4X

[Monkeyfinger]

It's getting better, but it's still not totally fixed up yet.

 

[Zeus]

Re: ...

FfH is in a bit of a sorry state right now. Recently, Civ4 was unexpectedly patched while Kael, FfH's developer, was extremely busy with real life.

Yeah, it's kind of a shame they released that patch.

I *just* bought a copy of Civ IV Complete, which has Civ IV, all the expansions (including Colonization), DRM free. And when they say free, they mean it -- this thing doesn't even have a CD check.

I was able to enjoy my fully-patched Civ IV + FFH for a total of one week before they released the new BTS patch with the big whooptie-doo feature of, you guessed it, no CD check.

So now my Civ IV Complete is more like Civ IV Obsolete, and FFH is broken. Fun.

 

[spectre]

Hum. How about... not install the patch? Reinstall Civ4 beforehand, of course.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

Yeah, on SotS, it's worth mentioning that apparently the expansions improved it quite a bit. Pretty much everything I've heard said it was a bit too barebones before the expansions, and the demo is only for the base game from what I gather. So if you're going to demo it I'd say torrent the complete pack.

Also worth mentioning that THIS GODDAMN TRAILER (Which is the one used on Steam, just can't seem to find it on youtube for some reason) caused me to look up The Darkest of Hillside Thickets since I liked the sound of it, then I find out they're a goofy Cthulhu rock band which tickles me fancy, and THEN I can't get any decent goddamn torrents of their music to see if the rest of their stuff is as good sounding as that one song.
http://vd.reborn.ru/?a=watch&id=18114

 

[Monkeyfinger]

Hum. How about... not install the patch? Reinstall Civ4 beforehand, of course.

The well-working version of FfH doesn't run off of unpatched Civ4, it runs off of an older Civ4 patch. One which you can't get anymore.

 

[Jeff Graw]

Civ games suck, not sure about that mod everyone is talking about though. Stardock 4X games suck. Stars has some good fundamentals but is also pretty bland, and while the tech tree has tons of "breadth" its not very deep. If you've never played Master of Magic or the original MoO, you can't get much better. If you like micromanagement try Space Empires. MoO3 with tons of mods can be somewhat decent. Birth of The Federation is buggy and unbalanced, but is worth checking out if only because it pioneered so many unique concepts you won't find in any other game.

 

[spectre]

The well-working version of FfH doesn't run off of unpatched Civ4, it runs off of an older Civ4 patch. One which you can't get anymore.

I call your bullshit, so does a quick google check.

 

[Tardvapor]

I thought GalCiv2 with the expansions was alright, would have made a way better sequel to Moo2 than Moo3 did anyway. I'd stay away from Moo3, it's like playing a spreadsheet. It looks like some of you prefer moo1 to 2, why? I played them both when released and never went back to 1 after 2 came out, all I remember of moo1 was that it was pointless to build anything but the tiniest ships, just send out unbeatable heaps of 10k or more scouts with a single weapon on them.

I liked Civ 4 a lot, probably spent a few hundred hours with it. I wouldn't bother with Civ 3 if you never played it. I thought civ 2 was better, and the new concepts brought in by civ 3 were improved upon in 4.

 

[Destroid]

Havn't played the expansions yet, but I found GalCiv 1+2 horribly bland and lacking in character. This is where MoO2 just blows the entire genre out of the water, the game oozes atmosphere and flavour. Some of my friends were into the Imperium Galactica series but I never like story/scenario based 4x, I enjoy building an empire.

 

[entertainer]

Having loads of fun playing SotS, i thought theres no mining or harvesting, but it comes with research as do many other things. The more you play the more options you discover.

 

[Jasede]

Oh? Okay. Only played it 3 minutes or so so far and it seems pretty barren. Just research and building ships.

But I'll keep at it.

Edit: But -gee-, what does the game need 4.5 gigabyte space for?

 

[entertainer]

Mine is only 2.15GB with all 3 expansions.

