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ULTIMA IV IS FUCKING UNPLAYABLE!!!

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
...at least, according to a classroom full of 19 year olds:

http://www.brainygamer.com/the_brainy_gamer/2010/09/unplayable.html

Here's a sampling of posts from the forum I set up to facilitate out-of-class discussion of the game:

I've been very confused throughout the entire experience. I've honestly sat here for hours trying to figure out what to do and it just isn't making much sense to me right now.

When I start a game I like to do it all on my own, but it's been impossible to do so with Ultima. I've asked friends for help, looked up FAQs/walkthroughs, and even searched for Let's Play Ultima 4 on youtube and am still uncertain as to how to get further in this game.

Yeah, I still have no idea what the main goal is. I suppose it's to basically find out what the purpose of the Ankh is. But I see no way of furthering that goal.

I tried for awhile without any walkthroughs to get the full gamer experience sort thing and within the hour I gave up because of a combination of bad controls and a hard to get into story for me at least. It reminded me of a bad runescape.

i dont quite understand the concept of the game. i believe my main confusion is the controls and how it displays what you have done and how you moved. im not used to rpg's and i dont like them to much. i hope to find out how to move forward,but so far no luck.

How the hell do I get out of here after I die
?
I had supplied them with the Book of Mystic Wisdom and the History of Britannia, both in PDF form, but not a single student bothered to read them. "I thought that was just stuff they put in the box with the game," said one student. "Yes," I replied, "They put it in there because they expected you to read it." "Wow," he responded.

:mca:
 

ironyuri

Guest
Silellak said:
...at least, according to a classroom full of 19 year olds:

http://www.brainygamer.com/the_brainy_gamer/2010/09/unplayable.html

Here's a sampling of posts from the forum I set up to facilitate out-of-class discussion of the game:

I've been very confused throughout the entire experience. I've honestly sat here for hours trying to figure out what to do and it just isn't making much sense to me right now.

When I start a game I like to do it all on my own, but it's been impossible to do so with Ultima. I've asked friends for help, looked up FAQs/walkthroughs, and even searched for Let's Play Ultima 4 on youtube and am still uncertain as to how to get further in this game.

Yeah, I still have no idea what the main goal is. I suppose it's to basically find out what the purpose of the Ankh is. But I see no way of furthering that goal.

I tried for awhile without any walkthroughs to get the full gamer experience sort thing and within the hour I gave up because of a combination of bad controls and a hard to get into story for me at least. It reminded me of a bad runescape.

i dont quite understand the concept of the game. i believe my main confusion is the controls and how it displays what you have done and how you moved. im not used to rpg's and i dont like them to much. i hope to find out how to move forward,but so far no luck.

How the hell do I get out of here after I die
?
I had supplied them with the Book of Mystic Wisdom and the History of Britannia, both in PDF form, but not a single student bothered to read them. "I thought that was just stuff they put in the box with the game," said one student. "Yes," I replied, "They put it in there because they expected you to read it." "Wow," he responded.

:mca:

Ultima IV is unplayable to a modern audience and the article perfectly explains why.

Ultima catered to a completely different skill and knowledge set- not that new gamers/players don't have the ability to learn (are they learning animals?)- and required that you understand something above the previous games in the Ultima series and the mechanics of early 90s era gaming in general.

I started gaming at an early age (roughly 6-7 years old on a Commodore 64 and then a basic Windows 3.1 PC with the old Apogee games) and quickly built up the physical dexterity (fast typing, mouse skills) and mental acumen to play computer games. In the very earliest years I played side-scrollers like Duke Nukem and Hocus Pocus, later it was games like Pagan Ultima VIII (I lived in a country where gaming was not yet entrenched) and Wing Commander.

The average person playing games today will have been introduced to them via the medium of the Playstation (mid-90s release) or XBox (not to mention possibly early NES or Sega Megadrive systems but that's likely rare as we get older) and will have neither the patience nor the necessary skills to play older PC games.

