Review Gothic 3 vs Oblivion at Gamers Europe

[Vault Dweller]

Tags: Gothic III; Piranha Bytes

<a href=http://www.gamerseurope.com>Gamers Europe</a> has posted a negative <a href=http://www.gamerseurope.com/articles/821>review</a> of <a href=http://www.gothic3.com>Gothic 3</a>, giving it 6/10 because it's not as awesome as Oblivion:
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<blockquote>Gothic 3 as an RPG is a fair contribution to a crowded genre (? - VD) where a few notable games shine brightly. One of these is a game called The Elder Scrolls 4: Oblivion. Both are RPG games with similar ideas. Gothic 3 alludes to competing with Oblivion, but it is beaten in sheer scope and completeness. As I mentioned of Jowood, parts of Gothic 3 are quite obviously unfinished, most notably some of the towns in the desert where details trail off like an old coot telling a rambling story that doesn’t appear to be going anywhere. Or something like that. There can be a lengthy debate about which game is better but I’ll save us all time and say that Oblivion wins on panache. Everything about it is just somehow slightly better. If I had to pick the tie breaker, it’d be the memory leaks issuing forth from Gothic 3. Although Piranha Bytes developers such as Carsten say these are due to be fixed, my belief is that such a high level of community involvement is unprofessional. By all means, appoint a community representative to voice concerns to the development team, but don’t waste valuable time posting in forums when there is a job to be done.
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When Oblivion shipped it looked like a fine block of polished marble. Gothic 3 shipped looking like a slice of pizza on a Sunday, released into the world by its makers at a stage where it was only really half cooked. Many would regard such an offering with blatant indifference. Although it is gooey, grainy, raw and tasteless in places, a few minutes in the microwave fixes it right up.</blockquote>No comments.
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[Volourn]

And?

 

[MountainWest]

Although Piranha Bytes developers such as Carsten say these are due to be fixed, my belief is that such a high level of community involvement is unprofessional. By all means, appoint a community representative to voice concerns to the development team, but don’t waste valuable time posting in forums when there is a job to be done.

Eh? When every other site gives G3 abyssmal reviews because of it's bugs, PB shouldn't assure the community and potential costumers they are working to fix them? Yes, very unprofessional...

 

[OccupatedVoid]

Oblivious was more of a polished turd than a block of polished marble.

 

[Hazelnut]

The other big problem with Gothic 3 is one I’ll call ‘too many cooks’. With upwards of four companies behind the title, it’s no wonder the game has problems. Basic localisation issues crop up (I came across a quest title written in German) and there is utter lunacy surrounding the release schedule. Perhaps Aspyr Media want to release a working game to the U.S. Not a bad idea, but what will people think when they patch up straight past version 1.9? Shenanigans such as these conjure images of someone welding a wheel back onto a moving car, which isn’t a problem except that this is neither the first nor last time it will happen.

Obviously I could go on to mention the broken console, the inventory exploit bug (remember the Diablo dupe cheat? Similar thing here folks!), the inventory system in general, the hefty fall damage, the one hit kill bug (more of a consistency issue), copy protection issues, the way the game doesn’t pause when you open the inventory, the quest system that’s based on dialog and maybe even the ridiculous idea that every fire in the land burns forever… but I think I’ve said enough.

 

[somnium]

i am not going to bother responding to the whole review, but i just had to comment on a few fragments because of the unbelievable idiocy.

Although Piranha Bytes developers such as Carsten say these are due to be fixed, my belief is that such a high level of community involvement is unprofessional. By all means, appoint a community representative to voice concerns to the development team, but don’t waste valuable time posting in forums when there is a job to be done.

Which is of course so much better then not posting on the forums and letting the fans do all the real fixing and expanding the game while they make money by selling mods that
are 1/10 to 5/10 of the quality.

There is no minimap or waypoint marker system (something that appeals to RPG fans), meaning that locations and geography need to be memorised. Part of the challenge perhaps, but sometimes this sort of thing is construed as a missing feature and shunned by RPG gamers who prefer knowing where to go.

what the fuck ?!

Obviously I could go on to mention the broken console, the inventory exploit bug (remember the Diablo dupe cheat? Similar thing here folks!), the inventory system in general, the hefty fall damage, the one hit kill bug (more of a consistency issue), copy protection issues, the way the game doesn’t pause when you open the inventory, the quest system that’s based on dialog

while he has a point in some of these things.
Since when is realism (hefty fall damage and not pausing when you are opening your inventory ) and actually having the game respond to what you say automatically a bad thing ?

Not only can't they review gothic 3 and rate it for it's unique strengths and weaknesses but instead they do a point by point comparison to oblivion. But they still mange to fill it with an astounding amount of contradiction and hypocrisy.
Like the "difficulty" of getting way stones and the missing in game walkthrough is automatically seen as a bad point. That the RAI comparaison versus the Gothic AI is never made.
they whine about the duplication bug and how the company relies on the community for it fixes while it is the same with oblivions, if not worse

 

[aweigh]

That review is priceless. And here I thought all europeans were "smart".

 

[suibhne]

Wow. I'm starting to see the wisdom of Rumsfeld's point that we should nuke Old Europe and move on.