 

[Silellak]

I thought GalCiv2 with the expansions was alright, would have made a way better sequel to Moo2 than Moo3 did anyway.

Mass Effect was a better sequel to MMO2 than MOO3 was. Any game is a better sequel to MOO2 than MOO3 was, mostly because MOO3 was not a game, but a space-themed graphical wrapper for Excel.

MOO3 was probably my single biggest gaming-based disappointment - yes, even more so than Ultima IX. Ultima IX at least had a few of the aspects that made the series great. MOO3 was a complete disgrace. I don't understand why it would've been so hard to tweek the MOO2 recipe, give it a graphical upgrade, and throw in improved online multiplayer. That's all people really wanted.

If you want to "innovate", make a new fucking series "inspired by" the original (the same way Gal Civ is inspired by MOO), or at least have the decency to make it a spin-off ala Ultima Underworld (Master of Orion: Spreadsheet Adventures). Don't rape the name of the original series just because you want to try something ridiculously different.

I'm not saying you should never innovate within a series, but if you remove everything recognizable about the series, you can at least give it a different name. X-Com: Enforcer may've sucked ass, but at least they didn't call it "X-Com 4".

 

[JarlFrank]

Oh? Okay. Only played it 3 minutes or so so far and it seems pretty barren. Just research and building ships.

But I'll keep at it.

Edit: But -gee-, what does the game need 4.5 gigabyte space for?

What interests me more is why it does have a countdown whenever you click end turn.

 

[NiM82]

Oh? Okay. Only played it 3 minutes or so so far and it seems pretty barren. Just research and building ships.

But I'll keep at it.

Edit: But -gee-, what does the game need 4.5 gigabyte space for?

What interests me more is why it does have a countdown whenever you click end turn.

I quite like that. When you've got a shit load going on, particularly in MP games (which the game was ground up designed for) you can frequently hit end and suddenly remember you needed to do something, cooldown timer gives you time to abort & remedy silly/annoying mistakes like that. There's an option to disable it somewhere iirc.

 

[Raapys]

The countdown really annoyed me, at least in the start where turn processing is very fast. And from what I recall there wasn't actually an option to turn it off.

 

[NiM82]

The countdown really annoyed me, at least in the start where turn processing is very fast. And from what I recall there wasn't actually an option to turn it off.

I thought there was a slider to adjust the delay (0 for off, obv)?

If there isn't a slide (don't have it installed atm), it's an definately an option in your player profile ini file:

So go into you SoTS/Profile directory, open Profile_*YourNameHere*.ini

Find: "EndTurnDelay=3" and switch 3 to 0.

 

[coldcrow]

Actually MoO3 with the the latest community patch is quite good. Higher Res, reworked UI, bugfixes, Balance etc. It still has its unique gameplay - Macromanagment.

The biggest reasons people tend to ditch MoO3 is that they don't really undstand what the devs wanted to do. Most players trhink they have to micromanage every fucking planet, which leads to sore fingers and total retardation after you colonized/conquered the 20-30th planet.

 

[Jeff Graw]

It looks like some of you prefer moo1 to 2, why?

Way more streamlined (planetary screen from MoO2 is an abomination, and ship combat took *way* too long late game), way more balanced (In MoO2 the first guy to move his ships in combat gets a huge advantage, and creative trait anybody?) Better research system and the ability to research multiple fields at once. MoO2 had tons of character, but it was positively riddled with bad design. MoO1 has by far the best core design of any 4X game. Perfectly streamlined while maintaining depth, like chess.

I played them both when released and never went back to 1 after 2 came out, all I remember of moo1 was that it was pointless to build anything but the tiniest ships, just send out unbeatable heaps of 10k or more scouts with a single weapon on them.

And then have the entire 10k stack get destroyed by a single pulsar. Or decimated by a black hole generator. Or, if mounting an energy weapon, made obsolete by a repulsor beam.

I liked Civ 4 a lot, probably spent a few hundred hours with it.

