Interview Day One DLC explained

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Tags: BioWare

BioWare's Casey Hudson, the project director for Mass Effect 2, <a href="http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2010/03/day-one-content-mass-effect-2s-casey-hudson-explains.ars">explains</a> why Day One DLC is legit.
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<p style="margin-left:50px;border-style:solid;border-width:1px;border-top-color:#ffffff;padding:5px;border-right-color:#bbbbbb;border-left-color:#ffffff;border-bottom-color:#bbbbbb;">People may not be aware of it, and people may say if you have content available day one, why not put it onto disc? What goes out on disc, it takes about 12 weeks to debug and certify and get into the trucks to go out into stores," he explained. "That gives us a period of 8 to 12 weeks where we can make content, but we can't put it onto the disc because it's already out there. But we can insert it digitally, day one."
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In other words, the team can have up to three months of time after the game is finished, getting pressed onto discs, and tested with Microsoft; in that time content is being created for the game. This was how the character Zaeed was created; they knew the character was going into the game, and they knew they wanted him available on the first day. He was simply being worked on after the code went out to be pressed onto discs.
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Ok, so basically it has nothing to do with making an additional buck. I'm pacified and looking forward to more Day One DLC!
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Spotted at: <A HREF="http://www.rpgwatch.com/#14630">RPGWatch</A>

 

[Sceptic]

Is he stating outright that they don't debug their day one DLCs and don't test them to make sure they work with the base game? Because if they do, then he's just shot his own excuse dead...

 

[Volourn]

FFS You should go back to your tank. Read the fuckin' article. It takes 3 or so months to test the main game via MS. It takes 2-3 weeks to test the DLC. Do the fuckin' simple math.

The explanation makes fuckin' sense. It should be noted that no day one DLC by BIO cost anything for people who bought the game new except WK (unless you bought the game online then it was free). So, it's not like they make a shit load of money off it. FFS

 

[Shannow]

They explain why free Day One DLC is legit. (MEh2 had free DLC, right?)

They do not explain why the team can't start work on the next project or support the QA team. They do not explain why they didn't increase development-time if they so badly wanted more stuff in. They don't explain why DLC content is conveniently finished on day one. Did they again cut content to meet the release date?

I admit after playing DA:O's DLC I rage a lot less about "cut content, that should have been in, in the first place". That was just crappy shit and the game would have actually been better without it. Apart from Shale, whom I never had in my party but who was done quite well, IMO.
But instead of crappy DLC and bloat quests they should have put more effort in the "meaty" quests and dialogue. DA:O pretty much fell apart on that aspect after about 30% of the game. The facepalm heavyhandedness of dialogue near the end was excrutiating.

@Sceptic, to be fair, some small DLC pack doesn't need as much QA as a whole game. They can finish cut content DLC in 2 months and still have a month for DLC QA.

 

[Volourn]

Day One DLC is very likely finished BEFORE the official release date; but it's not like they're gonna go ahead and release DLC before the actual game comes out, right? FFS

 

[Shannow]

Day One DLC is very likely finished BEFORE the official release date; but it's not like they're gonna go ahead and release DLC before the actual game comes out, right? FFS

So if they are not finished? What then?
FFS

 

[DraQ]

Is he stating outright that they don't debug their day one DLCs and don't test them to make sure they work with the base game? Because if they do, then he's just shot his own excuse dead...

Way to shoot yourself in the foot blow your feet off clean from under yourself, then fall on the ground crushing your face, Biowhores.

 

[Sceptic]

It takes 3 or so months to test the main game via MS. It takes 2-3 weeks to test the DLC. Do the fuckin' simple math.

I'll get out of my tank once you learn2read and adress the real issue I raised instead of your delusions. Do they test the DLC with the main game or not? In other words, does someone install the DLC then play THROUGH THE WHOLE GAME to make sure everything works as it should? If they don't, their testing is shit and they should be bashed for it. If they do, then by the time they're ready to go gold they have a fully tested game, a fully tested DLC, and a fully tested game+DLC combo. What's the excuse then for not making a gold out of game+DLC instead of game by itself?

Of course I'm only assuming that they don't test the DLC properly. I'm sure I'm wrong and they did a fine job with testing all promotional content and DLCs.

* Promotional downloadable content items now remain in the player's inventory when standard items are removed at the end of the dwarf noble origin.

Oops.