Many of the recent G3 reviews have confirmed the bitterest cynics among us: Oblivion broadly influenced reviewers' ideas of good game design. Non-RPG fans are now reviewing RPGs with the expectation that they be "like Oblivion" - and post-Oblivion, all RPG/adventure games are expected to be designed for total fucking morons.

 

[Texas Red]

Wow. I'm starting to see the wisdom of Rumsfeld's point that we should nuke Old Europe and move on.

Eh? Old Europe made Gothic while America created Oblivion in the first place.

 

[fizzelopeguss]

Trying to troll like volourn, he's simply not in the same league though.

 

[WittyName]

Not much to pick apart. He states Oblivion is a better game and more 'polished' but doesn't get into too many specifics. I agree with his main critiques of combat and the overall bugs related to memory, etc. He's probably right that Oblivion was more polished when it was released but that doesn't necessarily make it a better game.

 

[Texas Red]

Hmmm, Gothic 3 seems like a source of positive reviews for *Oblivion*. And during the holidays... what luck.

 

[The Vanished One]

I've seen worse reviews.

imo G3 and Oblivion are not so similar, and Oblivion should not be held as a standard to review games.

btw, Italy's most important PC games magazine gave G3 9/10 a month ago. Maybe is too much, but they also gave 9 to Oblivion.

 

[flushfire]

Although Piranha Bytes developers such as Carsten say these are due to be fixed, my belief is that such a high level of community involvement is unprofessional. By all means, appoint a community representative to voice concerns to the development team, but don’t waste valuable time posting in forums when there is a job to be done.

wtf. developers shouldn't even take a bath, it's unprofessional.

not a big fan of G3, but developers spending some time talking to the consumers is always good imo.

 

[Perishiko]

the hefty fall damage, the way the game doesn’t pause when you open the inventory, the quest system that’s based on dialog

my belief is that such a high level of community involvement is unprofessional.

I'm confused... These are all negative things?

 

[HardCode]

Just another bunch of morons who received an "incentive" check from Bethesda, I bet.

 

[Zomg]

The worst thing about hype victims is that they can't really acknowledge that they were scammed - the cognitive dissonance is just too much. So, the only way they can deal with the guilt of pretending to like things that are transparently vapid is, insidiously, to infect others, spread the shame around and indemnify themselves in case anyone goes, "Wait a minute..."

 

[Vidken]

This in turn speaks ill of the AI. Gothic 3 has gone to a lot of trouble to try and make Orcs seem cunning but after you realise that they can’t counter a simple attack, the whole system falls flat on its face. My pet brick could finish the game if it were placed atop left click.

Yeah, since Oblivion combat is just so challenging and unpredictable.

Yes indeed, the nameless hero appears to be the only biped in the entire game that can jump up onto rocks, roofs and boxes. This allows ludicrous attacks such as the bow or crossbow attack mentioned above.

We could also state that the only character that physically jumps in Oblivion is the player, and how they can kill anything with the newbie flare spell by standing on a rock and sniping, but that would be inconvenient for our comparison.

Sound is somewhat repetitive. I would wager that the average game of Gothic 3 will have the words “nothing to be had (here)” said over 200 times.

NPCs talking about mudcrabs every other time they open their mouth is just so much better.

...the inventory exploit bug (remember the Diablo dupe cheat? Similar thing here folks!), the inventory system in general...

Because not only did Oblivion not have a dupe bug, but it's really cool that you can only see six fucking items at a time in the inventory!

 

[Shoelip]

Wow, reading that quote from the review was like watching Peter on Family Guy. Well except that it's not a parody, but a real person, so there's the pity factor.

 

[stargelman]

It's like there's a contest with a huge cash prize for the most idiotic review making the most idiotic (and deeply flawed) comparissons between Oblivion and Gothic. Most of what is critizised of G3 is also present in Oblivion, except the incredible amount of bugs.

 

[Shoelip]

True, true, Oblivion only had a medium number of bugs.

 

[whatusername]

Oblivion had more game design flaws than bugs, like the quest compass and "I saw a mudcrab the other day"/"I heard the Fighters Guild is recruiting".

 

[Perishiko]

like the quest compass

I just thought everyone payed for the version with an in-game walkthrough... How confused was I?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

the way the game doesn’t pause when you open the inventory

This sounds the kind of complaint that Baldur's Gate fans made back in the day, complaining how it was too difficult to manage the inventory with enemies attacking at the same time. Seriously, what's up with that? It always striked me as a fairly balanced thing - have hotkeys for quick items to be used in combat, but if you need to search the bottom of your backpack for an item because of your lack of preparation then you should suffer the consequences in combat.

Challenge, you're dead. And I hardly knew ye.

 

[Texas Red]

the way the game doesn’t pause when you open the inventory

This sounds the kind of complaint that Baldur's Gate fans made back in the day, complaining how it was too difficult to manage the inventory with enemies attacking at the same time. Seriously, what's up with that? It always striked me as a fairly balanced thing - have hotkeys for quick items to be used in combat, but if you need to search the bottom of your backpack for an item because of your lack of preparation then you should suffer the consequences in combat.

Challenge, you're dead. And I hardly knew ye.

That was an issue? How about, I dont know, pressing pause before opening the inventory?

 

[Admiral Rimjob POOBUM]

The most idiotic part of that particular complaint; though the game doesn't technically PAUSE when in inventory, enemies can't harm or otherwise effect you at all.