Vapourware What is the list of Developers actually pushing the RPG Genre Forward?

[KeighnMcDeath]

You mean Not traditional RPG. More of an interactive adventure game + visual novel.

 

[Sykar]

Stygian Software.

 

[ValeVelKal]

How is Elden ring a metroidvania? Is metroidvania tossed around like a sack of potatoes for everything?

I always remember seeing Galactic Gladiators in the SSI catalogs but never shelves. I probably should have ordered it with a money order as a kid in the mail but I was kept on a short leash when it came to money (maybe cash from a paper route birthday/christmas money or recycling bottles & cans... i really had no concept of what a money order was or a check).

I only wanted the game because of cover art.



And the sequel

Didn't have an appleII or atari 8 bit in the house. At that age.. i owned nothing but could use once in a blue moon the vic or c64 or maybe the coleco or fairchild.

[URL]https://web.archive.org/web/20060315041723/http://www.well.com/conf/future/galglad.htm[/URL]

Basic Manuals[/URL]

Games need their own entry practically but very niche. Naturally SSI catalog is locked down unless you know where to look. Having a bit of trouble finding ref cards.

Yes, Galactic Gladiators was good, and Galactic Adventures the best cRPG of the first half of the 80s ; possibly better than anything until 1990. Better than Ultima IV by a landslide. Fight me, I'll die on that hill ; and that's not even nostalgia speaking I played it this year for the first ime. Cover art was very evocative, too, but SSI knew how to do those.

Maybe I will do an AAR of Galactic Adventures here - the game deserves it.

About Galactic Gladiators, you can find an interactive AAR I did with some Codexers (and non-Codexers) here :
Also, a review there : (you can skip the AAR, it is a short part of the earlier one).

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Besides the one html instruction site for both did you find a full image or pdf of the Galactic Adventures Reference card BOTH SIDES? These go for a hefty price on ebay (too rich for me... 300-400$ is my limit depending on product). I have inages of front side of ref card. I found all versions of both games. I'll probably put them all together and zip up on a mediashare.

Looks like Galactic Adventures didn't get pc treatment.

 

[ValeVelKal]

Besides the one html instruction site for both did you find a full image or pdf of the Galactic Adventures Reference card BOTH SIDES? These go for a hefty price on ebay (too rich for me... 300-400$ is my limit depending on product). I have inages of front side of ref card. I found all versions of both games. I'll probably put them all together and zip up on a mediashare.

Looks like Galactic Adventures didn't get pc treatment.

To my knowledge, this is complete :
https://archive.org/details/galactic-adventures/page/n1/mode/2up?q="Galactic+Gladiators"&view=theater
According to the table of content it has everything. The Atari version had a one-page reference card "correcting" the manual about the specificities of the Atari version, but the verso was blank. This is what is called "reference card" in one of your links.
Galactic Gladiators had a reference card, but it is easy to find iirc.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Ok. Thanks. It is funny MOCAGH has hardly anything either or hasn't procured a copy yet. Complete enough.... for now. I'll have to find the archived magazines talking about the game Esp Electronic Games and Casus Belli (even if French).

 

[TripJack]

who is pushing them backward that’s the direction we need to go

 

[Nifft Batuff]

Jeff Vogel

 

[ValeVelKal]

Ok. Thanks. It is funny MOCAGH has hardly anything either or hasn't procured a copy yet. Complete enough.... for now. I'll have to find the archived magazines talking about the game Esp Electronic Games and Casus Belli (even if French).

I have a copy of the Casus Belli review of the two games.
What’s your purpose ? That’s a lot of info you are regrouping.

Tom Reamy is still alive. I talked to him for my blog, I can send you the contact info.

