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Volourn's Jade Empire Chapter 1 Impressions aka Fanboy Alert
- Thread starter Volourn
- Start date
space captain
Liturgist
hey volourn, its spelled "straddled"
stay in school, kid
stay in school, kid
Greatatlantic
Erudite
There are two theories about Volourn, neither of which make him out to be a kid. The first is that he's actually a computer programed spambot, usually attributed to Bioware. The second, believed only by me, he is Anne Coulter staying sharp in between writing her "columns". So its highly doubtful Volourn is still in school.
Old Scratch
Liturgist
- Joined
- Nov 19, 2004
- Messages
- 190
dipdipdip
Liturgist
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2003
- Messages
- 629
Well, I'm still in Ch. 3, though I'm at the tail end of it.
Though I'm still enjoying the sights and sounds and what not, I do feel as though the combat has gone stale for me at this point. The simplistic enemy A.I. is just too easy to take advantage of, sucking the fun out of things quite a bit.
I still enjoy collecting the different styles, though. I think they did a great job with the motion-capturing.
One thing that has annoyed me regarding the story is the game's total rehashing of KOTOR's You vs. Malak vs. Bastilla scene on board the Leviathan.
Though I'm still enjoying the sights and sounds and what not, I do feel as though the combat has gone stale for me at this point. The simplistic enemy A.I. is just too easy to take advantage of, sucking the fun out of things quite a bit.
I still enjoy collecting the different styles, though. I think they did a great job with the motion-capturing.
One thing that has annoyed me regarding the story is the game's total rehashing of KOTOR's You vs. Malak vs. Bastilla scene on board the Leviathan.
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
So I borrowed an Xbox and Jade Empire from a buddy who has to visit his grandparents over the weekend (too bad :twisted: ), and I'm now about 3 hours into the game - end of the first chapter.
I have some issue with getting used to the controls, probably because I don't have a console and avoided anything like a gamepad so far, but otherwise
WOW
The presentation and visual quality of this game is amazing - I was not the biggest fan of the kung fu idea, but all I can say is that I'm glad that Bioware took the risk to do something original instead of rehashing the same old stuff. It's also the most immersive title I've played in a long time - I played 3 hours straight without dropping the controller, and it's been a long time since I did that with any game. In a weird way I would compare it to Diablo, but instead of Just One More Item, it's Just A Bit More Of the Story, Just One More Dialog.
I died a few times so far (the dreaded beach battle and against Gao), but that is probably more because I'm still getting used to that controller thing, and not so much because the combat is too challenging (playing on the medium difficulty setting)
For me, the start of the game is the best start in any game so far, RPG or not. The tutorial is short and non intrusive, the pacing is reasonably fast, I feel guided (not clueless like morrowind) but not forced down the path. Still, the game is pretty linear so far, but that will probably change in the next chapter, at least if they follow the standard Bioware pattern.
The dialog options is the best in any Bioware game so far, talking to the Merchant when leaving the town left me laughing for quite a bit - but if you are not a fan of humorous dialog, you might have issues with this title (the ox - farmer - wife triangle was very cheesy).
Audio is close to perfect and more sophisticated than any other RPG I have ever played. Certain characters have their own little themes and the game fades seamlessly to that theme when you engage in conversation with them. Voice overs are great - even on the side characters - Student Lin ("you can pour honey in my ear") and the Merchant just made me chuckle.
The bad:
I haven't seen any framerate hitches or slowdowns so far, the game has an amazing level of polished at least compared to the games I played on the PC lately (Bloodlines, KotOR2). The camera seems to get lost from time to time but after I found out about how to unlock from a combat target, this didn't bother me too much anymore. Still it should be mentioned because it's frustrating at times and I died at least once because the camera got stuck at an invisible wall and I was splatted by a cannon ball.
I don't like the minigame, but since the game didn't care about the fact that I was shot to pieces, it didn't seem like losing the game has any impact. For anyone who has played it - is there any benefit for winning the game either? If not, I wonder why they put that feature in, it seems out of place, much more out of place than the Starwars minigames.
