Game News Age of Decadence Journeys Through Zamedi

[buccaroobonzai]

I kinda like how that combat option is there in the oposite way to fallout. By this I mean in fallout combat was the easiest and most obvious option. Good to see it pulled away from that yet influenced from at the same time

Great point, Age of Decadence looks like one of the first of hopefully a bunch of CRPGs to take the Troika/Fallout/Arcanum design principles and evolve them, and take them in new directions even improving on many ideas.

If you look on the AOD forum at the ruined tower example and pics, there are several ways to gain entry into the tower, one of which includes using a rope to climb up and enter through a hatch. Little details like this is what made the greats like Ultima 6/7, Wasteland, Fallout, Arcanum really stand out and become memorable, and legendary.

 

[obediah]

Age of Decadence in stores september 2014

Nah, most of the major work is done, just cleaning up a few things that aren't perfect, and then final testing and polish. Nothing exact, but probably 3-6 months. It's been in that state since 2005. :D

 

[Darth Roxor]

Nah, most of the major work is done, just cleaning up a few things that aren't perfect, and then final testing and polish. Nothing exact, but probably 3-6 months. It's been in that state since 2005. :D

AoD = TSLRP 2.0?

 

[Vault Dweller]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

Nah, most of the major work is done, just cleaning up a few things that aren't perfect, and then final testing and polish. Nothing exact, but probably 3-6 months. It's been in that state since 2005. :D

http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=18462

2007:

"Hard to say, really. Look at it this way. Suppose you decide to make a table one day. You figure out that it would take a couple of days and start working. In a couple of days the table is completed and you proudly observe your masterpiece. Hmm... The good news is it's definitely a fucking table and nobody would confuse it with a chair. The bad news is the table leaves much to be desired. In my opinion, at least, but then again, in this particular case, my opinion is the one that truly matters. So, you start tinkering with the table: replace a leg or two, add some drawers, carve some details, and polish this fucker until you hate the day when you decided to make it.

So, from one, purely technical point of view, you can say that it's 100% done and playable. From a more demanding point of view, it's about 60% done, meaning that I would like to replace about 40% given an opportunity (just like we replaced the interface, for example). I can post a list of things I want to fix, if someone's interested and, perhaps, would like to help.

Here is another explanation. Gothic 3 was shipped when all the pieces were put together. It was a brilliant, but absolutely unpolished game, which is a shame, because

a) it almost killed PB and whether or not the studio will recover is unclear.
b) it ruined gameplay for many players and created an impression that the game sucked.

The game should have been in development for at least another 6 months or another year. That's the mistake that we are trying to avoid. Unlike a real development studio, we don't work full time, so a few months of regular development time mean 6 months worth of work for us. Well, patience is a virtue."

...

Overall, I don't think there is a single person here who would fail to see the difference between a playable game and a well done game, so why the fuss? Sure the game was in development for 4 years. Sounds like a lot. Since we are working on it part time, divide it by 3, so we get 1.5 years tops. Still a lot? Now compare it to any decent RPG with C&C development time. 3-4 years. So, once again, why the fuss?

 

[Unradscorpion]

There's no fuss, we just like to repackage old Duke Nukem Forever jokes and use them again.

 

[raving nincompoop]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

I think he failed his detect hyperbole check.

 

[abstract]

If you look on the AOD forum at the ruined tower example and pics, there are several ways to gain entry into the tower, one of which includes using a rope to climb up and enter through a hatch..

So there's this ancient, long abandoned tower, whose main entrance is protected by weird magic/technology which requires a special artifact to pass... but someone forgot to close a hatch in the roof?

 

[Vault Dweller]

He's talking about a different location. A minor minaret-like tower on a destroyed bridge vs a large tower-like building with 5 large floors.

 

[Chefe]

There's no fuss, we just like to repackage old Duke Nukem Forever jokes and use them again.

And again. And again.

You should be proud, VD. Age of Decadance is the only real cRPG we can look forward to. I'm sure there's not one of us who wouldn't want you to spend all the time you need on it. It's what Blizzard does, and their games come out well polished and relatively bug free, and everyone gives kudos to them for it.

 

[Jora]

Yeah, people hit because they care.