They explain why free Day One DLC is legit. (MEh2 had free DLC, right?)

So far all the ME2 Day One and post-release DLCs have been free. I heard somewhere that Hammerhead (or whatever it's now called) will cost some money but it's also meant to introduce 5 quests or so, so it may not be bad value for money.

I admit after playing DA:O's DLC I rage a lot less about "cut content, that should have been in, in the first place". That was just crappy shit and the game would have actually been better without it.

To be honest I'm not that interested in either raging about the content being cut or the quality of the content. WK was pretty bad (though not as bad as the non-Day One RtO) but the sales pitch was just awful. My real beef with Bioware and EA is that they keep coming up with excuses for the existence of Day One DLCs when we all know the real reason is to discourage 2nd hand sales. There's no other excuse for Shale selling for $15, no matter the quality of the content. They want to make more money by making people want to buy a fresh copy? more power to them, but until they man up and say it I see no reason not call them on their bullshit.

Apart from Shale, whom I never had in my party but who was done quite well, IMO.

Shale was great, most interesting NPC in the game. If you didn't do her quest you really should, especially if you bring her to the Anvil. She gets the best character development there.

But instead of crappy DLC and bloat quests they should have put more effort in the "meaty" quests and dialogue. DA:O pretty much fell apart on that aspect after about 30% of the game. The facepalm heavyhandedness of dialogue near the end was excrutiating.

+1

to be fair, some small DLC pack doesn't need as much QA as a whole game. They can finish cut content DLC in 2 months and still have a month for DLC QA.

Agreed, but as I said to Volly earlier, if the DLC and the base game are fully tested, and testing is done at the same time, ie before the game goes gold, why not keep everything on the disc? (if testing is the excuse of course)

So if they are not finished? What then?
FFS

They just release the DLC later on. This would actually be a very good reason for DLC: "we wanted this in the game but didn't have time to finish it, so instead of postponing the release date we got it out as DLC. Enjoy!"

But then it's no longer Day One DLC.

FFS!

 

[DraQ]

It always gives me kicks that the sole mentally impaired dragon character in Naomi Novik's "Temeraire" series too has a name abbreviated as Volly - poetic.

 

[I.C. Wiener]

I know you people like to complain about anything, but I really like the idea of free day one DLC for actual customers. ME2 had minimally invasive DRM (just a CD check) which makes me believe they have finally wised up to the fact that piracy doesn't mean nearly as many lost sales as used game sales.

Even if it is to ring a few extra bucks out of people who didn't buy it new, you have to have your head really far up your ass to think that developers somehow don't deserve money for their work.

 

[GarfunkeL]

It always gives me kicks that the sole mentally impaired dragon character in Naomi Novik's "Temeraire" series too has a name abbreviated as Volly - poetic.

Especially since Novik worked for Bioware during NWN and Shadows of Undrentide, before she turned into book writing. And wasn't Volly a prolific poster at Bioboards during NWN?

IT ALL MAKES SENSE NOW

Even if it is to ring a few extra bucks out of people who didn't buy it new, you have to have your head really far up your ass to think that developers somehow don't deserve money for their work.

Take your own head out of your ass. Nobody was saying that, you retard.

 

[SuicideBunny]

ME2 had minimally invasive DRM (just a CD check)

unless you install said "free" zero day dlc, at which point you are required to be logged in online in order to load any saves started with said dlc, or start new games with it, just like in DA.

minimally invasive my ass. that is just one step away from the bullshit ubisoft does, although, granted, a rather large one.

 

[Castanova]

Paid zero-day DLC is fine, in an ideal world. In the real world, it's fucking bullshit because it's fairly clear that developers hold back content specifically to charge for it later.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Isn't DLC usually made by a different group, instead of the regular developers? That would also explain why it isn't easy to just "put the DLC in the disc".

They just release the DLC later on. This would actually be a very good reason for DLC: "we wanted this in the game but didn't have time to finish it, so instead of postponing the release date we got it out as DLC. Enjoy!"

But then it's no longer Day One DLC.

FFS!

I don't think release date is decided by the developers

 

[Shannow]

So if they are not finished? What then?
FFS

They just release the DLC later on. This would actually be a very good reason for DLC: "we wanted this in the game but didn't have time to finish it, so instead of postponing the release date we got it out as DLC. Enjoy!"

But then it's no longer Day One DLC.

FFS!

