Interview Age of Decadence - Defining RPGs Once Again

[Jason]

Tags: Age of Decadence; Iron Tower

Prestigious UK magazine <a href="http://www.resolution-magazine.co.uk/index.htm" target="blank">Resolution</a> gave VD an opportunity to ramble on about kids these days with their real-time doodads and fancy cinematics.
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<blockquote>R: Last year, you published an article on the Iron Tower forum entitled "What's a role-playing game?" You seem to place an enormous emphasis on freedom of choice - not in a sandbox sense, but in terms of different ways of progressing within the set narrative. Is this what really defines a good RPG for you?
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VDW: It is. Maybe it's the age thing. I'm 38. I've played RPGs for more than 20 years. I remember being excited about killing monsters and leveling up. I remember reading "real time combat!" on a Dungeon Master box in 1987 and wondering what the hell that was supposed to mean. I remember being immersed in first person, real time Stonekeep, which had an insane five million dollar budget - back then it was so insane it was mentioned in the game's ads - and greatly enjoying it, although the game revolved around clearing several dozen dungeon levels with extreme prejudice. Being an RPG junkie, I've experienced it all, loved it all at some point, but now I want something more than killing monsters and watching "awesome" cinematics. I want to be able to decide what to do, when to do, and why. I want to decide, not to be told, who my allies and enemies are.
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I'd compare it to child's development. A child starts reading kids' books, then teens' books, and then finally progresses to a more serious literature, even if it's sci-fi or fantasy. Well, the problem with the gaming industry is that it keeps producing games that are suitable for the 8-12 age group.
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Going back to your question, when the novelty of killing monsters in the most visually spectacular manner wears off, freedom of choice becomes the main attraction.</blockquote>
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<a href="http://www.resolution-magazine.co.uk/issue4/interview_vincedweller.htm" target="blank">Read the full interview here.</a>
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<i>Thanks to asper for the tip.</i>

 

[User was nabbed fit]

VD fighting the good fight.

 

[Volourn]

Dumb interview. Exactly how is AOD 'more mature' or more directed at an 'older audience' than yoru typical RPG. AOD looks to be a good game; but I don't see anything new, original in this regard that keeps it apart from others. Just more typicla hype bullshit with no facts to back it up.

 

[User was nabbed fit]

Volourn fighting the powa.

 

[MetalCraze]

If only AoD had a chance to become a good game. For a humble indie VD acts too much like a showman and for an indie game it surrounded with too much hype, even if its hype is targeted at oldschool gamers.
Knowing how it usually turns out to be (see Drakensang, M&B and Eschalon) I think AoD may come out pretty mediocre (really with VDs constant oldschool buzzwords expectations may get too high) with some fanbois defending it on the Codex becuz itz VD's gaem and eventually forgetting about it.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Dumb interview. Exactly how is AOD 'more mature' or more directed at an 'older audience' than yoru typical RPG.

Reading is teh hard?

"...but now I want something more than killing monsters and watching "awesome" cinematics. I want to be able to decide what to do, when to do, and why. I want to decide, not to be told, who my allies and enemies are."

Compare it to games like Fallout 3, Drakensang, Mass Effect and hopefully you'll see what I mean.

AOD looks to be a good game; but I don't see anything new, original in this regard that keeps it apart from others. Just more typicla hype bullshit with no facts to back it up.

a) I've never, ever claimed that AoD is innovative, evolutionary, revolutionary, etc. Everything that AoD offers has been done before. The problem is such games have become very rare and are almost extinct.

b) The game offers plenty of gameplay affecting choices. We've posted more than a hundred dialogue screens backing up every promise we've ever made.

If only AoD had a chance to become a good game. For a humble indie VD acts too much like a showman ...

I am a showman. I assume you know what I do for a living.

...and for an indie game it surrounded with too much hype, even if its hype is targeted at oldschool gamers.

Yeah, I can see how too much awareness for an indie game is a problem. Nobody is supposed to know about indie games. The first rule of Fight Club ...

Knowing how it usually turns out to be (see Drakensang, M&B and Eschalon) I think AoD may come out pretty mediocre (really with VDs constant oldschool buzzwords expectations may get too high) with some fanbois defending it on the Codex becuz itz VD's gaem and eventually forgetting about it.

Hmm... for skyway that's pretty fucking optimistic.

 

[sqeecoo]

Skyway, go look at the let's play thread over at the AOD forums and tell me that's mediocre. If the rest of the game is half as good as that I'd be more than happy about it.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Recommended reading:

The merchant guild's first quest

Reputation in action

Lore effects on gameplay

Loremaster blowing things up

 

[Double Ogre]

C&C alone don't make a good RPG. If a game is boring, then it's boring, period. I'll keep an eye on AoD, but I don't have high hopes for it.