Seen from a roll playing point of view: the game hides what's left of it.
I appreciate the fact that I don't spent 30% of my time on the equipment screen like KotOR, but I would have liked damage floaties or some other kind of feedback that would allow me to engage in number crunching. Guess they didn't want to scare the casual gamer with it, so they didn't put it in. I'd also have liked to see some more customization along the lines of skills or feats, but the game is clearly centered around your combat styles, not much else.
The dialog skills are great as they offer interesting and believable options, but one thing that is bothering me quite a bit about them is that the way I level up my character is more geared toward combat (more body, so I get more hitpoints) than the dialog skills and as a result I end up intimidating a lot more people than I would like to, just because Body happens to raise my intimidation skill. I guess there are gems you can use to influence these skills, but I haven't found any yet.
The special asian like language they created has been used only a few times so far, but while it's MUCH better than those annoying aliens in KotOR ("much chaka paka"), it also seems to repeat lines from time to time, through much less frequently.
In the end, all the flaws are minor and you forget about them as the story sucks you in and I would rate chapter 1 90% so far - but with another +2% tilt just because it's not Elves and Dwarves again, if the game stays that way, I think it could be their best game yet.
I'll write up a longer impression when I've seen more on the game.
For those who played it - what's the deal with Lion Statue in Master Li's house. It seems to be just a cheap color puzzle and gives only a few XP and a bit of silver, I somehow feel that I missed something.
I have some issue with getting used to the controls, probably because I don't have a console and avoided anything like a gamepad so far, but otherwise
WOW
The presentation and visual quality of this game is amazing - I was not the biggest fan of the kung fu idea, but all I can say is that I'm glad that Bioware took the risk to do something original instead of rehashing the same old stuff. It's also the most immersive title I've played in a long time - I played 3 hours straight without dropping the controller, and it's been a long time since I did that with any game. In a weird way I would compare it to Diablo, but instead of Just One More Item, it's Just A Bit More Of the Story, Just One More Dialog.
I died a few times so far (the dreaded beach battle and against Gao), but that is probably more because I'm still getting used to that controller thing, and not so much because the combat is too challenging (playing on the medium difficulty setting)
For me, the start of the game is the best start in any game so far, RPG or not. The tutorial is short and non intrusive, the pacing is reasonably fast, I feel guided (not clueless like morrowind) but not forced down the path. Still, the game is pretty linear so far, but that will probably change in the next chapter, at least if they follow the standard Bioware pattern.
The dialog options is the best in any Bioware game so far, talking to the Merchant when leaving the town left me laughing for quite a bit - but if you are not a fan of humorous dialog, you might have issues with this title (the ox - farmer - wife triangle was very cheesy).
Audio is close to perfect and more sophisticated than any other RPG I have ever played. Certain characters have their own little themes and the game fades seamlessly to that theme when you engage in conversation with them. Voice overs are great - even on the side characters - Student Lin ("you can pour honey in my ear") and the Merchant just made me chuckle.
The bad:
I haven't seen any framerate hitches or slowdowns so far, the game has an amazing level of polished at least compared to the games I played on the PC lately (Bloodlines, KotOR2). The camera seems to get lost from time to time but after I found out about how to unlock from a combat target, this didn't bother me too much anymore. Still it should be mentioned because it's frustrating at times and I died at least once because the camera got stuck at an invisible wall and I was splatted by a cannon ball.
I don't like the minigame, but since the game didn't care about the fact that I was shot to pieces, it didn't seem like losing the game has any impact. For anyone who has played it - is there any benefit for winning the game either? If not, I wonder why they put that feature in, it seems out of place, much more out of place than the Starwars minigames.
Seen from a roll playing point of view: the game hides what's left of it.
I appreciate the fact that I don't spent 30% of my time on the equipment screen like KotOR, but I would have liked damage floaties or some other kind of feedback that would allow me to engage in number crunching. Guess they didn't want to scare the casual gamer with it, so they didn't put it in. I'd also have liked to see some more customization along the lines of skills or feats, but the game is clearly centered around your combat styles, not much else.
