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Review Kult praised by Idle Thumbs

Saint_Proverbius

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Tags: Kult: Heretic Kingdoms

<a href="http://www.idlethumbs.net/">Idle Thumbs</a> has posted up <A href="http://www.idlethumbs.net/display.php?id=58">their review</a> of <a href="http://www.p3int.com/KULT/">Kult: Heretic Kingdoms</a>. While there is no score, it's pretty damned postive in nature with all kinds of wacky love going on, like this:
<br>
<br>
<blockquote>"Do you have some pathological need to help people?" says the miller to my salty heroine. This is the kind of reaction I would, under normal circumstances, expect from a new acquaintance to whom I had just given nearly all of my recently-looted money. It is a kind of reaction I would expect — and yet — not really. You see, I have been conditioned by this damn genre to accept that the perfect stranger I have just helped by bankrupting myself will say something like "Thank you," or "Thank you very much," or maybe even "Oh, thank you so very, very much! You're a lifesaver!" — and then continue to stand there ignoring me. In that light, miller's reaction was awe-inspiring. Nothing in the tone of the game up to that point prepared me for that response.</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
Some people are easily impressed by something slightly different. It's also nice to notice that the <s>moron</s>nice person who wrote the piece feels the need to express his real life political views on the reader as if we honestly give two shits about what he thinks of things other than the game itself.
<br>
<br>
Thanks, <b>chaedwards</b>!
 

Vault Dweller

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Saint said "moron" and "shit". Somebody calls the RPG Codex's office of the INTARNET POLICE! :lol:
 

Sol Invictus

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God, that review is a stinker. The reviewer digresses from the topic of the game not only once, but several times. It's like a Salon article rather than a review. Is he shooting for a job elsewhere?

While I agree with some of the things he said in the latter portion of the review, most of his comments in the first half are really quite a snore. I kept asking myself when he would jump into the actual review of the game instead of writing a blog.

Ultimately, he doesn't even elucidate the game.
 

Limorkil

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I quite enjoyed that review, particularly the bit about having to tell people at work that you have a hangover because that has far more cred than telling people you were up all night playing an elf in a computer game.

I see more and more reviews like this, where the reviewer throws all sorts of other comments into the review that are not directly linked to the game. I suppose its because people don't have to worry about column space on the Internet. I'd hate for every review to be all over the place like this, but it can be a refreshing change. I'm pretty sick of people sticking to "Review Formula 101" where they start by saying a little about the developers, then discuss the background story, then talk about controls, graphics and finally - maybe - mention what is good and bad about the game. This guy did all that, but I thought the lead-in was fun.

As for the comment about Republicans, well he could have left that out without lessening his point. His point being that he was sick of games where its the role of 'good' people to go out and kill 'evil' people. I think a lot of people at The Codex would agree that a totally two dimensional view of good versus evil gets a bit stale and a game with shades of gray offers much better roleplaying potential. Of course, he went on to link the simplified idea of good vs evil in games to the way George Bush and others paint the war in Iraq. It's actually a fair comment, but for an editorial piece and not for a game review.
 

Reklar

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Speaking for myself, obviously, I can't say I appreciate off-topic banter in game reviews. If it doesn't relate to the game reviewed from a gaming standpoint then all you're doing is wasting the reader's time. Granted, if you aren't paying to read the review it's technically not wasting a customer's time, but it seems incredibly tacky to posit your socio-political or religious views in the midst of a game review. RPG Codex, as a "free" review site, may inject personal opinion that isn't necessary sometimes, but I've never seen anything blatantly off-topic. I suppose it comes down to the integrity of the reviewer and the site that hosts their reviews, however, I can't say I'd patronize a site with that sort of irrelevant content.

-Reklar
(a Fallout/RPG fan)
 

Trash

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Saint_Proverbius said:
There's the part about Atheism and Religious Fundamentalists.

Well, isn't the whole game story about that subject? Then again, idle thumbs is a site more interested in the arty side of games than anything else. This makes the reviews often fun to read, yet not that informative for me (see their evil genius one) Guess they cater for their little niche, like this site does for it's own.
 

Otaku_Hanzo

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Haha. I just read that very same review before coming here and announcing my ressurection. :P

I just shrugged and decided I had had my fill of Idle Thumbs. That was my first and last encounter with them. I pretty much knew his opinion wasn't worth squat to me when he's saying he didn't like Diablo 2 or Fallout, and in the same breath admits to having played Final Fantasy VII several times.