 

[Edward_R_Murrow]

This year, hopefully.

Thursday is coming...hopefully...maybe...probably not.

Anyway, I liked the reading age comparison, and I'm almost sure that a lot of people will get riled up by it thinking that it means VD is calling them dumb or immature when in reality it's about how the industry can't figure out how to chase more than one extremely fickle and sort of nebulously defined demographic.

C&C alone don't make a good RPG. If a game is boring, then it's boring, period. I'll keep an eye on AoD, but I don't have high hopes for it.

Curious. Doesn't the implementation of choices with consequences (when done well) and responses from the gameworld to your actions make for entertaining gameplay in most cases? That whole idea of seeing exactly what you can do, exploring every possibility based on your character, and experiencing the reactions. To me, that's as much "gameplay" as killing loads of monsters, solving puzzles, or such. But then again, I consider Torment's dialogue and exploration "gameplay" as well, so I'm probably a strange minority.

 

[MetalCraze]

I am a showman. I assume you know what I do for a living.

Not really.

Yeah, I can see how too much awareness for an indie game is a problem. Nobody is supposed to know about indie games. The first rule of Fight Club ...

No. What I'm saying is that every time you talk about AoD there are always some cool oldschool buzzwords that will warm the heart of any RPG gamer - and it really works much like mainstream hype with its "epic/dark n gritty". LP thread doesn't also make any good - want it or not as a developer you will show mostly the best parts of the game without showing bad parts - and already look at effects - interested people are going like "awsum gaem - so many C&C - turn-based combat - cool character development" - but at the same time forgetting that there are may be problems with everything else (balance, story, combat f.e.) - LP thread usually doesn't help it because it doesn't show it.

Hmm... for skyway that's pretty fucking optimistic.

I actually want AoD to turn out to be good. But with indie games that try to be oldschool and show that "look at how oldschool we are!" at every corner it usually doesn't end well.
AoD may turn out to be good game - but I still will remain cautiously unoptimistic considering all of the above.

 

[Gragt]

VO agreeing to everyone in order to preserve peace.



Nothing really new in this interview but more pimping for AoD isn't bad at all. Keep fighting the good fight, VD.

:respct: :volourn: :tubgirl: :codexdevil:

 

[BethesdaLove]

If only AoD wasnt set in "Rome" of some sort. Boy, I dislike Rome...
A possible Cthulhu game interests me already more then AoD.

 

[Darth Roxor]

skyway Yuma was a rebel
He roamed through the west
Did skyway Yuma, the rebel
He wandered alone

He got fightin' mad
This rebel lad
He packed no star
As he wandered far
Where the only law
Was a hook and a draw
The rebel, skyway Yuma

He searched the land
This restless lad
He was panther quick
And leather tough
If he figured that
He'd been pushed enough
The rebel, skyway Yuma

Fightin' mad
This rebel lad
With a dream he'd hold
'Til his dyin' breath
He'd search his soul
And gamble with death
The rebel, skyway Yuma

 

[Vault Dweller]

I am a showman. I assume you know what I do for a living.

Not really.

Vice-President, Sales & Marketing in an evil marketing company.

No. What I'm saying is that every time you talk about AoD there are always some cool oldschool buzzwords that will warm the heart of any RPG gamer - and it really works much like mainstream hype with its "epic/dark n gritty".

Except for we've backed up every promise and explained them in-game.

"Trust it, it will be cool" - hype
"Our game has this feature and here is a shitload of in-game examples illustrating this feature" - not hype

LP thread doesn't also make any good - want it or not as a developer you will show mostly the best parts of the game without showing bad parts...

I wanted to show the assassins questline. Instead I ended up showing what people wanted to see. Did you see any "uh, no, guys, I can't take you there yet because it's like too awesome" in the LP thread?

- and already look at effects - interested people are going like "awsum gaem - so many C&C - turn-based combat - cool character development" - but at the same time forgetting that there are may be problems with everything else (balance, story, combat f.e.) - LP thread usually doesn't help it because it doesn't show it.

Again, we've posted close to 200 dialogue screens. That's, like, a lot, skyway. That's more than a few quests. That's why some people like the game.

Anyway, there are other aspects, of course. We've shown some story elements and people seemed to like them. The combat videos and screens have shown the combat system. A combat demo will be released soon.

I actually want AoD to turn out to be good. But with indie games that try to be oldschool and show that "look at how oldschool we are!" at every corner it usually doesn't end well.

"Look at how old school we are?" You've probably mistaken AoD for some other game.

 

[Spectacle]

Vice-President, Sales & Marketing in an evil marketing company.

Going off topic, what exactly does a VP of sales & marketing at a marketing company do? Do you sell and market your company's services to potential clients, or are you a sort of executive VP who gets involved in everything?

I'm just curious, as an academic the ways of the business world are strange to me.

