Review Next Level Gaming loves Bloodlines

[Vault Dweller]

Tags: Troika Games; Vampire: The Masquerade - Bloodlines

It's the <a href=http://www.vampirebloodlines.com>Bloodlines</a> review season, and it looks like everyone likes it, even <a href=http://www.rpgcodex.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=5698>Exitium the resident skeptic</a>. Anyway, <a href=http://www.nlgaming.com>Next Level Gaming</a> is very <a href=http://www.nlgaming.com/nl/asp/id_1037/nl/reviewDisp.htm>excited</a> about the game, comparing it to the high caliber (*rolls*) games like BG2 and KotOR, giving it <b>90/100</b>, and concluding that it's a "fantastic mix of RPG and adventure game that keeps drawing you in deeper into the world, and the farther you go the more you want to see".
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<blockquote>In the end I can give this games one of the highest praises I can think of: Ever time its time to turn it off I find myself always saying… I’ll stop after one more quest, which always winds up turning into 5, 6, 7… more quests. Vampire: The Masquerade—Bloodlines is the culmination of next-generation first-person action game engine technology, a top RPG developer and a renowned RPG franchise. Built using Valve’s Source Technology— the same game engine technology used to power Half-Life 2, the game is based on White Wolf’s renowned pen-and-paper RPG series Vampire: The Masquerade and its official clans. Developed by Troika Games—creators of top RPG franchises such as Arcanum (2002 RPG of the year—PC Gamer) and the Fallout series, Vampire: The Masquerade—Bloodlines promises to take RPG gaming to the next level.</blockquote>The review isn't very informative, so there isn't much to see there
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Thanks, <b>Briosafreak</b>

 

[Otaku_Hanzo]

A few of my friends whom I know that bought the game are really giving it high praise. And these are people who aren't biased by pretty graphics either. They are genuinely impressed with the job Troika has done. Some of them are even diehard V:TM fans and they're loving the game.

Looks like Troika got themselves a winner. I'm glad too. They needed it.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Bloodlines is the culmination of next-generation first-person action game engine technology,

That's actually poised to be Half-Life 2, if I recall correctly, not Bloodlines...

a top RPG developer

...from the guys behind Fallout - Now With Elves And Spells and a lacking dungeon crawler...

and a renowned RPG franchise.

...which is so good it has yet to prove real monetary incentive to developers and publishers.

OMGZ GRR8 GAEM ITZ TEH WIN!!!

Seriously, I like Troika and their efforts, and hope Bloodlines is actually cool, but this is as bad as the hype Bioware usually gets.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Looks like Troika got themselves a winner. I'm glad too. They needed it.

Hopefully it will erase a part of the ToEE fiasco while placing them as a group of developers that publishers might want to sink their teeth into (without sucking much blood out of them, though).

Yes, pun filled to fit the theme of the post. I'm so witty. Not.

 

[Visbhume]

Mmmm... that review talks about multiplayer, but wasn't multiplayer support scrapped during development ?

 

[Vault Dweller]

I'm bored so ...

Bloodlines is the culmination of next-generation first-person action game engine technology,

That's actually poised to be Half-Life 2, if I recall correctly, not Bloodlines...

Well, the engine is there, is it not? So whatever people may say about the HL2 engine applies to Bloodlines.

a top RPG developer

...from the guys behind Fallout - Now With Elves And Spells and a lacking dungeon crawler...

First, is Troika not a top RPG developer? It doesn't say the bestest evar, does it? Second, ToEE was a pretty good dungeon crawler.

and a renowned RPG franchise.

...which is so good it has yet to prove real monetary incentive to developers and publishers.

Once again, isn't Fallout a renowned RPG franchise? Doesn't say nothing about the most profitable or the most popular. Bethesda wouldn't have bought a shitty little setting after all, they wanted a name.

Seriously, I like Troika and their efforts, and hope Bloodlines is actually cool, but this is as bad as the hype Bioware usually gets.

Puh-fucking-lease! I understand that it's popular to trash Troika nowadays proving that a person si not teh biased!!111, but let's be reasonable here. :wink:

Hopefully it will erase a part of the ToEE fiasco...

Didn't it like sell rather well despite "OMG! It's so difficult and complex" reviews?

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Well, the engine is there, is it not? So whatever people may say about the HL2 engine applies to Bloodlines.

I don't see how, really, specially considering the underlying technology is being used differently; that alone already means the engine is being used differently and as such will have a different focus and ultimately, will be different in several fields. For the game to be the pinnacle of, quote the original statement, "(...) next-generation first-person action game engine technology", it should, for instance, use the technology it has (such as physics) at the very least in the same level as HL2 does, and this doesn't seem to case.