 

[Pink Eye]

Knights of the Chalice 2 is a game that is actively pushing the genre forward by its innovative enemy AI. It's like playing against a human enemy in chess.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

Sometimes I just like to group contacts, links, and info together just in case the web devours older archives. I consider it "seeding" to plant in case the old crops wither and die. Pretty much was the case with ACS esp the lost physical archives of the adventure group you could join by mail. There is but a handful of adventures left. When old ip gets gobbled up buy someone who purchased sometimes that old stuff just gets lost forever. Even internet archive and wayback can't cover everything.

In this case, Thanks to you mentioning it, I grew curious as I really tried to get c64 ssi games usually of the RPG variety. This one i passed over not having the hardware. I need to looke more carefully at RapidFires other titles in the SSI catalog. These two games certainly remind me that some titles rarely cross over to all systems. FRACAS from Stuart Smith hit me that way as well.

There was probably already a link to this site: https://archive.kontek.net/gotcha.classicgaming.gamespy.com/ssi.htm

I can't find a video of S.E.U.I.S.

 

[Tihskael]

Obsidian. Pushing it forward off a cliff.

 

[KeighnMcDeath]

50 Mission Crush is listed asan RPG in the catalogs. I don't see what this has to do with it but if the chicks are in the game... might have been a purchase.


No... this is your game. RPG???

 

[ValeVelKal]

Sometimes I just like to group contacts, links, and info together just in case the web devours older archives. I consider it "seeding" to plant in case the old crops wither and die. Pretty much was the case with ACS esp the lost physical archives of the adventure group you could join by mail. There is but a handful of adventures left. When old ip gets gobbled up buy someone who purchased sometimes that old stuff just gets lost forever. Even internet archive and wayback can't cover everything.

In this case, Thanks to you mentioning it, I grew curious as I really tried to get c64 ssi games usually of the RPG variety. This one i passed over not having the hardware. I need to looke more carefully at RapidFires other titles in the SSI catalog. These two games certainly remind me that some titles rarely cross over to all systems. FRACAS from Stuart Smith hit me that way as well.

There was probably already a link to this site: https://archive.kontek.net/gotcha.classicgaming.gamespy.com/ssi.htm

I can't find a video of S.E.U.I.S.

You are doing God’s Work.

SEUIS is terrible. The best thing I can say is that it was a sort of early Star Control 1 strategy mode (which had no influence on the real one, which comes from Archon) - but a terribly designed one with atrocious controls.

I also covered it : https://zeitgame.net/archives/5184

I may still have some videos of it too. I ll check.

50 Missions Crush is not a RPG. The only progression is replacing the 30cal by a 50cal on your bomber…

 

[0sacred]

Nobody is really pushing the genre forward in the sense that their creations (1) are of exemplary quality and (2) they are in a position to be successful and then inspire other developers to follow.

Developers whose position gives them the potential to be a leader - Larian and CD Projekt, notably - have been stuck for a while recycling their old formulas ever since their own breakout creations.

Developers who are creating something genuinely new, and/or something of genuine quality for others to follow - Styg & VD, for instance - are unfortunately not recognised and their quality does not inspire further creations.

*BRAINFART*

Also, I think RPG as a genre has become a lot less cohesive. It's harder to talk about it as one genre with one dominant trend (e.g. to open world/MMO), since most genres have become pseudo-RPGified and vice versa.

ftfy

couldn't agree more now.

Big studios don't do RPG's anymore, and indie devs are not quite there as far as overall quality is concerned. TTBOMK there is no studio of an adequate size with considerable talent making actual RPG's right now - something on the level of Troika.

 

[Pink Eye]

what the fuck does ttbomk mean? what is it with people and these gay ass acronyms

 

[gurugeorge]

It really depends on which aspect of the RGP you prefer. In essence, it's a mixed genre that includes elements of roleplay (or if you want to be pejorative about it, LARPing), simulation, story, C&C and tactical combat. In the large view, developers have often pushed the genre forward in one or two of those areas, even while neglecting others.

e.g. BioWare in fact pushed the genre forward in terms of the LARPing, and to some extent story aspects of the CRPG - but that's probably not what most people here would like to hear, because most people here are inclined more towards the tactical combat side of things, and the company pushed forward those aspects while declining in the tactical combat area.

