Company News Beth vs. Interplay: Bethesda changes lawyers

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Tags: Bethesda Softworks

<p>As everyone knows winning a court case is just a matter of changing your law firm until you stumble upon the winning team, <a href="http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/User_blog:Ausir/Bethesda_changes_lawyers_again" target="_blank">a principle Bethesda seems to be familiar with</a>.</p>
<blockquote>
<p>Bethesda Softworks is apparently displeased with the performance of their law firm in the ongoing Bethesda vs. Interplay litigation over the rights to Fallout Online and the Fallout franchise as a whole, since they decided to change their law firm again now that the court has rejected their motion to dismiss Interplay's counterclaim.</p>
</blockquote>
<p><em>Thanks to Ausir for pointing this out.</em></p>

 

[thesheeep]

I hope someone makes a movie about this. Will be funny as hell ^^

 

[Azrael the cat]

Lol. I can't comment with any real expertise on this, as this kind of large commercial ligitation is a different world to criminal trials, but I suspect that this would be costing Bethesda a fortune. Smaller cases than this have involved hundreds and hundreds of folders full of documents (i.e. hundreds of sets of documents, not just hundreds of documents). In a case that might bring up the minute details of the online game from art to source code to design docs, plus records of numerous telephone conversations, emails, the contract itself and all supporting documentary evidence of the process by which it was negotiated, every letter ever written between the firms, etc.....I'm guessing this will actually be document-heavy for its size.

Now a new firm comes in, they'll have to read through every one of those documents, plus the previous firms files, advice, correspondence etc (itself being a hefty amount). And then they'll need to familiarise themselves with it and the case in general. All the while charging $400/hr + barristers fees (more expensive than that). If they're appointing new counsel as well, then that's another set of lawyers to familiarise themselves with the case.

All to get their new lawyers up to the same standard that their old lawyers were the day before they fired them.

And I have NEVER heard of a situation where firing an experienced law firm had any benefit to it. Usually it happens when the client doesn't really 'get' the law, and expects it to work like the media/shitty films, where you can just hire good lawyers and magically make the legal requirements go away. Either that, or their lawyers start to explain to them how shite their case is, or how their argument just can't be substantiated in court, or how they actually need to provide some real evidence in response to holes in their version of events.

Law is like any other profession - tv makes it out to be run on 'flashes of brilliance', but really it's just attention to detail, experience and familiarity with the relevant law/context. Going from one adequately experienced law firm to another just isn't likely to do anything but cost money - especially given that you've already got an independent 2nd opinion on the case from the counsel/barrister when they get the brief.

I'm guessing either Bethesda can't into litigation or their basic case is a little wobbly.

 

[Ausir]

Don't forget that it's the second time that Bethesda is firing a law firm and hiring another during this very lawsuit. Wonder how long this one will last.

 

[Sceptic]

And I have NEVER heard of a situation where firing an experienced law firm had any benefit to it.

Well... I'm not sure the previous firm was in any way "experienced". I'm no lawyer, but their streak of gaffes was rather impressive.

 

[Ausir]

As was the one's before that.

 

[Forest Dweller]

I hope someone makes a movie about this. Will be funny as hell ^^

It could be incorporated into the new Damages season.

 

[Sceptic]

Don't forget that it's the second time that Bethesda is firing a law firm and hiring another during this very lawsuit.

Wait I missed your post when I made mine - so this is the THIRD firm they hire on this very lawsuit???

Ah, Bethesda.

 

[Jaesun]

Don't forget that it's the second time that Bethesda is firing a law firm and hiring another during this very lawsuit.

Wait I missed your post when I made mine - so this is the THIRD firm they hire on this very lawsuit???

Ah, Bethesda.

Yeah, when the KING of the fucking Dumbfucks Herve owns your ass 3 times.... you really really are doing it wrong. Jebus Bethesda are more incopetent than Herve. And he single handedly burned Interplay into the ground.

 

[obediah]

And I have NEVER heard of a situation where firing an experienced law firm had any benefit to it.

Well... I'm not sure the previous firm was in any way "experienced". I'm no lawyer, but their streak of gaffes was rather impressive.

Not being a lawyer, are you sure you can tell the difference between an inexperienced law firms gaffe and an experienced law firm stringing out a shit case to for the billable hours? I haven't been following things closely, or even mediumly - but I don't remember law-and-order-worthy gaffes.

 

[denizsi]

AHAHAHHAHAHAHA.

Bethesda seems to be grasping at straws rather desperately. I doubt if any respectable law firm is taking them seriously at this point. Ex-Bethesda staff might as well turn up to sue for rights to TES again.

 

[Melcar]

 

[gromit]

Some of you have to be kidding. I don't think it really matters if Bethesda can "win."

I mean, this is a company that was bled right out by its indecisiveness, and loathed by even normal gamers for abusing, neglecting, and abandoning their bread and butter properties right as they were dominating in their many niches. And now - under the same management? - they're developing five games at once, all based on existing IP.

Aside from the Fallout sale, and recurring sales of older titles - have they done well with, say, the Wii's virtual console (EWJ? The early Blizzard games?) to get the boost they seem to have?

So how much money do you suppose a company that spent two and a half years essentially dead actually has on hand?
Probably not enough to develop five games at once and afford this shit.

 

[Metro]

They should have gotten Skadden, Arps~

 

[denizsi]

Some of you have to be kidding. I don't think it really matters if Bethesda can "win."

I mean, this is a company that was bled right out by its indecisiveness, and loathed by even normal gamers for abusing, neglecting, and abandoning their bread and butter properties right as they were dominating in their many niches. And now - under the same management? - they're developing five games at once, all based on existing IP.

