Interview Hordes chit chat at GameBanshee

[Saint_Proverbius]

Tags: BioWare; Neverwinter Nights: Hordes of the Underdark

<a href="http://www.gamebanshee.com">GameBanshee</a> sports a shiny, new <A href="http://www.gamebanshee.com/interviews/nwn3-1.php">interview</a> with the <a href="http://www.bioware.com">BioWare</a> gang making <A href="http://nwn.bioware.com/underdark">Hordes of the Underdark</a> where they ask such questions as if the new xpac will feature 3.5 things, gaining your way to 40th level, and this on the classes:
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<blockquote><b>GB: Can you provide any hints as to what the remaining prestige classes, feats, or spells that you're adding with the expansion will be?</b>
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<b>Darcy:</b> We are adding 6 new prestige classes for Hordes of the Underdark: the Dwarven Defender, which turns a Dwarf fighter into a immovable battle machine; the Champion of Torm, which is an absolute bane to evil and can kill powerful evil creatures in one hit; the Pale Master, who specializes in the black arts of the undead; the Shifter, a class that can take on the shape and abilities of both animals and monsters; and the Weapon Master, a powerful fighting machine. Last but not least, there is the Red Dragon Disciple. This class gains some of the strength and abilities of a red dragon. The BioWare community requested all of these new classes and we hope they enjoy them.</blockquote>
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And what a great bunch of requests those are.
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Spotted this at <A href="http://www.homelanfed.com">HomeLAN Fed</a>

 

[EEVIAC]

And what a great bunch of requests those are.

Heh, why am I not surprised. There's the Necro and the Druid from D2, and four killing machines - one of which features the ubiquitous dragon. Where's Barrel Master?

Years of adventuring have allowed you to gain an intimate and innate knowledge of barrels, crates and other common storage containers. Barrels sense your caring countenance and open at the merest mention of your presence, bestowing the master with extra coinage and imbibing extra magical properties to any item stored therein.

 

[Voss]

I love true but meaningless statements.

The BioWare community requested all of these new classes

Of course they did. But, really, is there a single prestige class that some member of the community didn't request?

 

[Sol Invictus]

I want my Ale Mug Proficiency.

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Of course they did. But, really, is there a single prestige class that some member of the community didn't request?

Any that aren't really overpowered?

 

[Voss]

Depends what you mean by over powered, really.

The Champion of Torm looks. A pseudo paladin, with some of the same abilities. The only advantage they really get is the divine wrath which grants a hit/damage bonus and 5 points of damage reduction for rounds = charisma. All the other abilities they get are underpowered compared to the paladin version. Hmm, upon checking maybe not... the save bonus increases every other level, and lay on hands is the same. the wrath is only once/day though, as is smite.
Oh and they get bonus feats every two levels. (except weapon specialization)
Fighters: too too obsolete.
A fighter 4/paladin 4/ champion ++ will have disgusting saves, a host of special abilities and a good spread of feats, including weapon specialization. Perfect for the combat focus of NWN.
Note on this one- the background fluff really got screwed. Torm's a LG god, probably the main patron of paladins in the realms. Why make the class (deveoted to a LG god) a paladin sub open to all non-evil alignments? And of course, why make it an up powered paladin/fighter cross with most of the good points of both classes?


Pale master- not sure. It depends what random way they decided to implement it. The PnP version gets extra undead related abilities (animate, bone armor, create greater undead) in exchange for getting caster levels every other level instead of each level.

Dwarven defender is fairly standard- a defensive ability, similar to rage, class bonus to AC, uncanny dodge, ultimate tank, really. d12 hit dice. Expect AC to be above 30, particularly with tower shields and full plate. Nicely fits the dwarven character though

what they did with the Shifter annoys me- druid only. Because somehow a check for polymorph self in spells known is hard.
potentially very nasty though if they get critters special abilities- the basilisk, medusa and mind flayer shapes in particular. Personally I think this is one of the more interesting prestige classes, even if it can get over the top rather quickly Weaker than the PnP version, just because of the limited forms. I wonder if Weapon Focus: unarmed strike is going to work with natural weapons...
This might not be too over powered- a power focused player might be better off staying as a druid or mage, and getting by with polymorph or wild-shape and waiting for the 9th level shapechange spell and/or the druid's elemental forms. (plus all those other spells they'd get that way.)

Weaponmaster can make fighters really frightening. Boosting the threat range by 2 on top of improved crit (and possibly keen) and increasing the weapon multiplier (there isn't a times/day restriction listed on the web site like there is for the PnP version either) Scythe masters are going to be running rampant. Crit on a 15+ for x5 damage.
Or a 10+ for a scimitar, for x2. Odds are, if you hit, you crit.
Whee!
I am so glad this stuff doesn't stack in 3.5 anymore.
Ah, requires a +5 BAB, but 6 feats (which only a 5th level human fighter can have) Others will have to wait until level 6 to meet the requirements.

Dragon Disciple- eh. If it weren't for the stat bonuses in the PnP version, this class would be no big deal. Not sure what the bio version will look like. I hope they drop the stat bonuses- bonuses inherent in class automatically break the balance of the game, particularly when using point buy to begin with. +8 str, +2 con, +2 cha, +2 int, and +4 natural armor will make any warrior-type's day. Lose a bit off of BAB (particular since you need to have sorcerer or bard levels) but the strength boost alone compensates for it. Plus the breath weapon, extra spells...
Well.