Take for example the old console generation titles such as those developed for Sega- Battle Toads. Battle Toads was a game which was not meant to be finished by any but the most dedicated (read- obsessive) players. This is the paradigm of most console gaming. Console games are easily consumable but not meant to be consumed as totalities. Players play them until they get bored with a certain amount of content and move on, only fans of the series and more hardcore players ever finish them.

PC games, cRPGs etc have always been designed from both a mechanical and story perspective to be consumed as a holistic experience. Of course this depends on the genre but in terms of the RPG it is designed to be played from beginning to end; unlike most console games. As PC games are ported to console and vice versa we find the console mindset continues to exist and is even more prevalent than in the old days (see recent stats on Mass Effect 2 completion rates released by Bioware)- players do not finish games, least of all on the console.


So enter Ultima IV and the modern generation of gamers. These are gamers who have been brought up on games designed not to be finsihed, but consumed and discarded quickly; they have not experienced the mechanics of early era games-

and to make another quick point:

Older games often included content in manuals because of space constraints of old pcs. This made the manuals and extras included in the box (cloth maps in lieu of in-game maps) required reading to complete the game. Nowadays with dvds holding so much data the in-box goodies have become superfluous kitsch with no application to the game.

So because they do not understand the way the mechanics work; understand how the manuals/maps worked for old games; understand games which are made to be played for 100s of hours over a long period of time by a niche market of people (and let's face it we were always a niche market in the early days) they see the games as unplayable.
 

Tails

Arbiter
Joined
Nov 25, 2007
Messages
1,674
I had supplied them with the Book of Mystic Wisdom and the History of Britannia, both in PDF form, but not a single student bothered to read them. "I thought that was just stuff they put in the box with the game," said one student. "Yes," I replied, "They put it in there because they expected you to read it." "Wow," he responded.
Oh wow, I can't stop laughing from that one. But well, what can you expect in times, where players get used not to read manuals.

Are the in-game tutorials responsible for such decline? :rpgcodex:
 

Phelot

Arcane
Joined
Mar 28, 2009
Messages
17,908
When I start a game I like to do it all on my own, but it's been impossible to do so with Ultima. I've asked friends for help, looked up FAQs/walkthroughs, and even searched for Let's Play Ultima 4 on youtube and am still uncertain as to how to get further in this game.

I love this part. He likes to just play it so he probably thinks he's "just playing it" when a giant box appears on screen telling him "WASD" are for moving the character around in modern games...

EDIT: Not to mention none of them knew what the fuck to do. Now we all see why we need safe corridors and exclamation points above NPC's heads "HEY FUCKFACE PUSH E TO TALK TO ME SO I CAN TELL YOU TO KILL THESE CRITTERS! BTW PUSH THE OK BUTTON TO EXIT THIS SCREEN"
 

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
Tails said:
I had supplied them with the Book of Mystic Wisdom and the History of Britannia, both in PDF form, but not a single student bothered to read them. "I thought that was just stuff they put in the box with the game," said one student. "Yes," I replied, "They put it in there because they expected you to read it." "Wow," he responded.
Oh wow, I can't stop laughing from that one. But well, what can you expect in times, where players get used not to read manuals.

Are the in-game tutorials responsible for such decline? :rpgcodex:
Ultima IV needs a remake with a Clippy-style, Ankh-shaped pop-up helper.

"Hey! It looks like you're trying to become an Avatar..."
 

deuxhero

Arcane
Joined
Jul 30, 2007
Messages
11,439
Location
Flowery Land
Hey, I had to directly ask on the internet what the fuck I'm meant to do in Ultima 4 beyond grind for virtue ponts (ask around the starting town about the local virtue's orb, shrine and mantra or something like that).

The controls are indeed a clusterfuck (Are there even any ladder/stairs/ect that go both up and down in the game? Why do you need two buttons for that.)


