Game News Phantom Doctrine Released

[Infinitron]

Tags: CreativeForge Games; Phantom Doctrine

Almost a year ago, following up on the success of 2015's Hard West, CreativeForge Games announced Phantom Doctrine, a Cold War espionage-themed turn-based tactics game. Phantom Doctrine's unique setting, interesting-sounding mechanics and impressive production values made it one of our community's more anticipated games, outshining numerous other similar titles. The frequent presence of friendly lead designer Kacper Szymczak surely helped too. The game's not really an RPG, but it's close enough to deserve a release post from us. Here's the launch trailer:

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Unfortunately, despite positive early previews, Phantom Doctrine has not reviewed very well. Among the faults cited by reviewers are its unusual deterministic combat system, line of sight issues, an underwhelming story, and poorly balanced mechanics. But does the Codex feel the same way? Well, some of us do. Yeah, this game is going to be one of those controversial flawed gems - although CreativeForge are working hard to improve it. If you want to give it a try, Phantom Doctrine is available now on Steam and GOG for the price of $40, with a 10% launch discount until next week.

 

[luj1]

Contemporary music in trailers sucks monkey balls.

 

[Roguey]

Among the faults cited by reviewers are its unusual deterministic combat system

lukaszek btfo

 

[Naraya]

Steam reviews are merciless.

 

[lukaszek]

deterministic system > RNG

 

[Invictus]

So far the comments are that the game is a bit undercooked, both on its combat and some of it’s mechanics but other than that it looks very cool
Will probably buy it down the line but my backlog is simply oscene and I just got Bard’s Tale and waiting for BT4

 

[Lyre Mors]

So far the comments are that the game is a bit undercooked, both on its combat and some of it’s mechanics but other than that it looks very cool
Will probably buy it down the line but my backlog is simply oscene and I just got Bard’s Tale and waiting for BT4

Seems like CreativeForge is addressing many of the issues people have with the game. I think we're going to have a much improved game after a month or two of patching and tweaking.

That said, having a really great time with this game anyway, despite some of its issues.

 

[Tiospo]

The game really appeals to me, and sounds like the flaws are quite fixable.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

If you're on the fence, wait for the LOS tweaks if nowt else.

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

hate 'always hit' combat. I understand that if you average hits and misses and just make a small amount of damage every attack it is supposedly the same. But thematically and strategically it is quite different. In always hit combat there is no penalty and no reason to not take unrealistic pot shots from 300 yards. In fact it might be smart to do so. Averaging hits is not the same as missing a few times, but having hits be important and grave in affect. I think this 'deterministic' idea is something that for whatever reason appeals to millennials and morons (I know... I repeat myself) who think 'missing' means the game is completely reliant on 'randomness'.

I am not sure why the younger generation (despite supposedly being computer natives) can't understand what %'s mean, or how managing chance is not 'random'. It fucking pisses me off. These are the morons who love 'tight' (simple) mechanics and crowd around heaping praise on those horrible German board games like 'Settlers of Catan' or worse, ones where you play an entire game which has you managing the various dyes of a the always fascinating 'fabric merchant' world, or perhaps running some countries electric grid...they think for some reason that these games are the are absolute peak of design and efficiency. These idiots should made fun of mercilessly and are a foul and terrible locus of decline.

 

[screeg]

I've never seen a correlation between age and the eternal whining about RNG and how it's gimped and the dice hate me and it's so unfair and I missed three 80% THCs in a row!! Explain that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
Did someone in their 20s kill your parents or something?

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

I've never seen a correlation between age and the eternal whining about RNG and how it's gimped and the dice hate me and it's so unfair and I missed three 80% THCs in a row!! Explain that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11
Did someone in their 20s kill your parents or something?

No they ruined RPG's and strategy games however. The board game shit I mentioned is because I have a brother 20 years younger than me and him and his friends are constantly playing those shitty german style board games and think they are really well designed compared to more monocled and proper board games like DAK II, World In flames, Atlantic Wall etc...

They are also constantly going on about this type of thing with regards to RNG and chance. I have defiantly seen a correlation between age and like/dislike for RNG and dice usage in strategy and computer games. Its very evident. Perhaps you are not aware of it because maybe you are younger too? Sort of like the fish who when questioned about the water asks "WTF is water?"

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

hate 'always hit' combat. I understand that if you average hits and misses and just make a small amount of damage every attack it is supposedly the same. But thematically and strategically it is quite different. In always hit combat there is no penalty and no reason to not take unrealistic pot shots from 300 yards. In fact it might be smart to do so. Averaging hits is not the same as missing a few times, but having hits be important and grave in affect. I think this 'deterministic' idea is something that for whatever reason appeals to millennials and morons (I know... I repeat myself) who think 'missing' means the game is completely reliant on 'randomness'.

I am not sure why the younger generation (despite supposedly being computer natives) can't understand what %'s mean, or how managing chance is not 'random'. It fucking pisses me off. These are the morons who love 'tight' (simple) mechanics and crowd around heaping praise on those horrible German board games like 'Settlers of Catan' or worse, ones where you play an entire game which has you managing the various dyes of a the always fascinating 'fabric merchant' world, or perhaps running some countries electric grid...they think for some reason that these games are the are absolute peak of design and efficiency. These idiots should made fun of mercilessly and are a foul and terrible locus of decline.