The dialog skills are great as they offer interesting and believable options, but one thing that is bothering me quite a bit about them is that the way I level up my character is more geared toward combat (more body, so I get more hitpoints) than the dialog skills and as a result I end up intimidating a lot more people than I would like to, just because Body happens to raise my intimidation skill. I guess there are gems you can use to influence these skills, but I haven't found any yet.
The special asian like language they created has been used only a few times so far, but while it's MUCH better than those annoying aliens in KotOR ("much chaka paka"), it also seems to repeat lines from time to time, through much less frequently.
In the end, all the flaws are minor and you forget about them as the story sucks you in and I would rate chapter 1 90% so far - but with another +2% tilt just because it's not Elves and Dwarves again, if the game stays that way, I think it could be their best game yet.
I'll write up a longer impression when I've seen more on the game.
For those who played it - what's the deal with Lion Statue in Master Li's house. It seems to be just a cheap color puzzle and gives only a few XP and a bit of silver, I somehow feel that I missed something.
Volourn
Pretty Princess
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2003
- Messages
- 24,924
"Still, the game is pretty linear so far, but that will probably change in the next chapter, at least if they follow the standard Bioware pattern."
Yeah, chapter 2 is more non linear. Overall, the game does have a linear quality; but it gives a dceent amount of non linearty. It's no FO or even BG in terms of non linearty though.
"(the ox - farmer - wife triangle was very cheesy)."
Cheesy yet funny.
There's a lot of siatuations like that amongst the more serious dialogue. A good mix, I think.
Best line, imo: 'Give your pet a peanut.' R00fles!
"I haven't seen any framerate hitches or slowdowns so far"
Yeha, it runs perfectly. I do agree that while the camera is usually fantatsic sometimes it gets out of control. That said, don't forget that you can pause the game and fix it at your leisure. My biggest technical beef are the long load times. Thankfully, saving is very, very quick.
"I don't like the minigame"
I don't mind it. It surely beats the stupid spaceshooting in KOTOR, and you can also skip it every time except the first. Well, in a way it fits because of all those assassins literlaly gunning for you. Heh. But, yeah, it's notn really needed though I think there's supposed to be a hidden bonus from it..
"but I would have liked damage floaties or some other kind of feedback that would allow me to engage in number crunchin"
Me too. This was mentioned on the BIO baords,a nd BIO said it was originally in; but took it out because it cluttered up the combat scne which they didn't wnat since the game is RT it might mess people up. I'm hoping they'll add it back in for JE2 (we know it's coming) as an option.
"I guess there are gems you can use to influence these skills, but I haven't found any yet. "
Hmm.. There should be. I got one gem that gives +4 to all dialogue skills. I have focused on charm.
"It seems to be just a cheap color puzzle and gives only a few XP and a bit of silver, I somehow feel that I missed something."
It seems you missed out a technique. It "only" gives you +4 health; but every bonus cna help. heh. i forget exactly how you get that; but you just have to fool around with the statue. Did you find the alatr behind the Master's house. That has a clue...
Glad you are enjoying it.
Yeah, chapter 2 is more non linear. Overall, the game does have a linear quality; but it gives a dceent amount of non linearty. It's no FO or even BG in terms of non linearty though.
"(the ox - farmer - wife triangle was very cheesy)."
Cheesy yet funny.
There's a lot of siatuations like that amongst the more serious dialogue. A good mix, I think.Best line, imo: 'Give your pet a peanut.' R00fles!
"I haven't seen any framerate hitches or slowdowns so far"
Yeha, it runs perfectly. I do agree that while the camera is usually fantatsic sometimes it gets out of control. That said, don't forget that you can pause the game and fix it at your leisure. My biggest technical beef are the long load times. Thankfully, saving is very, very quick.
"I don't like the minigame"
I don't mind it. It surely beats the stupid spaceshooting in KOTOR, and you can also skip it every time except the first. Well, in a way it fits because of all those assassins literlaly gunning for you. Heh. But, yeah, it's notn really needed though I think there's supposed to be a hidden bonus from it..