I mean, yeah, I liked FFVII, but it doesn't even compare to the Fallout series for replayability purposes. FFVII's only replay value was to get that item you missed. Ooooo..... I got the UBERSWORD after my fifth run through the game! YAY! Too bad it didn't change the ending..... or give me other choices.... or different quests.... or..... yeah.
 

Volourn

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"I just read that very same review before coming here and announcing my ressurection."

You were gone?


"May your stay be pleasant."

You do realize this is the 'Codex, right?

Then aagin, we all have a pleasant time here as we enjoy the harassment. :twisted:

As for the review, it was pretty poor. :(
 

Volourn

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"He was gone since the 8th of May."

Was the time 8:15am. If so, I was probably sleeping when he made The Big Announcement. tm
 

Otaku_Hanzo

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I didn't have the luxury of an announcement, unfortunately. I haven't had many luxuries lately, come to think about it.

But to stay on topic, I'm finding Kult to be enjoyable. Not my fave RPG ever, but it's found a place in my heart, that's for sure.

I really really like that Attunement system. Reminds me of Final Fantasy IX's skill setup but with a twist in the fact that some of the attunements won't work if you're not equipped with a certain type of item. Adds a bit of strategy to the whole thing. Especially since, with some diligence, you can pretty much learn what you'll be going up against in the next area you are headed to and be prepared for it. Definitely beats having to go to an area and then run back to town to rest in order to prepare yourself.

The ONLY problem I have with the game thus far is the fact that I get lag on moving. Like when I click on an area to make my PC's babealicious self (lol :P) go somewhere, she runs in place for a couple of seconds and then heads towards the target. It's nothing game killing, just a slight annoyance. Especially in combat situations. But, if it turns out that it's the only problem I have with the game at all, I'll be happy.

All in all a decent game so far. I hope it doesn't let me down.
 

Kingzjester

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Hello gentlemen. I would like to first of all thank you for the kind comments about my article and apologize in the same breath for taking this long to stumble upon your dinky website to thank you for those kind comments.

As for the observations on the quality of our reviews in general and my review in particular -- I would like to kill you all. Obviously the Idle Thumbs doesn't give a shit about what you're looking for -- namely informative reporting. Reviews in the specialized gaming press have become these consumer guides full of meaningless platitudes such as "try before you buy" and "find it in the discount bin in January" full of arbitrary grades given to categories such as sound, graphics, gameplay... If you want informative reporting, you might as well read the official press releases or hardware specs. But you know, I don't think any of that garbage is particularly interesting raw. What is ultimately more important, how many frames per second the game supports when there are eleventeen billion bump-mapped polygons on screen, or how the game plays, how it feels? When was the last time you read a fucking film review and the writer give a movie 9 for sound, 8 for looks and 6 for the legibility of the movie ticket? When was the last time you read in a straightforward movie review in your local newspaper about surround sound, Technicolor or the science behind the expandable foam used to make fake rocks? Someone who doesn't care about filmmaking fundamentals wouldn't care to know anything about that. Alas, game writing has lost itself in this gee-wiz land of irrelevant technobabble. The Idle Thumbs writers write primarily to amuse and spark discussion; informativeness of the conventional variety is totally and utterly uninteresting and therefore not something we commonly deal with.

Now riddle me this: why do reactionaries love to pan in no unclear terms people out to try something new? Well? I never quite understood this. If only I gave any credence to Sigmund Freud I could call it "penis envy". I don't. So I can't.

Speaking of reactionaries, I mentioned something about republicans and religious fundamentalists that didn't slide well with some denizens of this forum. I'm sorry. You see, neither group is known to have a sense of humour and hence I secretly expected some amount of lowbrow outrage. I am kind of disappointed in my fellow man nonetheless as nothing I said really deserves indignation.
 

Vault Dweller

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Hey Stevan, how nice of you to drop by. Now, in regard to your bitching and whining, suprisingly we do care more about how a game plays than about technical specs, but your review tells us little about gameplay. Instead we are "entertained" by your often idiotic opinions and irrelevant comments.

I've just re-read your entire review:

First 5 (yep, that's FIVE) paragraph, you are talking about your likes, dislikes, and drinking problems. Cute? Hardly. You mention how you didn't like BG because it was too modular while each Kult's area is an individual picture. Have you actually played BG? You mention your dislike of Fallout and then praise Kult for not doing the "do Good by killing Evil". Go play Fallout. So far you've established that you are ignorant and/or stupid. Good start.

Next 4 paragraphs are dedicated to the backstory. Wow. You have mad copy-pasting skillz.

