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Why don't developers publish their own games?

Andhaira

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Sure if you are an inexperianced developer you need a publishers market know how and contacts. But if yo are a large publisher who is very experianced and with good contacts of your own (bioware, obsidian, etc) why don't you pblish your own games? That way you get to make what you want, and release it when you want.

The only real advatages to having a large publisher is that:

1) They pay salaries, wages,cover costs etc DURING production.
2)They have the contacts to get the game into the marketplace.

But large developers should be able to cover these things on their own with their own experiance, pooled money, retained earnings, bank loans and facilities, etc.

At the very least, as broadband and faster connections become more common, devs can offer their games for direct download instead of simply retail.
 

JarlFrank

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Publishing yourself = really fucking expensive and you won't have any sponsors who give you money so you can survive until the game is finished.
 

Andhaira

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Did you even bother to read my post or did you just glance and the title and then rabidly type up a reply?
 

JarlFrank

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Even the big developers have to live from something during the development time. Retail publishing is expensive especially since you first have to buy all the machines that print DVDs, game boxes and manuals, I guess. Those are expensive. Online publishing only is something most big guys don't want, so they stick to the big publishers. They know that this way, they are on the safe side and will more likely than not make a profit. Self-publishing is a risk, and not many developers are ready to take risks nowadays.
 

racofer

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Yes, that would be a good idea. If I was a developer, I would probably name my distribution system as something that reflects this new "cloud computing" everyone is talking about, something that resembles this new technology but that doesn't sound too obvious. Something that allows me to directly release patches and so all games around the globe would be updated simultaneously. And perhaps if all goes well, I could make this service available to other developers as well. Also, It would be possible to control that only one computer uses that purchased software at a time, something like a digital rights management system.

The major benefit of such system would be reduced game prices, because no physical medias would be required, no stores with employees to maintain, and of course, prices would be all in dollars since it's the system's native currency, so I wouldn't have to do stupid things such as 1 dollar = 1 euro, who would be as stupid as that? That would be like shooting myself in the foot. Also, I wouldn't use this "cloud computing" service to promote itself, as in, I wouldn't release a game with a purposely unbalanced level just so later I could justify the dumbing down to one of the benefits of using such a system, that monitors what everyone is doing on their single player games, and of course, offer no way to roll back such a change. Let alone include DRM stuff like securom and starforce on my already DRM system! Why on earth would I include a DRM inside my DRM?
 

Andhaira

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Well taking a facility from a bank should allow them to survive until the game is published.

BUt i just found it funny that there doesn't seem to be even one example of a self publishing developer! OTOH many publishers do have in house developers and developer houses, such as Interplay and Black Isle.
 

JarlFrank

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Yeah, that's probably because the developer would first have to buy all the necessary machinery to produce retail games if he wants to do self-publishing and go retail. That's why the only self-publishers we got are the indies.
 

Andhaira

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But the publishers aren't just going to sit there and let this happen;. Take EA for example. Surely they will try to do something...maybe create some type of need.

Maybe like Valves Steam.
 

Wyrmlord

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Andhaira, I have studied enough of business and entrepreneurship to explain why developers don't publish their own games.

Game development involves huge sunk costs and a long operating cycle. Sunk costs are expenses that are not recoverable. There will be many sunk costs in the early stage of development, because no developer commits itself to a project immediately. There is a conceptual stage and a testing stage, and if the project proves unfeasible, it is abandoned. Many projects are abandoned just like that. Minimum financing is provided at this point and it's mostly the developer's own financial resources that get flushed into it.

Now, once they give a green light to their own project, they need to use this project to generate enough revenues to cover those sunk costs themselves. Moreover, throughout the stage of development, there will be a long stage of cash outflows, and due to the long operating cycle i.e. a long time between the development of their product and its sale as a finished good - there is a high working capital requirement already commited to the project.

A developer's ability to generate revenues on its project will be based on the quality and the features of the actual product, and this will be a cost that they will be directly able to recover. And it will be these revenues that will cover all the initial sunk costs of the developer. But the margin on those revenues to cover those sunk costs will only be reduced by any other additional costs. Hence non-core functions must be outsourced to an outsider - hence a publisher.

Moreso, a developer undertaking publishing activities will increase the entire scale of operations of the enterprise, expanding it beyond merely the development of the project to the marketing and publishing of it - meaning additional capital requirements to fund those activities, including both fixed costs in a department to undertake this activity and working capital for keeping it running. And this ties in more capital into an enterprise which is already high on capital requirement.

Now, the sales of the product will depend on its quality and features, which are the focus of the development unit. Since it depends on those factors, additional capital in a marketing and publishing units will not increase the sales of it, meaning that there is a drastically reduced return on capital, which is further slashed down by the increased debt service coverage from the increased financing, leaving them with less money to cover the long running development costs, let alone the costs remaining marketing and publishing units, and let alone even the original sunk costs that were dumped into the company in the first place.

So, they need to outsource these incidental functions to an outsider, so they can work with less capital, and make stronger returns with it, so that they will be in a better position to cover the sunk costs and costs of the long running operations.
 

Annie Mitsoda

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What Wyrmlord said. I was gonna be like "it's too expensive" but he used his smarty-talk and made it sound better. SO YES.

Making games is a gamble. Even for devs working for peanuts, you still have to deal with the costs of the equipment - computers, dev kits, software, etc. - and if you're releasing for consoles, you have to get the approval of the manufacturer (Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo) - and they each have their own approval processes and requirements. AND you have to deal with getting things rated by the ESRB, if you're US, at least. Then the cost of getting the thing fully bugtested, and when you're done, you've got MARKETING costs, so people know about your game!

It's a tremendous ongoing cost. It CAN be done, but it requires significantly more work for higher risk than the publisher system. Don't get me wrong, I don't like the current setup, and wish there was more private investment in games - and yes, systems like Steam are an excellent method of getting games to gamers without a publisher being as deeply involved - but it's only a start, and not a be-all-end-all finishing point. If I knew what that was, I would be making a HELL of a lot more money than I am right now.

Also the original Godfather game sold - what - easily less than a million copies, sales I believe were shabby at best. And it cost them 67 million to make. OOPS!

...see, it's figures like THAT - the preposterousness of it - that make me wonder why instead of putting all their eggs into one basket, publishers have a fund for smaller, risker titles - original IPs, likely - to give them a chance. Like R&D at any good company. You put emphasis on your original product, but always keep out an eye for new ideas. Alas for this.
 

St. Toxic

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Cut out marketting and publishing expenses, and what's left? Hardware and software costs can be kept at a reasonable low; licences dito. We're talking wages and bills.
 

King Crispy

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Ossian Studios is an example of a company that's looking to change the way things are done. Granted, they've only worked on two expansions for NWN so far, both having, shall we say... issues... actually being released, but they've managed to clear all the hurdles that previously prevented the existence of a true software development cybercompany.

Say what you will about the quality of their work -- if they manage to put out some successful products and continue to grow, they've got a formula for a much higher ROI model compared to the conventional companies out there. Each of their employees handles their own expenses, and are paid solely for their work. Imagine if they could publish their own games someday. That would be pretty revolutionary.

P.S. Atari sucks.
 

dragonfk

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Cd Project made and published their own game. And even for an unknown brand they did rather well.
 

St. Toxic

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dragonfk said:
Cd Project made and published their own game. And even for an unknown brand they did rather well.

Didn't they start out as publishers, though, expanding only later into game development?
 

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