I did read the books though.
 

Mastermind

Cognito Elite Material
Patron
Bethestard
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
21,144
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
But if we're interested in preserving our history and teaching students about why these games matter

:lol:

You'd think he was talking about preserving the last copy of a Dickens or Kafka novel.
 

Silellak

Cipher
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,198
Location
Tucson, AZ
Mastermind said:
But if we're interested in preserving our history and teaching students about why these games matter

:lol:

You'd think he was talking about preserving the last copy of a Dickens or Kafka novel.
You're right, those don't compare to Ultima IV. :smug:

Elzair said:
I hate to say this, but I wonder what the racial composition of his classroom is looking like?
samuel_l_avatar.jpg
 
Self-Ejected

ScottishMartialArts

Self-Ejected
Joined
Feb 24, 2005
Messages
11,707
Location
California
Elzair said:
I hate to say this, but I wonder what the racial composition of his classroom is looking like?

Probably mostly white and Asian, with a token black guy and latino. Depends where he teaches though.

Consolefags fucking suck. I made my first serious effort to complete Ultima 4 only about 2 years ago, and I absolutely loved it. The sense of exploration and gradually learning the secrets of the world was simply unparalleled. Arcane interface and lack of hand-holding was no problem at all, and in fact the lack of hand-holding became a positive as I continued with the game. I didn't finish it, but to play a game again where finishing required real dedication, as opposed to being the natural product of playing for 6 hours, was a lovely change of pace.

Kids these days.
 

SCO

Arcane
In My Safe Space
Joined
Feb 3, 2009
Messages
16,320
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
I want to see these fine young things play the realms of arkania series.


Can you imagine a Khad style lp of Blade of Destiny or Star Trail (even worse)..

Oh the delicious tears of rage...
buying food and water...
The dead ends...
The labyrinthine cities...
The enormous fetch quest...
The diseases...
The shoes wearing out...
The spells with cryptic names...
The insta-deaths if you do stupid things...
The magical weapons that look exactly the same as non-magical ones...

yesssssss
 

Wang Lo

Novice
Joined
Sep 23, 2010
Messages
68
Come on now, when I was a teen the early ultimas were pretty unapproachable. Ultima IV is also about the most overrated game ever, aside from fallout. Going back I am pretty sure I beat 1-3 later but I have never completed U IV. Much like there is no focus on combat in arcanum according to some people, the reality is in U 4 there is a a whole lot of wandering around and fighting with an interface that is nowhere near as good as later ultimas, without much clue at first wtf you are even doing or why.
 

MisterStone

Arcane
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Messages
9,422
My brother and I beat U IV, we were 10 and 12 yrs old respectively.

If you RTFM and take notes when you talk to people, you begin to understand what the goal is in maybe an hour at most. And the interface isn't any more difficult to learn than a console Xbox sandbox or fighting game, easier even.
 

DefJam101

Arcane
Joined
Nov 11, 2007
Messages
8,047
Location
Cybernegro HQ
Elzair said:
I hate to say this, but I wonder what the racial composition of his classroom is looking like?
People in my 80% white/asian private school regularly make comments like this when I play a roguelike in the computer lab so, no, it's not related.
 

reaven

Educated
Joined
Nov 10, 2009
Messages
204
Location
Spain
Wang Lo said:
Come on now, when I was a teen the early ultimas were pretty unapproachable. Ultima IV is also about the most overrated game ever, aside from fallout. Going back I am pretty sure I beat 1-3 later but I have never completed U IV. Much like there is no focus on combat in arcanum according to some people, the reality is in U 4 there is a a whole lot of wandering around and fighting with an interface that is nowhere near as good as later ultimas, without much clue at first wtf you are even doing or why.
One of the class students :smug:
 

Rohit_N

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Feb 15, 2007
Messages
876
Location
Houston, Texas
Serpent in the Staglands Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Sure, since it'll probably encourage me to play the game.
 

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