Next 3 paragraphs are about your excitement about the heroine, narrative, and atheism in the setting. It could have been something, if we didn't have to wait 9 paragraphs to get it. Boring, longwinded, and unfocused.

Next paragraph is dedicated to one dialogue response and the detailed description of how excited you are about it.

Next paragraph is short, thank God. You simple state that the story and game mechanics are so awesome that they totally own Bio games. Could be, but where are the fucking facts?

Now we get to the first somewhat informative paragraph about the attunement system. After 14 paragraphs of nothing, that's something.

Then there are the last 4 paragraphs that briefly mention that there is such a thing as Dreamworld, point out that you also took some screenshots, and state that the game is nice and promising. The fucking end.
...
So what did we learn here? Other than the fact that you can't really review games? Absolutely nothing. And yet you are here, bitching about something. Why?
 

Sol Invictus

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Now riddle me this: why do reactionaries love to pan in no unclear terms people out to try something new? Well? I never quite understood this. If only I gave any credence to Sigmund Freud I could call it "penis envy". I don't. So I can't.
You just did, by making the aforementioned hypothetical statement. I would state that this isn't a case of penis envy at all, but rather the way Saint (and a lot of us here) were irked by your review style which tended to veer off the beaten path (which can be a good thing, occasionally) when you made a reference to your political stance as if it was grounded in fact. I can see how anyone reasonable would be reasonably irked by this, regardless of their own political beliefs.

I personally didn't mind the 'irrelevent' material you filled your interview with, but it would have been a lot better had you actually elucidated upon the subject of the game, much as a well respected movie reviewer would discuss the game's flaws and merits in full. It would certainly help potential buyers decide if the game was worth their hard earned money.

Instead, your review came out sounding like a stream of verbal masturbation. I hope you enjoy what you write, because I certainly did not.

Anyway, welcome to the Codex. :evil:
 

Saint_Proverbius

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Kingzjester said:
Hello gentlemen. I would like to first of all thank you for the kind comments about my article and apologize in the same breath for taking this long to stumble upon your dinky website to thank you for those kind comments.

You were busy losing an election. I understand.

As for the observations on the quality of our reviews in general and my review in particular -- I would like to kill you all. Obviously the Idle Thumbs doesn't give a shit about what you're looking for -- namely informative reporting. Reviews in the specialized gaming press have become these consumer guides full of meaningless platitudes such as "try before you buy" and "find it in the discount bin in January" full of arbitrary grades given to categories such as sound, graphics, gameplay... If you want informative reporting, you might as well read the official press releases or hardware specs. But you know, I don't think any of that garbage is particularly interesting raw. What is ultimately more important, how many frames per second the game supports when there are eleventeen billion bump-mapped polygons on screen, or how the game plays, how it feels? When was the last time you read a fucking film review and the writer give a movie 9 for sound, 8 for looks and 6 for the legibility of the movie ticket? When was the last time you read in a straightforward movie review in your local newspaper about surround sound, Technicolor or the science behind the expandable foam used to make fake rocks? Someone who doesn't care about filmmaking fundamentals wouldn't care to know anything about that. Alas, game writing has lost itself in this gee-wiz land of irrelevant technobabble. The Idle Thumbs writers write primarily to amuse and spark discussion; informativeness of the conventional variety is totally and utterly uninteresting and therefore not something we commonly deal with.

The ironic thing is that if you'd taken the time to actually bother to read any of the reviews on our dinky little website here, you would have noticed we never put numerical scores on anything either. Kind of takes the wind out of your sails, doesn't it? Imagine all the wear and tear you could have saved on writing that post if you'd done two minutes worth of checking first.

Now riddle me this: why do reactionaries love to pan in no unclear terms people out to try something new? Well? I never quite understood this. If only I gave any credence to Sigmund Freud I could call it "penis envy". I don't. So I can't.

Depends on what's new, doesn't it? Also depends on if it's actually something new when it's being pimped as something new.

Speaking of reactionaries, I mentioned something about republicans and religious fundamentalists that didn't slide well with some denizens of this forum. I'm sorry. You see, neither group is known to have a sense of humour and hence I secretly expected some amount of lowbrow outrage. I am kind of disappointed in my fellow man nonetheless as nothing I said really deserves indignation.