Another point of note would be that the game is being touted there as the climax of "action game technology"... I thought it was meant to be an RPG.

First, is Troika not a top RPG developer?

If they are, I'm unaware of when they become so.

It doesn't say the bestest evar, does it?

No, and neither did I said it did. Shocking revelation, today only at RPG Codex!!

Second, ToEE was a pretty good dungeon crawler.

I'm sure you think so, too. Before you try to ask me what I felt of it and drag this on into bullet point reasons of what worked and didn't and who's wrong or not (despite being useless butt fucking each other over personal tastes), I found it satisfactory but with too many problems to be considered "pretty good".

Once again, isn't Fallout a renowned RPG franchise?

They are talking of Vampire in that quote, not Bloodlines.

Doesn't say nothing about the most profitable or the most popular.

No kidding? That's the second shocking revelation of the day. We're on a roll, here!

Bethesda wouldn't have bought a shitty little setting after all, they wanted a name.

Uh, good for them. As before, that specific quote is addressing Vampire, not Fallout.

Puh-fucking-lease! I understand that it's popular to trash Troika nowadays proving that a person si not teh biased!!111,

I'm not trendy. That can be both a blessing and curse, though.

but let's be reasonable here. :wink:

Uh, this is the Codex. Being reasonable has gotten old a few hundred posts back

Didn't it like sell rather well despite "OMG! It's so difficult and complex" reviews?

Fiasco's significance isn't strictly that of finance. A product that fails on several levels can be a financial liability or a reputation breaker. I was using the term in regards to the reputation dealio, in fact. I'm not aware of how much it sold (though as you say, I seem to remember about it selling better than thought about), but even then I don't think it was that much of a commercial hit.

 

[Jed]

Seriously, I like Troika and their efforts, and hope Bloodlines is actually cool, but this is as bad as the hype Bioware usually gets.

OMG -- traitor! Where's Volourn to see this?

 

[Saint_Proverbius]

Mmmm... that review talks about multiplayer, but wasn't multiplayer support scrapped during development ?

Yes, it was.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I don't see how, really, specially considering the underlying technology is being used differently; that alone already means the engine is being used differently and as such will have a different focus and ultimately, will be different in several fields. For the game to be the pinnacle of, quote the original statement, "(...) next-generation first-person action game engine technology", it should, for instance, use the technology it has (such as physics) at the very least in the same level as HL2 does, and this doesn't seem to case.

They don't have the same physics? I don't really know that, so you may be right then, but didn't some previews praised the physics of the game (knocking columns down, throwing the loose board away, etc)? Also, I'm not an expert on "next-generation first-person action game engine technology", so I have no idea what that means. All I know is that Bloodlines is using that engine, which was the big selling point, so it's safe to assume that they've kept all bells and whistles it came with (whatever they are)

Another point of note would be that the game is being touted there as the climax of "action game technology"... I thought it was meant to be an RPG.

Well, technically it's an RPG built on "action game technology", so I don't see anything wrong with this statement. EVN, for example, is an RPG built on "arcade technology".

First, is Troika not a top RPG developer?

If they are, I'm unaware of when they become so.

Subjective. I'd say there are 3 top RPG developers left: Bio, Beth, and Troika. Comparing to guys like Larian for example, Troika is definitely one of the top guys. Considering that Fallout and Arcanum are one of the best RPGs, and Troika's name is associated with the former and is responsible for latter, that definitely makes them a top developer. According to the early impressions, Bloodlines proves that claim.

Second, ToEE was a pretty good dungeon crawler.

I'm sure you think so, too. Before you try to ask me what I felt of it and drag this on into bullet point reasons of what worked and didn't and who's wrong or not (despite being useless butt fucking each other over personal tastes), I found it satisfactory but with too many problems to be considered "pretty good".

If you mean the bugs, then yeah, sure. I was under the impression that "lacking" referred to the gameplay.

They are talking of Vampire in that quote, not Bloodlines.

Ah, my bad then.

Didn't it like sell rather well despite "OMG! It's so difficult and complex" reviews?

Fiasco's significance isn't strictly that of finance. A product that fails on several levels can be a financial liability or a reputation breaker. I was using the term in regards to the reputation dealio, in fact.

Fiasco means a complete failure, and that's what I disagreed with. There is no arguing, however, that there were plenty of issues, both false and true, that resulted in bad reputation.

 

[Mendoza]

First, is Troika not a top RPG developer?

If they are, I'm unaware of when they become so.

Subjective. I'd say there are 3 top RPG developers left: Bio, Beth, and Troika. Comparing to guys like Larian for example, Troika is definitely one of the top guys. Considering that Fallout and Arcanum are one of the best RPGs, and Troika's name is associated with the former and is responsible for latter, that definitely makes them a top developer. According to the early impressions, Bloodlines proves that claim.