Infinitron, you often comment about my agenda, and I must admit that I am very happy to hear that you know my goals and more importantly perhaps, my destiny... since you bring this up so often I figure it must be true and would therefore appreciate it if you would let me know what my actual agenda is because I seem to have forgot and lost my way... truly I feel most days are filled with nothing but aimless tasks lacking purpose or meaning. I would love to feel that feeling of having some overriding goal to help make the everyday toil feel less pointless... so with that said I eagerly look forward to your guidance which I shall use to re-illuminate the path I have seemed to have lost... TIA...

 

[Lyre Mors]

Wanted to re-post my little mini-review/impressions of the game so far from the thread in Tactical Gaming forum, since a lot of people don't usually go there.

Here if anyone wants to join the discussion.

I have to say after playing for awhile with full knowledge of the FOS/FOV and sidestep mechanics, I'm not having any trouble with the system at all. It certainly needs to be something better communicated to the player ingame, but it seems to work pretty well overall. Been having a lot of fun in combat, including full-combat missions. I don't feel that the deterministic system that awareness brings to the table is nearly as detrimental as that found in Divinity Original Sin 2, for example. Enemies starting out with zero awareness at the beginning of combat evens things out nicely, and it's not that difficult to wear it down or re-position and get the upper hand. That being said, I think that the planned improvements of the system seem like they will not only pacify users who continue to be confused, but also make things run more smoothly overall.

Stealth could use more urgency, and does seem a little too abstract, even for someone like me who understands and enjoys abstractions in video games. Entering a trespassing zone in front of a guard just feels wrong. I really like the general flow of it though: initial recon of the area pre-engagement, staking out the location, disabling cameras and infrared barriers, finding out who in your crew is capable of taking down an opponent, and what is the best way to approach a breaching situation. I think with a little more tweaking of AI behavior, this could be a really unique and great turn-based stealth system.

I've been overall pleased with the world map management. I like that it utilizes your actual agents, and therefore puts you in tight places if you don't plan accordingly. Send a good agent on a stakeout at the wrong time, and I'm regretting it, but with a smile on my face. It could be fleshed out more, and I suspect it will be in future updates, but overall it is engaging.

What has really become apparent to me is how important character and equipment progression is to success in this game, which is something that I really enjoy. I've started over my campaign a couple times and noticed a significant improvement in my overall mission success having paid careful attention to who I'm sending out in the field, and who could use improvement. I have to also emphasize how important looting is. Try to loot at least one or two crates throughout each mission, if not all of them. You'll find that you not only have a plethora of much improved equipment to use, but also more things to buy in general. This emphasis on equipment and character progression in a game like this is very enjoyable once you understand its integral nature to your overall success. Things like unlocking agents and equipment through found intel are great touches, not to mention the particularly rewarding agent rescue missions. Once you get a number of top-tier agents working for you, the fire you're taking from enemies seems much less daunting.

Bottom line is that I keep coming back and having fun, even though I'm trying to hold out for the new patches. This unique amalgamation of mechanics is not shit, it's just difficult and sometimes confusing to adapt to when you're coming from other games. This is a different type of game than just a straight turn-based combat simulator or stealth game. It's trying a lot of different things, struggling at times, but ultimately coming across to me as intriguing and addictive.

For those interested, been playing on hard without reloading missions once they begin, but admittedly save scumming on the world map occasionally. Still in chapter one KGB with a few level 5 agents. Total playtime including restarts is 17 hours.

 

[Fenix]

I am not sure why the younger generation (despite supposedly being computer natives) can't understand what %'s mean, or how managing chance is not 'random'.

Quite simple - appearing of things like calculator and later computers led to a situations where people don't use their brain, they don't NEED to understand how things works, because computta doing things for them, instead them.
So it's pretty logical to see every next generation to be dumber, and that's not even talking about specifics of modern education system, that only synergizes with dullness.

Infinitron

Whiny little autist won't answer.

 

[holla_cabezas_de_mierda]

I am not sure why the younger generation (despite supposedly being computer natives) can't understand what %'s mean, or how managing chance is not 'random'.

Quite simple - appearing of things like calculator and later computers led to a situations where people don't use their brain, they don't NEED to understand how things works, because computta doing things for them, instead them.
So it's pretty logical to see every next generation to be dumber, and that's not even talking about specifics of modern education system, that only synergizes with dullness.

Infinitron

Whiny little autist won't answer.

yes and what someone said on another thread makes sense to me too..he brought up that he thought x-com RNG would get much less complaints if it had a dodge animation. I think this is likely true, because younger people are less familiar with board games and abstractions, such as the 'miss' being due to a dodge, but the game not actually visually showing it.

One reason I believe this is part of the issue is because often times one of the complaints I hear about RNG is that it is unrealistic and makes no sense that a guy who has been practicing with a sword his whole life could stand in front of somebody who is 'not moving' and be unable to 'hit' the person. The idiots seem to believe that in Turn based combat what is being shown on the screen is literal--that the opponent is literally just standing there not moving and waiting for their opponent to attack. Furthermore they seem to also believe that a 'miss' means they completely whiffed instead of that the attack was ineffective for whatever reason. They don't seem to understand that hit and miss are are abstractions and the words used for simplicity's sake and not because it literally is describing the attack result.

Another method that might help is that misses could help lower defenses as they occur to simulate setting the opponent up for the next attack. That would work better in close melee combat perhaps, although in range combat it could simulate destroying cover or something. In this way people might feel their misses were not totally wasted. The positive misses could perhaps only occur on attacks with a greater than 70% chance to hit or something and misses at higher % chances could lower defenses more than ones at lower % chances...

 

[Konjad]

sooner or later i will probably get it, but for now i'll wait until it's patched up. no reason to buy it on release date