 

[fastpunk]

Troika's Temple of Elemental Evil, a turn-based DnD game, was the best selling Atari RPG in 2004 and the second best selling PC game, losing only to Unreal Tournament, which is quite an achievement for an isometric RPG.

No shit!? I was led to believe that it did poorly, this is pretty surprising. Out of curiosity, what's your source for this bit of info?

Anyway, twas a fine read, but nothing new or substantial. Still, it's nice to see AoD attracting some attention.

 

[The Feral Kid]

C&C alone don't make a good RPG. If a game is boring, then it's boring, period. I'll keep an eye on AoD, but I don't have high hopes for it.

Curious. Doesn't the implementation of choices with consequences (when done well) and responses from the gameworld to your actions make for entertaining gameplay in most cases? That whole idea of seeing exactly what you can do, exploring every possibility based on your character, and experiencing the reactions. To me, that's as much "gameplay" as killing loads of monsters, solving puzzles, or such. But then again, I consider Torment's dialogue and exploration "gameplay" as well, so I'm probably a strange minority.

C&C is an aspect that enhances an rpg but it doesn't "make" an rpg and it's not the sole factor to make an rpg "good". C&C should serve the game much like every other gameplay aspect and not be an end in itself as it seems to be the case with AoD. DA could well have C&C and still be the worst Bioware game to date.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Vice-President, Sales & Marketing in an evil marketing company.

Going off topic, what exactly does a VP of sales & marketing at a marketing company do? Do you sell and market your company's services to potential clients, or are you a sort of executive VP who gets involved in everything?

The sales part - making sure that sales budgets are met, which includes dealing with sales reps, sales managers, and corporate clients who request the pleasure of my company.

The marketing part goes hand-in-hand with the sales part. Making sure that potential customers are aware of what we offer and why they should do business with us instead of with our competitors.

Troika's Temple of Elemental Evil, a turn-based DnD game, was the best selling Atari RPG in 2004 and the second best selling PC game, losing only to Unreal Tournament, which is quite an achievement for an isometric RPG.

No shit!? I was led to believe that it did poorly, this is pretty surprising. Out of curiosity, what's your source for this bit of info?

Atari.

http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=4545

"Atari has released their 10-K report for their fiscal year that ended in March 2004. Interestingly enough, Temple of Elemental Evil was their numero uno PC CRPG during that year. The two expansion packs to Neverwinter Nights fell somewhat below that. The only strictly PC platform game to beat out ToEE in terms of sales was UT2004. It was the numero tres seller of all Atari's PC releases total."

Anyway, twas a fine read, but nothing new or substantial.

It was an awareness piece.

 

[Vault Dweller]

C&C is an aspect that enhances an rpg but it doesn't "make" an rpg and it's not the sole factor to make an rpg "good".

What does make an RPG "good" then?

C&C should serve the game much like every other gameplay aspect and not be an end in itself as it seems to be the case with AoD.

AoD is not a game of choices & consequences, just like PST is not an interactive novel.

DA could well have C&C and still be the worst Bioware game to date.

I doubt that.

 

[Silellak]

A game made by a Codexer, for Codexers - and some Codexers are still bitching about it.

I fucking love it.

 

[Volourn]

"Curious. Doesn't the implementation of choices with consequences"

C&C means absolute shit if you don't give a shit about the characters involved.


"What does make an RPG "good" then?"

If it's fuckin' fun. That's all that fuckin' matters.


"I doubt that."

You shou'dn't 'cause it's true,a nd you agree. NWN OC has more C&C than BG does most most everybody on the Codex prefers BG to NWN OC. *shrug* KOTOR has more rping than most of BIO's other games; but its my least favorite. *shrug*


"...but now I want something more than killing monsters and watching "awesome" cinematics. I want to be able to decide what to do, when to do, and why. I want to decide, not to be told, who my allies and enemies are."

That doesn't make it more directed at an 'older audience' or 'mature' dumbnutz.



P.S. Stop trying to pimp TOEE as some sort of success. What you are trying to do is more masturbating of creative numbers control to get the result you want. TOEE was a failuire. If it wasn't; we'd be seeing that TEOE expansion or sequel that Troika and Atari were pimping. LMAO

 

[fastpunk]

http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=4545

"Atari has released their 10-K report for their fiscal year that ended in March 2004. Interestingly enough, Temple of Elemental Evil was their numero uno PC CRPG during that year. The two expansion packs to Neverwinter Nights fell somewhat below that. The only strictly PC platform game to beat out ToEE in terms of sales was UT2004. It was the numero tres seller of all Atari's PC releases total."

Cheers for the info!

 

[Qiwi]

VD, is that you?
http://www.canadapost.ca/AboutUs/Corpor ... Pitre.aspx

 

[Kingston]

Dun dun dun!