Personally I'd add Obsidian to that list, despite them not having released game as Obsidian yet (unless you're counting them as a Bio subsidiary :wink: ).

 

[Vault Dweller]

First, like you said, they haven't released anything yet. I don't doubt that they will, of course, but it's too early to claim that they are top guys. Second, also like you said, so far they work with Bio hand-me-downs, which is kinda less exciting and original.

 

[mathboy]

[quoite="Roleplayer"]EVERYTHING[/quote]

You sound and look like Volourn now!!!!!!!!! HELP US!!!

 

[Avin]

hey, is bloodlines already out? has anybody here get a copy?

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yep

 

[Fez]

I thought by "a renowned RPG franchise" they were referring to the P&P style game (which has inspired the PC game), it has been going for years now and must have made some decent profits judging by all the junk associated with it. It's popular with goth types and goth LARP fans I believe.

 

[Volourn]

First off, all these positive reviews must mean Troika spent some money to bribe people. R00fles!

Secondly, TOEE wasn't a great or even good dungeon crawler. It was a great rules implementer (compartively speaking). That's it.

Thirdly, when listing great 'RPG developers'; one should add Blizzard and Squaresoft to that list even if they don't make "real" RPGs.

Fourthly, how can Troika get credit for Fallout when Obsidian does or vice versa. What a bucnh of winkmots both groups are. Tsk, tsk.

Fifthly, in all seriousness, Blodlines sounds much better than TOIEE. At least the reviews are harping on bugs. LOL I'm sure the game will be good story and role-playing wise; but I'm still worried about combat. I hope it doesn't ruin the game for me like combat did it Gothic 2 which I stopped playing completely.

Sixthly, January cna't come too soon!

Seventhly, I have to agree with everyone else and say Role-player sounds almost like me. That's scary!

 

[Vault Dweller]

Secondly, TOEE wasn't a great or even good dungeon crawler.

Why is that?

Thirdly, when listing great 'RPG developers'; one should add Blizzard and Squaresoft to that list even if they don't make "real" RPGs.

Blizzard isn't a dedicated RPG developer. The Diablo series is rather popular, but nobody expects another RPG out of them anytime soon, so calling them a top RPG developer is an exaggeration. As for Square, wasn't the last decent FF RPG made a *very* long time ago, if ever? I thought that they are in a MMO game these days, no?

Fourthly, how can Troika get credit for Fallout when Obsidian does or vice versa. What a bucnh of winkmots both groups are. Tsk, tsk.

Because Obsidian people had very little to do with Fallout, but you do have a point as they are responsible for PST.

Fifthly, in all seriousness, Blodlines sounds much better than TOIEE. At least the reviews are harping on bugs. LOL I'm sure the game will be good story and role-playing wise; but I'm still worried about combat. I hope it doesn't ruin the game for me like combat did it Gothic 2 which I stopped playing completely.

I'm playing it now, after all you whining about how good the non-combat parts are, and while the combat is crappy, it's not very difficult. So, out of curiosity, what was your problem, and what was your primary combat skill? What keys did you use to fight?

Seventhly, I have to agree with everyone else and say Role-player sounds almost like me. That's scary!

You have finally corrupted him with your R00fles and "Why do you lie" extravaganza.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

They don't have the same physics?

*Ahem*. I said I felt Bloodlines should use the physics system at least in the same level as Half-Life 2 for it to be considered the utmost expression of yadda yadda yadda technology, not that Bloodlines didn't had the same physics.

All I know is that Bloodlines is using that engine, which was the big selling point, so it's safe to assume that they've kept all bells and whistles it came with (whatever they are)

As I said, they don't seem to use them on the same level, but they are there. As for other elements I'm not sure what they are, or if Troika is also using them on the same level.

Subjective.

Hmmm.

I'd say there are 3 top RPG developers left: Bio, Beth, and Troika. Comparing to guys like Larian for example, Troika is definitely one of the top guys.

Yet, comparing to Larian, Obsidian doesn't even have a background history yet as a company! I'm weary of considering relatively new companies the "top" of something when they're just getting started or have very few games released yet or even have yet to get a more positive response from the public.

If I felt Troika wasn't quite there yet, imagine how I'm wondering why Obsidian is one of the top CRPG developers when they still have no game released yet (that kinda reminds me of the Ion Storm division that was billed as one of the top game developers in the industry when they still only had projects and financements going on, but no game whatsoever). Sure, we know some of them were former Black Isle workers, but its a different company altogether.

If you mean the bugs, then yeah, sure. I was under the impression that "lacking" referred to the gameplay.