But if you like tactical combat, then what someone said above is true: tactical games are the new CRPGs, they carry the genre forward in that area.

I would maintain that the real thing, the real CRPG thing that's an ideal in a lot of peoples' minds, is something that fires on all those cylinders. But that's incredibly difficult - and incredibly expensive - to make, so it's incredibly rare to find investors who'll be willing to take the risk. And even if they do take the risk and are successful, the global audience even for the best CRPGs isn't that big, even with the breakout big hits, they're nothing compared to the level of the big genres (sports, fps, etc.).

The ideal CRPG is a delicate balance that's really hard and expensive to get right, so there's a tendency for it to "hive off" into sub-genres (or alternatively, to devolve back into the sub-genres it arose from) that are easier to make and (often) have bigger audiences.

To put it in a metaphor, the CRPG is like a "Magic Eye" 3-d image that occasionally pops into view, but has a tendency to devolve into its more easily observable elements. And those elements can be advanced without the genre as a whole being advanced.

 

[0sacred]

Bioware has pushed nothing. LARPing happens entirely out of game. To replace LARPing with actual gameplay, you need reactivity - and the last Bioware game that got that right was Neverwinter Nights.

 

[gurugeorge]

Bioware has pushed nothing. LARPing happens entirely out of game. To replace LARPing with actual gameplay, you need reactivity - and the last Bioware game that got that right was Neverwinter Nights.

Well BioWare have been immensely successful. So if it's not the tactical combat they've been successful for, what was it?

 

[0sacred]

Bioware has pushed nothing. LARPing happens entirely out of game. To replace LARPing with actual gameplay, you need reactivity - and the last Bioware game that got that right was Neverwinter Nights.

Well BioWare have been immensely successful. So if it's not the tactical combat they've been successful for, what was it?

I'm not arguing that their fans are not in it for the LARPing. I'm saying that that hardly counts as pushing the genre forward. And I'm also saying that if they really had been interested in creating virtual worlds for people to immerse themselves in, making very reactive games would have been the way to do it. But they didn't, and if we're talking about RPG "evolution", Bioware represents a dead end.

 

[KateMicucci]

Troubleshooter: Abandoned Children (2020), Dungeon of Naheulbeuk (2020), and Urtuk: The Desolation (2021), among others.

This is a very happy development. For decades I put up with shit combat and never realized it until a few years ago when games finally started getting it right.

 

[KateMicucci]

I think Underrail pushed the genre forward as an expanded and improved Fallout 1.

 

[0sacred]

I think Underrail pushed the genre forward as an expanded and improved Fallout 1.

improved as in ripped out the dialogue system?

 

[Modron]

I'd say indies have been the ones pushing the genre forward for the last decade, Dex's take on sidescrolling RPG where character build choice/augments change gameplay a lot stealth/hacking/melee/full guns blazing. Vigilantes kind of harking back to late 80s dropping a layer of exploration/business/missions on a tile grid map of a city and being fairly open plot progression wise. The Friends of Ringo Ishikawa, a melancholic slice of life River City Ransom like life sim with lots of stats to improve, tight daily schedules, lots of combat styles to learn/master, jobs/schoolwork to do or not do, balanced against story missions here and there. Titan Outpost for making a full blown rpg with no combat that is a proper RPG and not a VN.

But like others have said it's the regression to late 90s/early 2000s sensibilities that I've been having the most fun with in recent years with ATOM RPG, Brigand Oaxaca, Fallout Nevada/Resurrection, Archalos, Bloodstained, play testing new reverse engineered updates for Prelude to Darkness, and probably more I can't recall at the moment.

 

[KateMicucci]

I think Underrail pushed the genre forward as an expanded and improved Fallout 1.

improved as in ripped out the dialogue system?

Was there supposed to be something special about Fallout 1's dialog system? If there was I don't remember or miss it.