Game News Warmachine: Tactics Kickstarter has begun

[FeelTheRads]

The primary incentive is the game being made.

I'm talking about incentives to pay more than the price of the game.

Yes, if you give more there's more money for the game blah blah blah, but if you're not as generous as Grunker you might want more value for your money that you could as well have spent somewhere else because you're not swimming in a sea of gold. And that's what rewards are for, they're not "thank you" notes.

 

[Grunker]

I won't deny that your $20 are absolutely out of the goodness of your heart, but not everybody is that generous.

Other, ungenerous, people need incentives. Baffling that anyone sees rewards as anything else.

The primary incentive is the game being made.

evdk stole my words.

You're not paying 250 bucks for three sculpts on top of the game, your incentive is "how much have I got?" vs. "how much do I trust these guys and how much do I want this game?"

Whoever goes "Wow! One unique Kickstarter sculpt for 500 dollars! What a steal!" is probably in the extreme minority. He pays 500 dollars because he wants to contribute to the game succeeding, because he wants that game. The sculpt is what little "thank you kindly" the project managers thought reasonable.

Kickstarters are the "pay what you want" of the medium sized game industry.

but if you're not as generous as Grunker you might want more value for your money

But that's the motherfucking point. Pledge tiers do not give you "more value for your money." They give symbolic "thank you" rewards, for the most part. Not nearly anything worth the actual price you pay.

 

[FeelTheRads]

is probably in the extreme minority.

I doubt it. You think too much of people. I believe that's the extreme majority.

Pledge tiers do not give you "more value for your money." They give symbolic "thank you" rewards, for the most part.

Symbolic is what capitalism (consumerism) is all about. You pay to get some nifty (ultimately useless) thing because you like to have stuff. If the whole point of rewards was to say "thank you" they could have just as well skipped it, because that's quite a lot money spent on thank yous and according to you the people who payed for them would have payed either way.
However, I stand firm in my belief that you would barely see any pledges above the price of the game if there were no extra rewards.

I know I certainly would not pay the money that a collector's box usually costs on Kickstarter if all I got was a digital download. Maybe that makes me greedy, but as I said, no matter how much I want a game to be made, money is fucking money and unless you have an unlimited supply you never know when you need it.

 

[Grunker]

Symbolic is what capitalism (consumerism) is all about. You pay to get some nifty (ultimately useless) thing because you like to have stuff.

If I can't convince you that the average consumer is capable of determining that a painted miniature sculpt has less value than the brand new smartphone he could get for the same 500$ he paid for the miniature, then I doubt we'll get anywhere in this discussion.

Higher pledge tiers offer rewards that are obviously attainable by spending way less money than you do on them during a Kickstarter.

 

[Excidium]

Symbolic is what capitalism (consumerism) is all about. You pay to get some nifty (ultimately useless) thing because you like to have stuff.

If I can't convince you that the average consumer is capable of determining that a painted miniature sculpt has less value than the brand new smartphone he could get for the same 500$ he paid for the miniature, then I doubt we'll get anywhere in this discussion.

Higher pledge tiers offer rewards that are obviously attainable by spending way less money than you do on them during a Kickstarter.

But they're kickstarter exclusive.

You're both right anyway, people want to pledge higher but at the same time the exclusive rewards act as an extra incentive to do that.

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I scrolled through the kickstarter and didn't see any mention of Warhammer or Games Workshop. Am I mistaken in thinking this is... "litigationally" close to Warhammer?

Warmachine has been around for a very long time now and sells almost as much miniature product, at least here, as Warhammer.

And is a superior product on every level as well.

Well Warmachine was designed by and to attract disgruntled Warhammer players. So I'm sure they copied a few superficial stylistic elements. It plays pretty differently and the aesthetics and fluff are pretty unique, though, so it's no rip off.

Actually IIRC the lead designer of Warmachine is a former MT:G designer. And beyond that, the game is based on a DnD setting.

 

[Grunker]

Actually IIRC the lead designer of Warmachine is a former MT:G designer

Yup.

 

[Hellraiser]

Jesus this got a lot of jewgold fast, guess the fanbase of the tabletop heard about it. Looks like anyway, faithful representation of the tabletop? Yes please.

 

[pakoito]

I scrolled through the kickstarter and didn't see any mention of Warhammer or Games Workshop. Am I mistaken in thinking this is... "litigationally" close to Warhammer?

Warmachine has been around for a very long time now and sells almost as much miniature product, at least here, as Warhammer.

And is a superior product on every level as well.

You mean figurine quality or gameplay-wise?

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

I scrolled through the kickstarter and didn't see any mention of Warhammer or Games Workshop. Am I mistaken in thinking this is... "litigationally" close to Warhammer?

Warmachine has been around for a very long time now and sells almost as much miniature product, at least here, as Warhammer.

And is a superior product on every level as well.

You mean figurine quality or gameplay-wise?

Both categories, but especially in terms of gameplay (then again, GWs games are p. shit). They're also *considerably* better managed and coherent in their handling of the game (main factor being that they have a supreme overlord lead designer in charge of everything), which is best illustrated by the fact that when Warmachine updated to the new edition, Mk2, it took five months for ALL of the armies to have their new rulebooks (they also don't update rulebooks individually, they only publish generic expansion books that cover everyone).

 

[pakoito]

How lolRNG reliant is the ruleset? Is it available somewhere?

 

[Grunker]

Jesus this got a lot of jewgold fast, guess the fanbase of the tabletop heard about it. Looks like anyway, faithful representation of the tabletop? Yes please.