Aside from the Fallout sale, and recurring sales of older titles - have they done well with, say, the Wii's virtual console (EWJ? The early Blizzard games?) to get the boost they seem to have?

So how much money do you suppose a company that spent two and a half years essentially dead actually has on hand?
Probably not enough to develop five games at once and afford this shit.

 

[ALT999]

Lol. I can't comment with any real expertise on this, as this kind of large commercial ligitation is a different world to criminal trials, but I suspect that this would be costing Bethesda a fortune. Smaller cases than this have involved hundreds and hundreds of folders full of documents (i.e. hundreds of sets of documents, not just hundreds of documents). In a case that might bring up the minute details of the online game from art to source code to design docs, plus records of numerous telephone conversations, emails, the contract itself and all supporting documentary evidence of the process by which it was negotiated, every letter ever written between the firms, etc.....I'm guessing this will actually be document-heavy for its size.

Now a new firm comes in, they'll have to read through every one of those documents, plus the previous firms files, advice, correspondence etc (itself being a hefty amount). And then they'll need to familiarise themselves with it and the case in general. All the while charging $400/hr + barristers fees (more expensive than that). If they're appointing new counsel as well, then that's another set of lawyers to familiarise themselves with the case.

All to get their new lawyers up to the same standard that their old lawyers were the day before they fired them.

You should have stopped here. Finally, I thought to myself, there's a subject azrael actually knows about and has something interesting to say on. If you could estimate the monies I'd be happier but like you say there's lots of types of law. This seems like it will be in the millions, though, just to get them up to speed again.

And I have NEVER heard of a situation where firing an experienced law firm had any benefit to it. Usually it happens when the client doesn't really 'get' the law, and expects it to work like the media/shitty films, where you can just hire good lawyers and magically make the legal requirements go away. Either that, or their lawyers start to explain to them how shite their case is, or how their argument just can't be substantiated in court, or how they actually need to provide some real evidence in response to holes in their version of events.

Law is like any other profession - tv makes it out to be run on 'flashes of brilliance', but really it's just attention to detail, experience and familiarity with the relevant law/context. Going from one adequately experienced law firm to another just isn't likely to do anything but cost money - especially given that you've already got an independent 2nd opinion on the case from the counsel/barrister when they get the brief.

I'm guessing either Bethesda can't into litigation or their basic case is a little wobbly.

And then you slip back into mediocrity or outright stupidity. I know because I've done it and know many others who have, successfully.

It's not so much flash of brilliance but scumbags who don't give a fuck or who try to drain as much as they can off of you, and like any profession 80% of people are mediocre or incompetent. So if some asshole is snowballing you and padding hours you just sit there and take it? People having that attitude is how ridiculous rates like you mention above become a reality in the first place. As an aspy lawyer (what a ridiculous, hopeless combination) you don't get that most lawyers are lying scumbag wastrels who have to have a gun to their head every second to keep them working.

If you keep your lawyer on track and working for you and he is aggressive you will win like 90% of the time if you have a reasonable case, but if you just sit there like a fucking blob you will almost always lose. Maybe in australia since it's so small town it is a different situation but my guess is that you are just an asshat, because anyone who's ever tried to run a business realizes pretty quickly half your effort is keeping people honest.

But yeah, looks like bethesda is fucked. Which is hard to tell for sure if you don't read a million legal documents but it looks very much to me like they have violated their contract. Which doesn't mean they simply don't get to block interplay but which could lead to serious monetary penalties and loss of fallout license completely, and complete bankruptcy of Bethesda Software, which is result I am hoping for.

 

[denizsi]

Bankruptcy? Bethesda is owned by ZeniMax, a neocon establishment.

 

[Pika-Cthulhu]

Im speechless, Herve wins AGAIN. Fuck me dead, that motherfucker is the slimiest fucking eel to slip through anything.

Still dont know who to hate the least in this, Herve for being Herve, or Beth for being Beth. Maybe we can see a truly catastrophic event where Beth is stripped of the licence, and Herve is installed as the CEO of Beth to run it into the ground. Fuck, if I was the judge, id make that ruling for the lulz and because of Beths lawyer musical chairs and wasting my time.

 

[ALT1071]

Bankruptcy? Bethesda is owned by ZeniMax, a neocon establishment.

They just bought 4-5 game studios including ID software. I don't think they are even a publicly traded company, so they can't have unlimited cash. They could be penalized all income they got from fallout depending on how serious the violation is, and they will also have to pay for both sides of the legal fees.

So you could have 10 million in legal fees plus even more in punitive damages or royalties. Plus they'll lose their biggest IP. That could easily be enough to sink them after putting out all that cash.

 

[Mastermind]

Bankruptcy? Bethesda is owned by ZeniMax, a neocon establishment.

Uh huh. Neocon. Which is why they had cannibal Republicans and an iraq war supporter parody in fallout 3.

 

[Blind Eye]

Isn't Robert Altman the head of the board of directors. You would think, at the very least, he'd know what law firm to hire for the job.

 

[Ausir]

Robert A. Altman the bank embezzler, I'd add, not Robert B. Altman the movie director.

 

[Ausir]

Update: It turns out that Bethesda did not really change their lawyers this time like they did a year ago. While they have changed the law firm, it is because their lead counsel on the case, Howard H. Stahl, previously of Steptoe & Johnson, has moved to Fried, Frank, Harris, Shriver & Jacobson.

 

[Blind Eye]

From the web site you linked.................Altman is an educated lawyer.

 

[Ausir]

Yes, just mentioning that he's not Robert Altman the famous movie director for those not in the know.