite strange for me that these games have such incredibly small appeal in the West and Koei keeps on localizing them no matter what. This game cannot have sold more than 100 copies or something. How many PS2 owners will have had a deeply rooted desire to play a Paradox-like game on a console?
 
Joined
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Messages
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Yeah, it is pretty weird. They released a billion Romance of the Three Kingdoms games for the PS2 (7, 8 and 10 were RPGs so I can sort of see how they might have some appeal) but as a whole these games are way different from what normally gets localized. This and Rise to Power (which I don't think is very good!) were the only Nobunaga games released in the last 15 years or so. Some of the unreleased games, especially the latest, look pretty cool but they don't seem to have very good reviews in Japan.
 

Norfleet

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It's quite strange for me that these games have such incredibly small appeal in the West and Koei keeps on localizing them no matter what. This game cannot have sold more than 100 copies or something. How many PS2 owners will have had a deeply rooted desire to play a Paradox-like game on a console?
Well, it doesn't COST much to localize such a game. There's not all that much text, and what exists is mostly a recyclement of existing texts from the previous 8 or 9 editions. The work has already been done, may as well fill it in and push it out for a few bucks.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
I'm more confused they never released this on PC. And my Japanese history knowledge is non existent. Take a country of ninjas if possible. If not, Ashikaga seems like a decent choice.
 

Damned Registrations

Furry Weeaboo Nazi Nihilist
Joined
Feb 24, 2007
Messages
15,142
:lol: I recognized a bunch of those names from playing Rance.

I vote for Mogami. Extremely difficult begining > complete turn around when the son arrives should make for an interesting LP. Strategy games tend to get dull once you get past the halfway mark so I think it'd be best if the second half of the game is as easy and short as possible in comparison to the first half, as opposed to one where you start off decently but get slowed down by the loss of your leader just as you were gaining momentum.
 

golgepapaz

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Divinity: Original Sin Wasteland 2
why is the map of japan laid out left to right in games ? Is it also that way in the japan I wonder. or is it just because it fits the screen nicely when laid out like that?
 

Mrowak

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Project: Eternity
Uesugi, of course. :smug:

Nahh, it would be too easy. I second Mogami.
 

Damned Registrations

Furry Weeaboo Nazi Nihilist
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Messages
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why is the map of japan laid out left to right in games ? Is it also that way in the japan I wonder. or is it just because it fits the screen nicely when laid out like that?
Well, it's pretty close to being laid out east-west anyways, especially if you cut off Hokkaido. And having a diagonal strip of an island would leave a lot of irregular blank space on the screen.

It mostly looks stretched out a lot north-south because of the fucked stretching maps do to try preserve accuracy for a sphere. It's actual dimensions excluding Hokkaido are about 1200 km east-west and 800km north-south.
 
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Hey, voting's all over the place. Let's narrow it down to all the clans that have gotten two or more votes: Oda, Ota, Kanto Ashikaga, Ashikaga, Mogami and Uesugi. From easiest to hardest it probably goes Uesugi, Oda, Ashikaga, Kanto Ashikaga, Mogami and Ota.

why is the map of japan laid out left to right in games ? Is it also that way in the japan I wonder. or is it just because it fits the screen nicely when laid out like that?
It's how all the Japanese maps from the period look! They didn't lay it down on a north-south axis. In fact, in 1600 a huge battle was fought between the eastern and western armies, which were really northern and southern.
 

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