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Fuck man, if I was God Emperor of the universe, every single boardgame, miniature game and card game in existance would have faithful digital conversions

 

[Vaarna_Aarne]

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Not really, if you remember that GW's head honchos live in bizarro world. It's semi-public knowledge that GW will *never* make a faithful digital conversion because they think it'd hurt sales of minis.

 

[pakoito]

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Not really, if you remember that GW's head honchos live in bizarro world. It's semi-public knowledge that GW will *never* make a faithful digital conversion because they think it'd hurt sales of minis.

And that's why I'm considering even buying this, but only if the core ruleset is strong and they don't pull any F2P crap. I could understand, even encourage, DLC armies.

 

[Grunker]

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Not really, if you remember that GW's head honchos live in bizarro world. It's semi-public knowledge that GW will *never* make a faithful digital conversion because they think it'd hurt sales of minis.

yeah man, look how magic online is destroying mtg

 

[Space Satan]

GW would sell their mothers, daughters and unborn kids for additional profit. And they COULD make a good game...in theory. Both WH universes are extremely developed and filled with so much data that devs only should adjust them according tocomputer game realities.
The problem is that every GW sell rights to some fabulous retards, who can't even make mediocre popamole. We saw no tactical warhammer game in a how long now? A decade? They pump RTS, TPS and some other crap that is as far from tabletop tactical turn-based combat as possible. As Vaarna_Aarne said they live in bizarro world.

 

[evdk]

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Not really, if you remember that GW's head honchos live in bizarro world. It's semi-public knowledge that GW will *never* make a faithful digital conversion because they think it'd hurt sales of minis.

yeah man, look how magic online is destroying mtg

GW lets Ward write rules and fluff. It's a complete lala land.

 

[Excidium]

It has always been a source of great wonder to me that Warhammer and similar games didn't have faithful digital conversions.

Not really, if you remember that GW's head honchos live in bizarro world. It's semi-public knowledge that GW will *never* make a faithful digital conversion because they think it'd hurt sales of minis.

yeah man, look how magic online is destroying mtg

One does not expect GW to act in a rational manner.

But holy shit if a Necromunda/Mordheim PC game wouldn't be fucking badass.

 

[evdk]

But holy shit if a Necromunda/Mordheim PC game wouldn't be fucking badass.

Why must GW be retarded?

 

[commie]

Another big pauldron, big guy with ridiculously proportioned weapon in a sea of bodies. Yawn. I'll demo it to see if it's any good but fuck backing another derivative spotty nerdgasm style game.

Wake me up when Silent Storm 2 gets a KS.


EDIT: Though if the game does deliver on SP campaign then they can take my money. Biggest gripe I had with DOW was the boring SP experience.

 

[pakoito]

From what I'm reading it's not an adaptation from the boardgame, but rether a retake on the rules for smaller scale?

 

[Excidium]

From what I'm reading it's not an adaptation from the boardgame, but rether a retake on the rules for smaller scale?

Seems so, but Warmachine is already skirmish scale.

 

[Mangoose]

From what I'm reading it's not an adaptation from the boardgame, but rether a retake on the rules for smaller scale?

Seems so, but Warmachine is already skirmish scale.

Yeah. Well more specifically, the rules are intended for a couple different point levels, including just having 3-4 miniatures. I thought they were increasing the scale from skimming, but I'll take a look now.

How is WARMACHINE: Tactics different from the WARMACHINE tabletop game?
The video game will be familiar to WARMACHINE players and at the same time is going to provide a whole new experience. The scope is different, a few more options for squad-building open up as units gain experience, and you can take more complex actions in combat. We’ll be rolling out a slew of videos and postings in the coming weeks that will demonstrate many of the unique features of WARMACHINE: Tactics with explanations straight from the design team.

Each warcaster possesses an arsenal of weapons tailored to his personal fighting style as well as a unique combination of spells and skills.

Each battle awards warriors, warjacks, and your warcaster with experience that unlocks new options for your squad, like tactical feats for the warriors or bonds between the warcaster and his warjacks that affect the performance of the warjacks in specific situations. This ever-growing list of options can be accessed during squad building to customize your force to your precise strategy.

To me this suggests that by different "scope" they mean that there will be some extra RPG elements. Units gaining experience, squads gaining feats, Warcasters with customizable equipment. Besides that, it sounds like they are giving "regular" infantry (the "warriors") some extra actions and abilities that they don't have in tabletop, but nothing suggests for now that they are changing Caster and Warjack mechanics.

I'll be keeping an eye out for specific info so I know whether or not to withdraw my pledge

 

[OSK]

Funded!

 

[stabby]

The problem is that every GW sell rights to some fabulous retards, who can't even make mediocre popamole. We saw no tactical warhammer game in a how long now? A decade?

Well, there is the oft neglected WH:40K Squad Command for the PSP, but seeing as that one looks like it barely had a budget to develop or market, GW probably saw it as a failure and concluded that "nobody wants turn-based anymore." Too bad though, as with a little more polish & love (ie. more than one linear campaign of 10 missions gawddammit) it could have been a pretty good game.

Anyhoo, moving on to Warmachine, this looks like it defintely could be pretty fun to play and, as already mentioned, asynchronous multiplayer piques my interest even more. I do have to admit though, the mention of Valkyria Chronicles as being inspired by did make me a little wary at first*, but after looking it over a little more and thinking about it, I can see where they might be going with that. Going to wait for a couple more updates on info, but I see myself giving them some money as well.

(* going to mention that my experience with VC is limited to the second game btw, which is not the best of examples for it)