Black
Arcane
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- May 8, 2007
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But can you say anything good about it?Emotional Vampire said:I can't say anything bad about BG writing.
But can you say anything good about it?Emotional Vampire said:I can't say anything bad about BG writing.
How so? 2E DnD gives you the min number of options. You pick a class and then you get automatic bonuses to THAC0 and saves when you level up, where choosing new spells is the highlight of the leveling up experience. BG2 tried to fix the boredom with the class kits, but it wasn't much and can hardly be compared to the DA system.Ogg said:And what about wizardry or even DnD games?! DA:O being the spiritual successor of BG2 really fails here.
Pardon?You keep comparing DA:O with action RPG.
Certainly not.Do you regard as one?
Nope. I honestly believe that it was a weak system, but you're more than welcome to prove me wrong.As for calling FO character system "pretty weak", I must take it as a trolling attempt.
Looked the same as any other fight to me.Brother None said:It does put you in a disadvantageous position.
I see it as a good choice that should have been developed more. If you don't have the blood mage with you, you don't have any other choice, do you? Same goes for not willing to sacrifice the mother.I think we've been over this before. I don't buy the unlikelihood of travelling to the Circle and back not being an issue when there's a demon upstairs who already killed and resurrected the castle inhabitants once. Heck, she can turn statues to life, why are we supposed to pretend it makes sense for you to be able to pick your nose and take your sweet time rounding up the Mages so you can mind-enema the kid?
I played a "two-handed" warrior on my first playthrough. Two-Handed Sweep was an excellent crowd control talent:KalosKagathos said:And what options are they? Warriors and rogues can disable an enemy for a couple of seconds and manage aggro (what the hell is aggro doing in a single player RPG, anyway?), but you need a mage if you want real crowd control options. Then there are archers who can turn the life of a mage-less party into a living hell.Like I said the game gives you plenty of tactical options and with a bit of thought and planning, you can mow through everything the game throws at you.
Don't quite cut what? Glyphs are insanely powerful if used right.Wynne is a healer, something that I didn't really need. My rogue had several points in stealing and herbalism, which allowed me to buy and brew a lot of healing potions. Sure, I could give her more useful spells like hexes, Paralysis or the sleep line, but she wouldn't feel like, well, Wynne then. Glyphs and Grease are nice, but they alone don't quite cut it.
You're mistaken.Shale, Oghren and Leliana are three companions that I could tolerate. Unfortunately, a party of two warriors and two rogues isn't particularly effective in combat.
Depends on a game. In a dungeon crawler where party members are silent drones, usually created by you, their role is to handle certain tasks. Nothing else. In a story-driven game the party members have personalities, which a) may rub you the wrong way, like I said, and b) may create conflicts and disagreements. For example, destroying the ashes will create a conflict and cost you 2 party members you may have counted on.That's what I eventually did, but that's bullshit, isn't it? Party members are the ones who complement my character, not the other way around.
I've always defined an action RPG as an RPG where the player's twitch-skill matters as much, or more than, the character's skill - Diablo, Torchlight, Bloodlines, the Witcher, Mass Effect, etc. Your character's attacks can never "miss" in these games unless you, the player, missed the target - with the obvious exception of something like a ranged attack in Bloodlines, where there's a targeting reticle with a size determined by the character's skill. More importantly, the character doesn't attack more than once unless you give them the command more than once - be it through clicking, holding the mouse button down, jamming a hotkey - whatever.Secretninja said:Just because the action is incredibly boring and repetitive does not disqualify it from being an action rpg.
Doesn't the demon know that you are trying to get help from the CIrcle Mages? Because that should affect his behaviour and then a day can be a big deal.Vault Dweller said:...
The shit with the demon was going for days. What's one more day? Why is it suddenly such a big deal? You've defeated his minions once before. Whatever the demon can create in a day won't be much of a treat, especially since you're bringing the top mages with you.
Vault Dweller said:Nope. I honestly believe that it was a weak system, but you're more than welcome to prove me wrong.
Brother None said:It's a survival horror, tho', genre-wise. Pathologic might've inched into consideration with its scant RPG elements, but probably not, The Void is not up for awards on GameBanshee.
Brother None said:Don't get me wrong, I'm not expressing an elitist opinion that BioWare's mode of storytelling is "wrong" and all games should be super-intelligent like Pathologic, or even that games like Pathologic should be put on a higher shelf for that intelligence than BioWare.
