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Editorial Why so many developers close their doors

VentilatorOfDoom

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Tags: Larian Studios

<p>It looks like Larian Studio's Swen Vincke started his own blog "Lar's World". Here's a <a href="http://www.lar.net/?p=14" target="_blank">funny story</a> giving some insight into the relationship between a small developer and a big publisher.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<blockquote>
<p>This post gets a bit technical, but if you ever need to deal with a publishing agreement, you need to be aware of the stuff that follows. Not enough developers are!</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>I told you about a friend developer who had a 50% royalty rate on a game that cost 2MUS$ to create and that sold over 500K units. I tried guessing how much money my friend developer received from the game. (Note that the numbers have been simplified for making my case and preventing identification of who I&rsquo;m talking about, but the message stays the same.)</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>The game retailed at 49US$ so the price in wholesale must&rsquo;ve been something around 39US$, meaning that on 100K units, 3.9MUS$ revenue would be generated.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Of those 3.9MUS$, the publisher could reasonably argue about 1.5MUS$ in costs, split over such esoteric goodies like sales cost, MDF, marketing, logistics, freight, first party royalty(it was a console title), dry goods &amp; assembly.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>That left 2,4MUS$ profit.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Since over 500K units were sold, in theory there was 12MUS$ in profit, but obviously some further price reductions needed to be taken into account, so let&rsquo;s say they made 10MUS$ .</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Of that 10MUS$, I guessed my developer friend should get 5MUS$, but since he signed what&rsquo;s called an advance versus royalty deal, the 2MUS$ he received for development should be subtracted from the 5MUS$.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>That meant he should get 3MUS$.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>But he got nothing. After querying him, he told me that other than the development budget , all other the costs were also deductible from his royalties. (yeah, he&rsquo;s not always very bright)</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>That meant that the 20MUS$ revenue from wholesale was split in two, and from my friends half, they took 9.5MUS$ (publishing costs+development cost), leaving him with 0,5MUS$. (and the publisher with 10MUS$ profit)</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Checking with him again, I was startled to find that I was wrong again. My cost estimates were too low. He told me they were about double what I estimated. That meant 15MUS$ instead of 7,5MUS$.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>I said that&rsquo;s impossible, what do they use to ship their boxes, a limousine? You should audit them!</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>His answer: I don&rsquo;t think we&rsquo;ll find enough during an audit enough to cancel out all of the costs we&rsquo;d need to cancel for me to get some money. Besides, I would risk my relation with the publisher and they promised me some work for hire. And to be honest, I can&rsquo;t spare the cash for an audit &nbsp;and everything that entails.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Knowing a thing or two about how it works at a publisher, you can be sure they didn&rsquo;t spend 15MUS$ in costs, so they probably made more than 10MUS$ on this deal, whereas said developer ended up with zero and is now begging them for another deal.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Pretty sad if you ask me and unfortunately quite common. It&rsquo;s one of the reasons so many developers end up closing down. He obviously is to blame for signing a bad contract whereas the publisher definitely is to blame for inflating costs.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>This is btw a publisher that&rsquo;s quite well known, and they actually market themselves to the public as being there for giving small developers a chance. Yeah, right.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
 

Kz3r0

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Remember kids, piracy is bad, deprives working people of their rightly earned money. :thumbsup:
 

zeitgeist

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So, the game cost $2mil to develop, the developer received $2mil from the publisher, everyone's wages were paid, and this is somehow not only bad, but bad enough to make the developer consider closing down?
 

Kz3r0

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zeitgeist said:
So, the game cost $2mil to develop, the developer received $2mil from the publisher, everyone's wages were paid, and this is somehow not only bad, but bad enough to make the developer consider closing down?
:retarded:
 

Shannow

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zeitgeist said:
So, the game cost $2mil to develop, the developer received $2mil from the publisher, everyone's wages were paid, and this is somehow not only bad, but bad enough to make the developer consider closing down?
Yes. The dev did the vast majority of the work and the publisher kept the vast majority of the profit. That should really motivate the dev to work harder next time instead of whining.
Whiny bitches. The workers everywhere produce the actual products and the bosses everywhere rake in the profits. The alternative would be communism. We don't want communism, do we? :M
 

treave

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zeitgeist said:
So, the game cost $2mil to develop, the developer received $2mil from the publisher, everyone's wages were paid, and this is somehow not only bad, but bad enough to make the developer consider closing down?

I see what you mean, the developer should've been skimming off the top and over-reporting development budgets just to ensure they actually profited from the deal instead of losing money because of costs in running a company that aren't covered under the development budget. Clever scheme.

:thumbsup:
 

Roguey

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What are you doing Swen? Even if you're not using any names I don't think any publisher is going to be happy with anyone talking about this so openly. This is stuff you mention anonymously or when you're retired and no longer have to work with them.
 

felipepepe

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So, talented & naivee dude goes to a big company, sign a bad contract and gets raped in the end. No big news.