"but I would have liked damage floaties or some other kind of feedback that would allow me to engage in number crunchin"
Me too. This was mentioned on the BIO baords,a nd BIO said it was originally in; but took it out because it cluttered up the combat scne which they didn't wnat since the game is RT it might mess people up. I'm hoping they'll add it back in for JE2 (we know it's coming) as an option.
"I guess there are gems you can use to influence these skills, but I haven't found any yet. "
Hmm.. There should be. I got one gem that gives +4 to all dialogue skills. I have focused on charm.
"It seems to be just a cheap color puzzle and gives only a few XP and a bit of silver, I somehow feel that I missed something."
It seems you missed out a technique. It "only" gives you +4 health; but every bonus cna help. heh. i forget exactly how you get that; but you just have to fool around with the statue. Did you find the alatr behind the Master's house. That has a clue...
Glad you are enjoying it.
I didnt' read this entire thread but the inital post Volourn, and for the most part I'll agree, though Bio's production values were pretty low. The graphics indeed are not that outstanding. Compared to KotoR they're gorgeous, but compared to Fable or especially God of War, which is a PS2(XboxPower>PS2Power) they are only alright. Oh, and before you comment, genre is irrelevent when it comes to graphics quality. Poor job on the character rigs, and some 'sights' lack lighting detail of any sort. But as he said, when they 'do' get it right, its pretty to look at. The fights on the other hand are very very enjoyable to watch, and I honestly believe this is where they focused their attention. The magic is kick ass and the mo-cap on the martial and weapon sytles is very 'kung-fu'.
Combat IS as awesome and non-buttton-mashing as he said. I the first significant fight at the 'beach', I died over and over, failing to appreciate the order of combat. It helps to think a few moves in advance, as you drain Chi fairly quickly for healing and more significant attacks, which is odd for an 'action' game, as there you simply react; here you do have to give a bit of thought.
Dialogue(not story) is several steps below KotoR2, and you can see what great writers can do and when you have programmers writing it. Not to be outwardly derisive, but its fairly simplistic in both content and morality. Its TOO obvious which is the good path and which is the bad, which almost every side quest being solved in two or three diag. trees.
Voice acting is good to poor, where I almost have to believe they made the poor ones intentionally. Maybe two characters so far have had voice over and writing I wanted to listen to(rather than read the subtitles and skip through quickly), and thankfully one of them is in your party.
Story, well not much to say of course to avoid spoliing it, but its compelling enough to want to keep me glued for hours on end in front of the tv.
Exploration is next to none. Going into a nook and/or cranny seems like an accident, as if they forgot to put up a collision border, making the levels feel hodge podge and just tossed together and populated without any real design or function in mind, unlike again, say God of War, which is a masterpiece in level design and art direction(the only reason I'm comparing the two is due to me having recently finished GoW and now playing JE, and more importantly, because of how much attention to detail and production quality that was given to GoW, that it puts most games to shame and, dare I say, attains the status of 'classic'...a perfect game. I found not one flaw, when I'm finding them left and right in JE, and Bio has NO excuses as they are flush with money and manpower).
Overall when they get the right things right, and they do it 85% of the time), its great, but there are too many parts of low quality that make me question why they would do any less than perfection for their OWN IP. This is THEIR game, and they allow poor quality in? Odd. Perhaps they know their customers and know they'll swallow it.
So, unless you absolutely detest any sort of dextrous activity(I feel sorry for those people), then this is definitely a very entertaining game.
Cheers
Combat IS as awesome and non-buttton-mashing as he said. I the first significant fight at the 'beach', I died over and over, failing to appreciate the order of combat. It helps to think a few moves in advance, as you drain Chi fairly quickly for healing and more significant attacks, which is odd for an 'action' game, as there you simply react; here you do have to give a bit of thought.
Dialogue(not story) is several steps below KotoR2, and you can see what great writers can do and when you have programmers writing it. Not to be outwardly derisive, but its fairly simplistic in both content and morality. Its TOO obvious which is the good path and which is the bad, which almost every side quest being solved in two or three diag. trees.