 

[obediah]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

Nah, most of the major work is done, just cleaning up a few things that aren't perfect, and then final testing and polish. Nothing exact, but probably 3-6 months. It's been in that state since 2005. :D

http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=18462

Overall, I don't think there is a single person here who would fail to see the difference between a playable game and a well done game, so why the fuss? Sure the game was in development for 4 years. Sounds like a lot. Since we are working on it part time, divide it by 3, so we get 1.5 years tops. Still a lot? Now compare it to any decent RPG with C&C development time. 3-4 years. So, once again, why the fuss?

No fuss, I just have a compulsive need to poke the "pursuit of perfect software" wherever I see it. What you would be happy with is not static -
State of the art ( or the corresponding state for acceptable indie games) is a running target in graphics, mechanics, design, OS compatibility, and software distribution. And your personal wish list will only grow as you play, read, work, and generally experience life.

So if you can ever get the game you want and the polish you need. you're set and everyone wins (I look like a clueless hater - but get to play a new rpg that doesn't involve rhythm mechanics!). However, while the game has clearly been improving in an absolute sense the past 3 years, I haven't seen clear signs of a monotonic approach to those two release criteria. Hopefully I'm just not looking, or you're just not showing. But as is, I'm not ready to call AoD vapourware, but you've got enough warning signs that I feel like I should call the number on the commercial. Games that go on for so many years tend to either be abandoned, or give up on the polish and dump a buggy, hacked game.

It's tragic the amount of time you've spent solving problems that no longer exist ( 2D art, optimizing the size for modem downloads ), or the obsolete iterations of solutions to eternal problems like graphic quality. Closing Time wasn't a perfect album, but I'm so glad Tom Waits released it and moved on rather than spending the last 35 years in his basement improving it.

 

[DefJam101]

There's no fuss, we just like to repackage old Duke Nukem Forever jokes and use them again.

And again. And again.

You should be proud, VD. Age of Decadance is the only real cRPG we can look forward to.

American Hare.

 

[Vault Dweller]

No fuss, I just have a compulsive need to poke the "pursuit of perfect software" wherever I see it.

You are assuming that that's my goal. Or seriously misreading my posts. I'm not a perfectionist and I'm not trying to make a perfect game/software.

Games that go on for so many years tend to either be abandoned, or give up on the polish and dump a buggy, hacked game.

For "so many years"? First, you can't equate 4 years of part time development with 4 years of full development. Second, 4 years isn't that long when it comes to quality games. Bloodlines was in development for 4 years, if I'm not mistaken. Arcanum was in development for 3.5. Diablo 3 spent 5 years in development already. Starcraft was in development for 3.5 years, SC2 is in development since 2003. So is Dragon Age. Once again, that's full time, experienced developers, way more than 5 people. Third, we have to learn everything as we go. I wish we started with Torque right away. I wish we didn't have to waste time on 2D stuff, I wish we avoided a shitload of mistakes that could have been avoided by more experienced developers. So, basically on top of everything you have to throw some "learning things" time, assuming that you are interested in an unbiased evaluation of the development time.

... rather than spending the last 35 years in his basement improving it.

That's a very accurate analogy you got there.

 

[Unradscorpion]

There's no fuss, we just like to repackage old Duke Nukem Forever jokes and use them again.

And again. And again.

You should be proud, VD. Age of Decadance is the only real cRPG we can look forward to.

American Hare.

I don't think we can see as forward as that.

 

[Nicolai]

Keep polishing the game until you're pleased with its sheen. I'll buy a copy when you're done, it doesn't really matter if it takes you a week or three years. I won't be running out of time anytime soon.

 

[Kingston]

Keep polishing the game until you're pleased with its sheen. I'll buy a copy when you're done, it doesn't really matter if it takes you a week or three years. I won't be running out of time anytime soon.

Indeed. The longer its in development the better it'll be.

 

[Chefe]

There's no fuss, we just like to repackage old Duke Nukem Forever jokes and use them again.

And again. And again.

You should be proud, VD. Age of Decadance is the only real cRPG we can look forward to.

American Hare.

Never Forget™

 

[hiciacit]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

What I think he meant is that the two options you added for gaining access to the tower are so insanely difficult or neigh impossible (...either by stealth (insane amount of different checks in text adventure mode - only a master thief can pull it off) or combat (that's a purely hypothetical option because no dude is THAT bad)...), that in practical terms it will mostly boil down to having one option to enter the tower: serve House Aurelius faithfully.