Then you suck. Even if the Civ games didn't all turn into bloated piles of shit late game, you'd be better off playing Civ 2 with worse graphics, but more character and much faster end turn calculations.

 

[Raapys]

The biggest reasons people tend to ditch MoO3 is that they don't really undstand what the devs wanted to do.

Which is ironic, because from what I recall, the devs listened to fan advice more than basically any other developer( though most the input probably came from their forums, and likely it's the reason the game ended up so unfinished since they got in way over their heads ).

Personally I love it though, once patched and modded. It really does have a style that no other game offers, and it's certainly the most epic( not the 'epic' hype-word ) 4x game ever made. It also offers far more game hours than for instance MoO2, which I now play through on a large map in only a few hours.

 

[Zeus]

The well-working version of FfH doesn't run off of unpatched Civ4, it runs off of an older Civ4 patch. One which you can't get anymore.

I call your bullshit, so does a quick google check.

Is it just me, or is the well-working version of FFH2 no longer online? All the links have been updated to FallfromHeaven2041d.exe, which apparently has the new patches built in. It looks like all the originals are being taken down, so if anyone else wants to archive all the 3.17-era stuff along with their Civ IV Complete discs, this is the time to do it.

I found only one place with the the last FallfromHeaven2.exe designed for Beyond The Sword 3.17. I'd never heard of this site before, so I double-checked the MD5 checksum off of an old ModDB page on Google Cache. Sure enough, it matches. MD5: a2367d73afedffa0ab288ef836bbc93a. I believe you'll still need the FfH2041a.exe patch, which is available here. (I hate hotlinking, but this address was listed on the official forum, so I think it's okay. Plus, it's still online. So.)

I just have to say, I always think it's a shame when a developer takes down links to older versions. It probably saves them a little trouble from confused users who haven't got the right one, but there's always a dozen reasons to want old versions of stuff, from increased performance and stability to my own personal wackjob preference.

Anyway, I think all that's right. Correct me if I'm wrong. I'm off to go roast marshmallows on the smoldering remains of the Sci-Fi Channel.

 

[Multi-headed Cow]

So Skyway, what did you end up trying out? Sword of the Stars, AKA the greatest game?

Another cool thing about SotS I didn't know, apparently if you research the AI tech (Which you really kind of want to, since it gives you a great 50% bonus to research) there's a chance your AI will go rogue, fucking you over as AI takes over planets and ships of yours and becomes a new faction. Not only that, it can then apparently spread to OTHER civs that have the AI tech as it liberates more computers. Then once the shit hits the fan, you have additional research to make a virus to wipe all the AI out, and additional research to make slave AI which lets you use your AI bonuses again.

 

[entertainer]

There are research risks not only for AI. Though AI is the most dangerous i think. Also funny how you can get screwed later if you attack VN motherships.

 

[MetalCraze]

So Skyway, what did you end up trying out? Sword of the Stars, AKA the greatest game?

I ended up playing RoA2.

Another cool thing about SotS I didn't know, apparently if you research the AI tech (Which you really kind of want to, since it gives you a great 50% bonus to research) there's a chance your AI will go rogue, fucking you over as AI takes over planets and ships of yours and becomes a new faction. Not only that, it can then apparently spread to OTHER civs that have the AI tech as it liberates more computers. Then once the shit hits the fan, you have additional research to make a virus to wipe all the AI out, and additional research to make slave AI which lets you use your AI bonuses again.

Sounds cool, it's the implementation that worries me

 

[karnot]

In MoO2 the first guy to move his ships in combat gets a huge advantage

Uh, try turning on combat initiative.

creative trait anybody?

Yeah, that. I always pick Un-Creative, just to randomise things a bit more.

MoO2 had tons of character, but it was positively riddled with bad design.

Considering its still best in the genre, after 15 years, how can it possibly bad design ? Its time-proven, isnt it ? Just as MoM is still the best in its respective genre. You cant say Barcia made bad design. I mean, it may look shaky at first, but it FUCKING WORKS, and what else does anyone need ?