Voice acting is good to poor, where I almost have to believe they made the poor ones intentionally. Maybe two characters so far have had voice over and writing I wanted to listen to(rather than read the subtitles and skip through quickly), and thankfully one of them is in your party.
Story, well not much to say of course to avoid spoliing it, but its compelling enough to want to keep me glued for hours on end in front of the tv.
Exploration is next to none. Going into a nook and/or cranny seems like an accident, as if they forgot to put up a collision border, making the levels feel hodge podge and just tossed together and populated without any real design or function in mind, unlike again, say God of War, which is a masterpiece in level design and art direction(the only reason I'm comparing the two is due to me having recently finished GoW and now playing JE, and more importantly, because of how much attention to detail and production quality that was given to GoW, that it puts most games to shame and, dare I say, attains the status of 'classic'...a perfect game. I found not one flaw, when I'm finding them left and right in JE, and Bio has NO excuses as they are flush with money and manpower).
Overall when they get the right things right, and they do it 85% of the time), its great, but there are too many parts of low quality that make me question why they would do any less than perfection for their OWN IP. This is THEIR game, and they allow poor quality in? Odd. Perhaps they know their customers and know they'll swallow it.
So, unless you absolutely detest any sort of dextrous activity(I feel sorry for those people), then this is definitely a very entertaining game.
Cheers
space captain
Liturgist
mom and dad??
jesus you are a fucking comic genius ...
stay in school and maybe one day you cant write insults like a grown up
jesus you are a fucking comic genius ...
stay in school and maybe one day you cant write insults like a grown up
Gromnir
Liturgist
- Joined
- Jan 11, 2004
- Messages
- 394
have played some je... not too much.
so far it reminds Gromnir a great deal of fable... good and bad.
...
tangential observation:
we happens to have a couple of different xbox consoles. got both of 'em as gifts and we hardly use either. however, one has a thompson optical drive, and the other gots a phillips. is amazing how different the performance is twixt the two. the thompson hangs up during movies and gots crap frame rates and we get error messages all the time telling us that our disc is either damaged or dirty... am pretty sure the load times is longer too, but maybe just seems longer 'cause of general thomson frustration. if we hadn't gotten the damn thing for free, we woulda' been mighty displeased with the thompson xbox.
have played kotor and fable and kotor2 and now je on both consoles... is almost like playing different games. we hear complaints 'bout xbox performance and our first query is: what kind of xbox console do you have?
HA! Good Fun!
so far it reminds Gromnir a great deal of fable... good and bad.
...
tangential observation:
we happens to have a couple of different xbox consoles. got both of 'em as gifts and we hardly use either. however, one has a thompson optical drive, and the other gots a phillips. is amazing how different the performance is twixt the two. the thompson hangs up during movies and gots crap frame rates and we get error messages all the time telling us that our disc is either damaged or dirty... am pretty sure the load times is longer too, but maybe just seems longer 'cause of general thomson frustration. if we hadn't gotten the damn thing for free, we woulda' been mighty displeased with the thompson xbox.
have played kotor and fable and kotor2 and now je on both consoles... is almost like playing different games. we hear complaints 'bout xbox performance and our first query is: what kind of xbox console do you have?
HA! Good Fun!
Shagnak
Shagadelic
Gromnir said:
Well, that's interesting.
I had a similar situation back when I owned two PSX's.
I wonder if anyone else has noticed any such correlation?
dipdipdip
Liturgist
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2003
- Messages
- 629
Well, I'm now on Ch. 5 (and I suspect it's about to end), and yeah, what Space Captain says is all true. Ch. 4 was literally just a few rooms, and Ch. 5 is no different. It's become very straightforward and linear, with some story here and there. I don't think I'd mind so much if they'd paced things better. Maybe after two river you could have one of these quickie chapters before going to Tien's landing or something, but to have the first three chapters be quite meaty and substantive and then to follow them with what are four quick dungeon romps just feels wrong.
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
Shagnak said:
The first question asked in the technical support forums of many games seems to be "is it a thompson drive". Google is pretty clear on what that means. Guess that's the explaination for the reviews bashing the frame rate. I'm at the end of chapter 2 now (I think) and I have yet to encounter a serious framerate dip. Smooth as silk.