You're sorry, on that we can both agree. You still miss the point, which is that it has no place in a game review. No one gives a flying fuck what your political view points on anything is. We didn't hop on there to read out left wing you are, we hopped there to read how Kult plays. Now, if your site was called liberalcommiepinkogaming.com, I could understand filling it with republican and Christian bashing. That would go hand in hand with you being a commie douche bag. Having interludes to bash politcal view points and religion in a game review is lame. No one cares that you're bitter because you're not allowed to get married in 11 states while you're critiquing a video game.
 

Spazmo

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As the left wing Canadian on staff, I'll go ahead and say that regardless of political affiliation, everyone thinks you're a tool, Kingzjester. People being BIASED!!!11!!!!^ against games and companies is bad enough. Political bias has no place in gaming journalism.
 

Kingzjester

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Whoa! Ok! In good humour....

Hey Stevan, how nice of you to drop by. Now, in regard to your bitching and whining, suprisingly we do care more about how a game plays than about technical specs, but your review tells us little about gameplay. Instead we are "entertained" by your often idiotic opinions and irrelevant comments.
Hey Dweller, how nice of you to be so prompt. Now, though I might have, I didn't go for your juggular, sir. Gameplay, what exactly do you mean by gameplay? What the story is and some basic mechanic of the engine? What do you wish to know that I didn't cover? Feel free to ask.

First 5 (yep, that's FIVE) paragraph, you are talking about your likes, dislikes, and drinking problems. Cute? Hardly. You mention how you didn't like BG because it was too modular while each Kult's area is an individual picture. Have you actually played BG? You mention your dislike of Fallout and then praise Kult for not doing the "do Good by killing Evil". Go play Fallout. So far you've established that you are ignorant and/or stupid. Good start.
I mentioned that the visuals of those games didn't impress me and then latter on said that I didn't enjoy Fallout. How did you pick up that I said it was a bad game out of that? In no way did I call up Fallout when discussing the story of the Heretic Kingdoms. Quite frankly, I have played Fallout a long time ago and I remember very little -- just that I didn't enjoy the damn game. Which is what I said. The introduction has five paragraphs because I never wrote about RPGs and wanted to establish some integrity, just to let the reader know that I have played one or two RPGs in my time, and also to establish what I like and what I don't. If you don't agree with my likes and dislikes for the reasons that I bring up, this may not be a game for you. There is nothing more annoying than reading a review that exults the game and then realizing after you bought it that you and the reviewer have totally diametric tastes.

Next 4 paragraphs are dedicated to the backstory. Wow. You have mad copy-pasting skillz.
Actually, what I wrote there was nowhere on the internet or in the files that the company sent me... so you know, I kinda wrote it myself. I do however have mad copy-pasting skillz that are seldom recognized by my peers -- I thank you -- but that is hardly evident from the little indent part you object to.

Next 3 paragraphs are about your excitement about the heroine, narrative, and atheism in the setting. It could have been something, if we didn't have to wait 9 paragraphs to get it. Boring, longwinded, and unfocused.
Subjective, subjective and subjective. Write an interesting objective review and I will commit sepuku.

Next paragraph is dedicated to one dialogue response and the detailed description of how excited you are about it.

Next paragraph is short, thank God. You simple state that the story and game mechanics are so awesome that they totally own Bio games. Could be, but where are the fucking facts?
Well, for one, Bioware likes to translate everything into a d20 system which is completely inane and tough on those dorks not familiar with tabletop RPGs. I opted for just a comparative little blurb that tells you that if you were bothered with Bioware's games mumbo-jumbo, you wouldn't find Kult's voodoo objectionable in the least. Elaborating would be boring, longwinded, and unfocused. How many reviews teach you to the letter how to play a game?

Now we get to the first somewhat informative paragraph about the attunement system. After 14 paragraphs of nothing, that's something.
Has anyone ever told you how charming and easy to like you are?

Then there are the last 4 paragraphs that briefly mention that there is such a thing as Dreamworld, point out that you also took some screenshots, and state that the game is nice and promising. The fucking end.
...
So what did we learn here? Other than the fact that you can't really review games? Absolutely nothing. And yet you are here, bitching about something. Why?
I am not so much bitching as I am explaining where I stand so that I wouldn't be misunderstood; so that my reasoning would become clearer. Surely there can't be any random malice -- just misunderstanding.