...Bugs and gameplay. The combat system kicked arse, but most of the combat was so straightforward that most of the combat options didn't need to be used. Great engine, poor pathfinding. Very few battles were engaging. Story wasn't very good (sure, Gygax wrote the orginal module, but nothing prevented Troika from expanding on it). The game was overal a bit short as well. It's a fun little game which unfortunately I don't see myself returning to. It's not a memorable game to as much as Arcanum was, for instance.

Fiasco means a complete failure, and that's what I disagreed with. There is no arguing, however, that there were plenty of issues, both false and true, that resulted in bad reputation.

Yuppers.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Seriously, I like Troika and their efforts, and hope Bloodlines is actually cool, but this is as bad as the hype Bioware usually gets.

OMG -- traitor! Where's Volourn to see this?

EVERYTHING

You sound and look like Volourn now!!!!!!!!! HELP US!!!

Seventhly, I have to agree with everyone else and say Role-player sounds almost like me. That's scary!

Next dumbnut that compares me to Volourn - him included - is going to be my gimp :twisted:

 

[Volourn]

"Why is that?"

Here we go. Good dungeon crawlers have challenging combat. Save a few isolated battles, TOEE was EASY. Good dungeonc ralwers also have at the vry minimum decent stories and characters both of which TOEE lacks. Case closed.


"Blizzard isn't a dedicated RPG developer. The Diablo series is rather popular, but nobody expects another RPG out of them anytime soon, so calling them a top RPG developer is an exaggeration."

No. Not when their 'RPG' still sells. And, let's face it, Diablo 3 is only a matter of time.


"As for Square, wasn't the last decent FF RPG made a *very* long time ago, if ever? I thought that they are in a MMO game these days, no?"

First off, Square is mroe than just FF. Afterall, Xenogears isn't devloped by someone else. And, I'm sure UI'll be laughed at (what's new?); but I just started playing FFX2 and while some of it is silly over the top girly goofiness; it's pretty good. Heck, even the bad FFs are betetr than most RPGs except for FF5 and FFT which were just plain awful. You may have a point with Blizzard; but sorry, SS is still one of the top RPG developers. No doubt about it.

"Because Obsidian people had very little to do with Fallout"

Stop lying.


"I'm playing it now, after all you whining about how good the non-combat parts are, and while the combat is crappy, it's not very difficult. So, out of curiosity, what was your problem, and what was your primary combat skill? What keys did you use to fight?"

It's crappy. Plaina nd simple. And, no, I'm not explaining it again. Gothic 2 is old news. It's in the garbage bin of games. Next.


"Next dumbnut that compares me to Volourn is going to be my gimp."

Stop trolling.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Yet, comparing to Larian, Obsidian doesn't even have a background history yet as a company! I'm weary of considering relatively new companies the "top" of something when they're just getting started or have very few games released yet or even have yet to get a more positive response from the public.

Usually I'd agree, but there aren't many companies dedicated to quality role-playing as Troika is. Most of recently released games biilled as RPGs like Divinity, Gothic, Sacred, SS are action games where RP are merely gameplay elements not the focus.

If I felt Troika wasn't quite there yet, imagine how I'm wondering why Obsidian is one of the top CRPG developers when they still have no game released yet

I don't think that I mentioned that Obsidian is a top developer. In fact I agree with you that without a game their rep is based mostly on PST.

Very few battles were engaging.... It's a fun little game which unfortunately I don't see myself returning to. It's not a memorable game to as much as Arcanum was, for instance.

I see your point, but in regard to battles, I'd like to recommend you to try some interesting party setups like all rogue party multiclassed to whatever strikes your fancy.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

Stop trolling.

teh R00fles ! ! !

Usually I'd agree, but there aren't many companies dedicated to quality role-playing as Troika is. Most of recently released games biilled as RPGs like Divinity, Gothic, Sacred, SS are action games where RP are merely gameplay elements not the focus.

Ok, I see your point.

I see your point, but in regard to battles, I'd like to recommend you to try some interesting party setups like all rogue party multiclassed to whatever strikes your fancy.

Thanks. As I said, I don't think I'll return to it, but if I do I'll take that suggestion. I did try some weird combos and characters in the past, though. My reach weapon specialist was friggin' wicked!

 

[almondblight]

Of course reviewers (and previewers) hype things, especially ones written by people that haven't even played through the game. Wait a few weeks and you'll probably start to see the "Troika did a pretty good but flawed game called Arcanum, and a pretty flawed but good game called ToEE" reviews.

Also keep in mind the fact that most game reviewers aren't pretentious old blowhards like film reviewers, they're usually young socially stunted losers who talk about how great the blood splatter in games look. Not the type to give well written reviews.

 

[Diogo Ribeiro]

they're usually young socially stunted losers (...)

Aren't we all? :razz: Just kidding