Brother None said:I'm saying BioWare's own grasp on storytelling is slipping, and rather than becoming better with the years, they're becoming worse.
Vault Dweller said:Arcanum
Vault Dweller said:Jagged Alliance 2
Vault Dweller said:DnD and Das Schwarze Auge
Vault Dweller said:The Witcher
Vault Dweller said:SPECIAL is very, very simple. 7 stats, 18 skills, unbalanced traits and perks. Plenty of useless skills, plenty of useless traits and perks. No combat rules. Armor Class that doesn't belong there. Etc.
It's hard to say whether it's more or less balanced when Arcanum's system dwarfs Fallout in terms of complexity.Twinkle said:Ha-ha-harm. ARC's system while being more feature-rich is even less balanced.
We're talking about character systems here.Yes. But [JA2 is] hardly the same type of game as FO1-2.
Computer. For DSA my champion is Realms of Arkania.Are we talking about tabletop or computer game implementations?
It has nothing to do with the system. What you're talking about is the overall game design, which is superb in Fallout. I'm talking about the character system only. Surely you realize that just because a game has Charisma, it doesn't magically make it useful?Stats affect non-combat gameplay more than in your average RPG. Low CHA and Low INT chars will have different experience compared to smart and charismatic ones etc.
Let's take another look then:12 non-combat skills:
- First Aid. Somewhat useful.
- Doctor. Definitely useful.
- Sneak - shit IMO.
- Lockpick - yes, especially in the early game.
- Traps - same as above.
- Steal - not worth it.
- Repair - useful.
- Science - useful.
- Speech - definitely useful.
- Barter - somewhat useful.
- Gambling - not so much.
- Outdoorsman - somewhat useful as it allows to skip too easy/too hard encounters.
Totally useless skills hardly come in "lots".
Vault Dweller said:Computer. For DSA my champion is Realms of Arkania
Vault Dweller said:Doctor would have been a real handy skill to have.
Vault Dweller said:Useful enough to waste points on it?
Vault Dweller said:What you're talking about is the overall game design, which is superb in Fallout.
It seems like Stealth would be a better choice than Steal. Steal can logically fall into a subset of Stealth, but not vice-versa, and "Stealth Boy" is supposed to be one of the primary "Fallout character archetypes", correct?Vault Dweller said:I've never said it was broken. As for the different play styles, it was the brilliant design of the game and quests, not the character system.
I'm sure you'd agree that it's possible to cut SPECIAL down to 4 stats: Strength, Agility, Intelligence, Charisma, and 5 skills: guns, melee, mechanical, speech, steal and it would work flawlessly with the design of the game, without anyone even noticing the difference.
It would make huge difference. Every stat you proposed to cut off has something interesting to offer. Both luck and endurance have enormous impact on your choice of perks and combining their bonuses with the bonuses from perks. You can pump your luck close to the max and score so many criticals that you won't need endurance. Or alternatively, you can create a character with pool of hp so big, so he will be able to fight longer and win without high damage criticals. Perception makes ranged and unarmed builds differ.Vault Dweller said:I'm sure you'd agree that it's possible to cut SPECIAL down to 4 stats: Strength, Agility, Intelligence, Charisma, [...] and it would work flawlessly with the design of the game, without anyone even noticing the difference.
Baldur's Gate has quite of lot of text - about half the size of dialogues that Planescape Torment has. It doesn't have any outstanding pieces so that can explain why one can not remember much of it. It has some moments when NPCs throw walls of text on you without saying anything important but it's not as bad as f.e. NWN. There are also some really bad attempts on humour, especially at the beginning (which also suffers because of NPCs talking about the UI). And the PCs good and evil responses are amongst the worst in history of Bioware, competing with Fallout 3 [intelligence] quotes in category "the most inane PC dialogues in the history of RPGs".Lesifoere said:No, sweetie. BG barely had any writing.
Thanks for the tips. Looks like I just took crappy abilities and/or misused useful ones. Will give the game another go.Vault Dweller said:snip
I'm sure you'll love ME2 or AP character system.Vault Dweller said:I'm sure you'd agree that it's possible to cut SPECIAL down to 4 stats: Strength, Agility, Intelligence, Charisma, and 5 skills: guns, melee, mechanical, speech, steal and it would work flawlessly with the design of the game, without anyone even noticing the difference.