IIRC Mike Oldfield signed a 17-year-long contract with Virgin when he released Tubular Bells, and only recieved 5% of all the money one of the world's best selling albuns ever made...he was so pissed that when he got out of the contract he released Amarök, that had a message in morse code, reading "FUCK OFF RB" (Richard Branson, Virgin chief). :lol:
 

Lightknight

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one of the world's best selling albuns ever made..
Never heard of the guy. Are you confusing USA with the entire world again ? And what's "albun" ?
 
Self-Ejected

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I remember seeing a joke about this a long time ago, regarding the music industry.

50% royalty after creative accounting, means you get nothing and sometimes you owe them money.
 

felipepepe

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Lightknight said:
one of the world's best selling albuns ever made..
Never heard of the guy. Are you confusing USA with the entire world again ? And what's "albun" ?
Trying too hard kid, I'm not even american. And you never hearing Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells does not mean it didn't sold 17 million copies worldwide, just proves that you are a music retard and your mama still doesn't let you watch The Exorcist.
 

DarkUnderlord

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I hate this bullshit with fake figures. This is WHY there's such a problem - nobody is willing to come out with the actual numbers and the actual agreement so that we can point out where the guy got screwed. Instead, you get some BS where the numbers are speculative (and self-corrected twice in the one post?) and leave open the possibility that: Maybe the game didn't do so well (how can we be sure?) or the guy really is an idiot who signed a dodge deal that nobody else with a lawyer would go near.

There's no suggestion as to what IS a good deal - and how much the developer could reasonably expect. For example, if the game was published elsewhere, would it have sold 500k copies or much less? How many other similar deals are really done? Has anyone got a chance of getting a "good deal" or is this sort of deal "the standard" and other publishers just rip you off more?
 
In My Safe Space
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felipepepe said:
Lightknight said:
one of the world's best selling albuns ever made..
Never heard of the guy. Are you confusing USA with the entire world again ? And what's "albun" ?
Trying too hard kid, I'm not even american. And you never hearing Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells does not mean it didn't sold 17 million copies worldwide, just proves that you are a music retard and your mama still doesn't let you watch The Exorcist.
How was he supposed to hear it? Did he release it for free download or something?
 

Darth Roxor

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20090123105455-apothecary.jpg
 
In My Safe Space
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What? I'm merely pointing out that it's retarded to accuse someone of bad taste just because he never heard something that isn't freely available to listen to.
 

sea

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Reminds me of the terrible contracts the music industry is fond of giving artists - give some young hopeful what sounds like a good deal, until you include the clause that says that they have to pay for everything out of their own pockets, hidden in the fine print under subsection G6, which leads to the label making a profit and the artist actually losing money on the deal. If there is one constant in the universe, it's that those with knowledge of contract law will find a way to fuck over people who don't.
 

felipepepe

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Awor Szurkrarz said:
What? I'm merely pointing out that it's retarded to accuse someone of bad taste just because he never heard something that isn't freely available to listen to.
That.....makes no sense.

So I can't say that people who buys every single CoD & MW game + DLC have bad taste, because Fallout isn't freely available?
 

DraQ

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Roguey said:
What are you doing Swen? Even if you're not using any names I don't think any publisher is going to be happy with anyone talking about this so openly. This is stuff you mention anonymously or when you're retired and no longer have to work with them.
Isn't Dragon Commander going to be distributed by CDPR?
:smug:

sea said:
Reminds me of the terrible contracts the music industry is fond of giving artists - give some young hopeful what sounds like a good deal, until you include the clause that says that they have to pay for everything out of their own pockets, hidden in the fine print under subsection G6, which leads to the label making a profit and the artist actually losing money on the deal. If there is one constant in the universe, it's that those with knowledge of contract law will find a way to fuck over people who don't.
There is a solution, though it might seem rather... final.
 
In My Safe Space
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felipepepe said:
Awor Szurkrarz said:
What? I'm merely pointing out that it's retarded to accuse someone of bad taste just because he never heard something that isn't freely available to listen to.
That.....makes no sense.

So I can't say that people who buys every single CoD & MW game + DLC have bad taste, because Fallout isn't freely available?
What does it have to that Mike Oldfield guy? It's not like everything besides his music is dumbed down simplified music for the lowest common denominator. He's just one musican out of tens of thousands or maybe even millions.
 

Turjan

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felipepepe said:
Lightknight said:
one of the world's best selling albuns ever made..
Never heard of the guy. Are you confusing USA with the entire world again ? And what's "albun" ?
Trying too hard kid, I'm not even american. And you never hearing Mike Oldfield's Tubular Bells does not mean it didn't sold 17 million copies worldwide, just proves that you are a music retard and your mama still doesn't let you watch The Exorcist.
He might just be too young. It's been a while since Mike Oldfield's heydays.
 

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