Ok, next one...
You just did, by making the aforementioned hypothetical statement. I would state that this isn't a case of penis envy at all, but rather the way Saint (and a lot of us here) were irked by your review style which tended to veer off the beaten path (which can be a good thing, occasionally) when you made a reference to your political stance as if it was grounded in fact. I can see how anyone reasonable would be reasonably irked by this, regardless of their own political beliefs.
Freely discussing politics in an open forum being in bad taste is an Anglo-Saxon cultural construct nonexistent in many other cultures. Instead of taking offence, why don't you just relax a little? The hypothetical statement was meant in good humour, nothing more. I really don't understand why some people think their way is the law and that no other way can possibly be valid. It would be rude of me to ascribe it to narrow-mindedness, though I must admit in moments of exasperation I do just that. To elaborate any more on a random joke (by adding supporting facts!) so that Billy-Jo-Bob could feel gratified or enraged or whathaveyou would really knock the feature off-kilter and destroy any comedic value the little bit could otherwise have. If you don't find it funny, fine.

I personally didn't mind the 'irrelevent' material you filled your interview with, but it would have been a lot better had you actually elucidated upon the subject of the game, much as a well respected movie reviewer would discuss the game's flaws and merits in full. It would certainly help potential buyers decide if the game was worth their hard earned money.
Like I said, we don't try to write buyer's digest style. In his movie reviews Stephen Hunter (he won the Pulitzer the other year) generally latches on one facet that touches his fancy and explains why. It could be a random feeling that the movie evoked, it could be the horrible acting of the main character. In all this is a random objection. You may like your reviews split into easily-digestible fragments -- the Setting, The Character system, The Magic System, The Combat, The NPCs, In Conclusion and so on -- but it is a very sterile, if highly informative, way to do things and we just don't do it.

Instead, your review came out sounding like a stream of verbal masturbation. I hope you enjoy what you write, because I certainly did not.
I don't talk to hear myself speak, I talk to be heard. There is a difference. The first one is masturbation, the second one involves an exchange between two or more people. Obviously I don't want to fuck you in particular (a metaphor that just keeps giving) as we're not on the same wavelength, we have very little in common. Other people may find what I have to offer satisfying.



You were busy losing an election. I understand.
You'll have to excuse me. Shit happens.

The ironic thing is that if you'd taken the time to actually bother to read any of the reviews on our dinky little website here, you would have noticed we never put numerical scores on anything either. Kind of takes the wind out of your sails, doesn't it? Imagine all the wear and tear you could have saved on writing that post if you'd done two minutes worth of checking first.
No wind was taken out of my sails as I was talking in generalities and thinking about IGN and GameSpot when I said what I said. I really have no reason to bash this site, other than in retaliation and that would be kinda stupid.

Depends on what's new, doesn't it? Also depends on if it's actually something new when it's being pimped as something new.
It sure as fuck ain't common. I am definitely not peddling something that is universal everywhere.

You're sorry, on that we can both agree. You still miss the point, which is that it has no place in a game review. No one gives a flying fuck what your political view points on anything is. We didn't hop on there to read out left wing you are, we hopped there to read how Kult plays. Now, if your site was called liberalcommiepinkogaming.com, I could understand filling it with republican and Christian bashing. That would go hand in hand with you being a commie douche bag. Having interludes to bash politcal view points and religion in a game review is lame. No one cares that you're bitter because you're not allowed to get married in 11 states while you're critiquing a video game.
As everyone who has red the review can attest it indeed is a Communist Manifesto Revisited. You got me. I mention in a footnote that the game is good and then I go on a 25000-word tirade to verbally rape the Bible and portray Bush as an antichrist out to save some stem cells. Get over yourself, you petty fascist! It was a one-liner in the middle of the thing illustrating black/white issues. When I said that fundamentalists may find the game unholy, I was thinking about my friend Peter whose parents are missionaries in Hungary and who don't look lightly on fiction and satire that contains gods that are not their God. It was in no way derogatory.


As the left wing Canadian on staff, I'll go ahead and say that regardless of political affiliation, everyone thinks you're a tool, Kingzjester. People being BIASED!!!11!!!!^ against games and companies is bad enough. Political bias has no place in gaming journalism.
You're totally insaaaane! Had I written an article on how Al Lowe is inferior to Ron Gilbert simply because the former is a conservative and the latter a liberal, and then from that concluded that Sierra was a far lesser game company than Lucas Arts back in the day -- that would have been a display of some bizarre political/game company bias cocktail. This on the other hand was a dry joke that just happens to give some insight into the depths of my person. I think this sort of thing is very relevant if you want to know whether you should give a fuck about my opinion -- which is what my review ultimately is.


Just for the record, I played the first disk of FFVII when it first came out and recently played it to completion. I see it is a crap game now that I am older and wiser -- but I finished it nonetheless. Since I reviewed Kult I played FFIX to see the similarities people mentioned and they are there.
 

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