On the one hand, they seem a better selection than SoU. Nice to see some warrior classes, but they seem to have gone over board. Casters could use something- (though I'm not sure if they got around the hard coded problem with adding spell caster levels) So they may not have given the DD and pale master spells. Its entirely possibly they didn't, since neither is a spell heavy PrC.

Random thoughts... the Pale Master, Shifter and Dragon Disciple can be interesting from a role playing perspective, particularly the first two, rather than stat-boost disciple.
The other three give you very good reasons why you shouldn't bother playing a vanilla fighter. Or at least, not for very long. Though both the champion and DD require a +7 BAB, so thats seven fighter levels.

 

[Voss]

Heh. Or did you mean, are there prestige classes that aren't over powered?

Answer:
Well...
It depends on how you judge such things. The harper scout jumps to mind, as does the shadow dancer, though other opinions may vary.

 

[Elwro]

Virtuoso?

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

The Champion of Torm looks. A pseudo paladin, with some of the same abilities. The only advantage they really get is the divine wrath which grants a hit/damage bonus and 5 points of damage reduction for rounds = charisma. All the other abilities they get are underpowered compared to the paladin version. Hmm, upon checking maybe not... the save bonus increases every other level, and lay on hands is the same. the wrath is only once/day though, as is smite.

Oh and they get bonus feats every two levels. (except weapon specialization)
Fighters: too too obsolete.
A fighter 4/paladin 4/ champion ++ will have disgusting saves, a host of special abilities and a good spread of feats, including weapon specialization. Perfect for the combat focus of NWN.

Saves really depends on the module/game as to whether or not they're really worth it, but the feat increase alone makes up for anything they lack the Paladin has.

Note on this one- the background fluff really got screwed. Torm's a LG god, probably the main patron of paladins in the realms. Why make the class (deveoted to a LG god) a paladin sub open to all non-evil alignments? And of course, why make it an up powered paladin/fighter cross with most of the good points of both classes?

Good question. Why would Torm have paladins to begin with if there's Champions of Torm?

Pale master- not sure. It depends what random way they decided to implement it. The PnP version gets extra undead related abilities (animate, bone armor, create greater undead) in exchange for getting caster levels every other level instead of each level.

How many times a day can they do these things? If it's three times a day each, then we're talking a serious army type character. However, I doubt NWN's pathfinding can handle that.

Dwarven defender is fairly standard- a defensive ability, similar to rage, class bonus to AC, uncanny dodge, ultimate tank, really. d12 hit dice. Expect AC to be above 30, particularly with tower shields and full plate. Nicely fits the dwarven character though

So, basically, a fighter that's really, really hard to hit.. And when you do, has more hitpoints? Nothing else?

what they did with the Shifter annoys me- druid only. Because somehow a check for polymorph self in spells known is hard.

That makes no sense. Surely they could simply check and see if the character has learned a spell or even has access to it.

potentially very nasty though if they get critters special abilities- the basilisk, medusa and mind flayer shapes in particular. Personally I think this is one of the more interesting prestige classes, even if it can get over the top rather quickly Weaker than the PnP version, just because of the limited forms. I wonder if Weapon Focus: unarmed strike is going to work with natural weapons...

Good question.

Weaponmaster can make fighters really frightening. Boosting the threat range by 2 on top of improved crit (and possibly keen) and increasing the weapon multiplier (there isn't a times/day restriction listed on the web site like there is for the PnP version either) Scythe masters are going to be running rampant. Crit on a 15+ for x5 damage.
Or a 10+ for a scimitar, for x2. Odds are, if you hit, you crit.

x5 damage?!

Dragon Disciple- eh. If it weren't for the stat bonuses in the PnP version, this class would be no big deal. Not sure what the bio version will look like. I hope they drop the stat bonuses- bonuses inherent in class automatically break the balance of the game, particularly when using point buy to begin with. +8 str, +2 con, +2 cha, +2 int, and +4 natural armor will make any warrior-type's day. Lose a bit off of BAB (particular since you need to have sorcerer or bard levels) but the strength boost alone compensates for it. Plus the breath weapon, extra spells...
Well.

Ummm.. Shit.. That's some serious stat upgrades! :shock:

 

[Spazmo]

That's why I hate prestige classes so much. Just because you suddenly decide you want to be extra devoted to being stealthy or being faithful to your god or even to your dragon fanclub, you suddenly get a heap of fucking ridiculous special abilities. I just don't understand why going from a paladin to a champion of Torm should give me more abilities. What, am I praying extra-hard? It just doesn't make sense. Prestige classes are a good idea, I think, but their execution--in NWN as much as in PnP--is so horrible.

 

[chrisbeddoes]

I WANT THONG BIATCH prestige classe.

Spesialz ability !!! using twin double edge lightsabers

Devoted to da Hookerz god !!!!!

 

[Voss]

Well, lets see. Questions.

Dwarven defender. theres a flat AC bonus, the defensive stance ability is like barbarian rage... # of times/day based on level +2 str, +4 con, +4 dodge bonus to AC, lasts 3 +con bonus rounds. Also gets uncanny dodge

Pale master, times per day- once or twice per day, depending on the ability. The animate dead ability, in PnP is limited to 2x the character's level in hit dice of undead they can control. So more a small warband than an army... not sure how it will translate into NWN, though. Oh they also get a skeletal arm, which gives them +4 str and a variety of touch attacks they can use twice/day...culminating in a DC 17 death touch at 10th level.

x5 damage on the weaponmaster- well a scythe is normal a x4 damage critical. Increasing the multiplier bumps it to x5. And since its a two handed weapon and gives 1.5 times the strength bonus...