 

[Azael]

I don't mind that at all. Wasn't the Sierra Army Depot only available to Wright made men in Fallout 2 for example? Sure, there were ways to get around that and become a made man for every family IIRC, but that was exploiting a bad design. Also, who said anything about being loyal, or rather remaining loyal after you get to the tower? I hope there will be plenty of option to betray House Aurelian and the other houses as well.

 

[Vault Dweller]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

What I think he meant is that the two options you added for gaining access to the tower are so insanely difficult or neigh impossible...

They are very difficult, but not impossible. "Balanced" characters won't stand a chance, specialized characters might be able to pull it off. From our forums:

I don't object to having really exclusive locations, but those extra options don't exactly invite the player in.

They aren't supposed to. However, if you really want to get inside and happened to be a Riddick (very fast, good dagger, high critical strike, high dagger skill, high dodge, 6 fast attacks per turn), then the game shouldn't hold you back. Go and waste the motherfuckers.

 

[Sarvis]

So the illusion of choice counts for making a game an RPG now?

I failed my INT check and must humbly beg you to clarify your witty comment.

What I think he meant is that the two options you added for gaining access to the tower are so insanely difficult or neigh impossible...

They are very difficult, but not impossible. "Balanced" characters won't stand a chance, specialized characters might be able to pull it off. From our forums:

I don't object to having really exclusive locations, but those extra options don't exactly invite the player in.

They aren't supposed to. However, if you really want to get inside and happened to be a Riddick (very fast, good dagger, high critical strike, high dagger skill, high dodge, 6 fast attacks per turn), then the game shouldn't hold you back. Go and waste the motherfuckers.

Ok, so a character build so highly specialized it will probably have problems with other areas of the game MIGHT be able to perform the task in another fashion. Seems pretty illusory to me...

Of course, there's also only 3 options... should we have a game to see what other options players could come up with quickly?

How about starting a fire nearby to distract people and get some of the guards out of the house to fight the fire?

Hiring someone else to sneak in and get the key for you?


Of course, if you implemented those other people playing other types of characters would come up with other solutions. You'll never cover every option... which is why you can't roleplay in a computer game.

 

[Chefe]

 

[hiciacit]

Ok, so a character build so highly specialized it will probably have problems with other areas of the game MIGHT be able to perform the task in another fashion. Seems pretty illusory to me...

Of course, there's also only 3 options... should we have a game to see what other options players could come up with quickly?

How about starting a fire nearby to distract people and get some of the guards out of the house to fight the fire?

Hiring someone else to sneak in and get the key for you?


Of course, if you implemented those other people playing other types of characters would come up with other solutions. You'll never cover every option... which is why you can't roleplay in a computer game.

Yeah, I guess that trying trying to cover all possible (thinkable) options would not exactly be feasible. On the other hand, you could also argue that the choices and consequences lie exactly in the fact that only certain -highly specified or not- builds can get access to certain areas or achieve certain goals. Nothing wrong with that, as far as I'm concerned. The more options to handle situations the better, of course, but this game doesn't seem to be lacking in that respect and we'd like it to come out one day, right? :wink:

 

[Kingston]

I like the idea of being able to hire someone to do it. The only problem is 1) No one wants to do it 2) If someone is willing to do it, they are either a dumbfuck or the best in the business. It will also cost you a lot of money.

The dumbfuck would obviously get caught and you would be found out in the end, sending a lot of problems your way. The superb thief would be hard to find, so you'd probably have to be a thief yourself, and who knows, he might just keep the shit he finds to himself.

 

[obediah]

How about starting a fire nearby to distract people and get some of the guards out of the house to fight the fire?

Hiring someone else to sneak in and get the key for you?


Of course, if you implemented those other people playing other types of characters would come up with other solutions. You'll never cover every option... which is why you can't roleplay in a computer game.

Yeah, I guess that trying trying to cover all possible (thinkable) options would not exactly be feasible.

The only hope for this is the people plugging away at physics and AI. Even though the current results are largely unimpressive, they are laying groundwork for future improvements. In the 80s and 90s we saw all sorts of great ideas implemented once in a game and then ignored by the community. As more and more projects move to using middleware, however, some of those results will be fed back into the system for the next game.