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
EvoG said:
Soul Calibur looks better on the Gamecube too, but that's the benefit of having only two objects on the screen. Seriously, to compare a game like Jade Empire against God of War is like comparing Fallout to Wing Commander. Texture memory, right? About Fable - from what I hear the levels in Fable are significantly smaller than in Jade Empire, I didn't play it so I can't confirm whether or not it's true.
dipdipdip
Liturgist
- Joined
- Jul 19, 2003
- Messages
- 629
So, I beat the game. I think it actually ends on a decent note, and without spoiling anything, the finale is an improvement over KOTOR. I got the open palm ending, and after the ending, they do go into the fates of your different party members. During the credits, there's a funny audio gag-reel type thing.
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
Finally beat the Imperial Arena. Had to switch to easy for the last two fights, just couldn't beat those suckers. The resolution for Black Whirlwinds plot there is very touching, excellent writing and cinematics there.
Be sure to check out The Serpent's office when done, some nice stuff in his locker ... but a lot of traps as well.
I found to stab at KotOR's arena sweet as well. "By what name should you be known, Mysterious Stranger?" or so.
Be sure to check out The Serpent's office when done, some nice stuff in his locker ... but a lot of traps as well.
I found to stab at KotOR's arena sweet as well. "By what name should you be known, Mysterious Stranger?" or so.
Volourn
Pretty Princess
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2003
- Messages
- 24,924
"Finally beat the Imperial Arena. Had to switch to easy for the last two fights, just couldn't beat those suckers."
Ha. I'm on the second last fight. Got my as swhoop so I did me some exploring so I can gain some power. What a fight!
And, yes, ch3 (as well as ch2) is pretty decently wide open on where you can go for the most part. Sadly, if what dip says is true and since his experience has been akin to mine so far I'm duck in favor here, that will suck that it seems the later chapters are much quicker. I'm almost 20 hours in and still in ch3...
"I found to stab at KotOR's arena sweet as well. "By what name should you be known, Mysterious Stranger?" or so."
Aye, hialrious. Not to mention, that JE's arena is 1 million times better in every way to KOTOR's - in challenging set up, combat, story, and options...
Ha. I'm on the second last fight. Got my as swhoop so I did me some exploring so I can gain some power. What a fight!
And, yes, ch3 (as well as ch2) is pretty decently wide open on where you can go for the most part. Sadly, if what dip says is true and since his experience has been akin to mine so far I'm duck in favor here, that will suck that it seems the later chapters are much quicker. I'm almost 20 hours in and still in ch3...
"I found to stab at KotOR's arena sweet as well. "By what name should you be known, Mysterious Stranger?" or so."
Aye, hialrious. Not to mention, that JE's arena is 1 million times better in every way to KOTOR's - in challenging set up, combat, story, and options...
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
Still in chapter 3, trying to find Aishi the Mornful Blade.
Bioware games get linear toward the end, at least that's what was said at E3 and I doubt Jade will be an exception. As long as it makes sense from a story point of view, I have no issues with that.
Bioware games get linear toward the end, at least that's what was said at E3 and I doubt Jade will be an exception. As long as it makes sense from a story point of view, I have no issues with that.
MarFish
Liturgist
- Joined
- Dec 7, 2004
- Messages
- 266
Volourn said:
A chapter is nothing but a story unit for me. If it makes sense to >>chapter<< parts of the game, I don't care. Gameplaywise I don't see a difference between 7 chapters with some longer and some shorter and 4 chapters and all of the same length.
MarFish said:
I have no idea what you're talking about, as you didn't finish your thought. What about texture memory? Xbox has 16 times more than PS2, so there is no excuse for the framerate issues and bland graphics, considering we're on what, the third game with the engine? GoW smokes JE in visuals...by a magnitude. How is this like comparing FO to WC?
Fables areas are smaller, but again, I'd rather have smaller areas of significant detail than sprawling landmasses with nary a detail or things to interact with.
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