That'd be the reasonable thing to do. But then again, it'd be reasonable to wait with going gold until all the intended content is in the game...

On QA in DLC: It's mostly modular content. An extra area with a longish quest, some overpowered equipment. I doubt an extra playthrough of the whole game would be neededto test that. But of course there's also stuff like Shale that should require more thorough testing...
I'm not aware of any DLC introducing new bugs into their games (but DA is pretty much the only game with significant DLC I've ever played).

 

[I.C. Wiener]

Take your own head out of your ass. Nobody was saying that, you retard.

Ok, so basically it has nothing to do with making an additional buck. I'm pacified and looking forward to more Day One DLC!

Maybe nobody was, but even if the sarcastic quote from the OP meant "Bioware should be more open about their moneygrubbing", I don't think they should have to state the obvious. They don't work for free.

 

[Sceptic]

I don't think release date is decided by the developers

It's not and my example relies on this. Publisher sets inflexible release date. Developer has everything ready except these 2 self-contained side quests so they take them out, finish the rest of the game, then they go back to those quests and a month or so later they turn up as DLC. As I said, such a scenario makes perfect sense.

On QA in DLC: It's mostly modular content. An extra area with a longish quest, some overpowered equipment. I doubt an extra playthrough of the whole game would be neededto test that. But of course there's also stuff like Shale that should require more thorough testing...
I'm not aware of any DLC introducing new bugs into their games (but DA is pretty much the only game with significant DLC I've ever played).

I agree but shit does happen and DA is a good example (see the patch that I quoted). Granted it's a minor issue and there are workarounds, and yes I know no game is bug-free (DA is remarkably clean when compared to the competition), but programs are complex enough as it is without adding unnecessary risks.

 

[Silellak]

Selling DLC on Day 1 is fairly annoying, but I get a lot more annoyed at DLC that comes out 2 or 3 weeks later but is only 100 kb, indicating that the data's actually been on the game disc all along, it's just been "locked", and the DLC simply "unlocks" it.

 

[MetalCraze]

The guy fails at excuses. Why not put DLC as a part of digital package? You don't need to wait until it will arrive. You just upload the shit. But 5 additional bucks for a couple of skins for the armour ah yeah

 

[DraQ]

Selling DLC on Day 1 is fairly annoying, but I get a lot more annoyed at DLC that comes out 2 or 3 weeks later but is only 100 kb, indicating that the data's actually been on the game disc all along, it's just been "locked", and the DLC simply "unlocks" it.

The code part of any mod is usually fairly minor in size and the developers often leave the unused resources in, if they fit on the disk, so no.

 

[Volourn]

"unless you install said "free" zero day dlc, at which point you are required to be logged in online in order to load any saves started with said dlc, or start new games with it, just like in DA. "

Bullshit. I play DA offline quite a bit, and its full of DLC. FFS

 

[Silellak]

Selling DLC on Day 1 is fairly annoying, but I get a lot more annoyed at DLC that comes out 2 or 3 weeks later but is only 100 kb, indicating that the data's actually been on the game disc all along, it's just been "locked", and the DLC simply "unlocks" it.

The code part of any mod is usually fairly minor in size and the developers often leave the unused resources in, if they fit on the disk, so no.

Yes, but not always.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/191669/bioshock_2s_discfree_dlc_has_gamers_peeved.html

 

[Jasede]

Personally I find it very interesting that people actually buy Downloadable Content. Somehow the whole idea repulses me. Like buying a book, then paying for the appendix and the bonus chapter.

 

[DraQ]

Selling DLC on Day 1 is fairly annoying, but I get a lot more annoyed at DLC that comes out 2 or 3 weeks later but is only 100 kb, indicating that the data's actually been on the game disc all along, it's just been "locked", and the DLC simply "unlocks" it.

The code part of any mod is usually fairly minor in size and the developers often leave the unused resources in, if they fit on the disk, so no.

Yes, but not always.

http://www.pcworld.com/article/191669/bioshock_2s_discfree_dlc_has_gamers_peeved.html

Just delicious.

Personally I find it very interesting that people actually buy Downloadable Content. Somehow the whole idea repulses me. Like buying a book, then paying for the appendix and the bonus chapter.

Well, duh. We're discussing retarded and deceptive PRspeak explanation here and are butthurt about day one DLCs even if they are free, though.

 

[Volourn]

http://www.ugo.com/games/bioware-weve-g ... s-effect-3