Vapourware Codexian Game Development Thread

[J_C]

I'm thinking of selling my game for free, but I want to make at least $2000 to cover the cost of making the game in the first place.
Can anyone think of a good business model for this?

I was thinking of holding my game hostage until people fundraise $2000, at which point it's released free for everyone. But it seems like a silly idea...

If your game is decent enough, just don't release it for free. Those fucking freeloader gamers get too much free stuff anyway.

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

I'm thinking of selling my game for free, but I want to make at least $2000 to cover the cost of making the game in the first place.
Can anyone think of a good business model for this?

I was thinking of holding my game hostage until people fundraise $2000, at which point it's released free for everyone. But it seems like a silly idea...

Noble idea, but first, ask yourself two important questions:

1. Do you want to make another game?
2. Do you want to make your next game bigger and better?

If you answer yes to both of them, don't release it for free. It would be a good idea to keep working on it until you're 100% sure it's worth at least $9.99. If you set a smaller price, your work will disappear in the sea of mobile ports and shovelware.

 

[PrettyDeadman]

Steel Breeze: The great disembarkation
https://youtu.be/kVKdfFi7E_M

Read it as Steel Breeze: The great dismembering, clicked excitedly thinking its some kind of melee fighter with dismemberment like Red Steel 2 or Blade of Darkness...

 

[50726f73706572]

Unity3D keeps breaking my linux builds. It has gotten so frequent now that every last single build has this issue.

 

[Bad Sector]

Now that the local weather has cooled down a bit and isn't trying to murder me any more, i can code a bit again... and decided to add some icon support in the editor since icons make software look more advanced than it is (though it isn't as effective as using a dark theme :-P). They also probably help with locating things faster in lists and stuff.

 

[aeternalis]

(warning: blogpost) Tinkering with a tactical RPG for a few weeks with some decent progress. I'm far from having something that's ready for its own thread (and it's uncertain how much time I'll be able to continue devoting to the project), but maybe within a few months I'll have decent screenshots (placeholder-art, natch) and a feature summary and roadmap.

 

[50726f73706572]

I don't know if anyone cares but the solution to the broken linux builds may have been any of the following.

-Close unity3d and and re-open to build the linux build separately.
-Copy over .zips one at a time to destination. Also wait a minute or two because OS often lies about being finished copying.
-Don't make builds with the editor if the game ever reloaded a .dll while the game was still running. Instead restart the editor first.

In reality I think the cause of the linux build corruptions is one of these 6:
-Microsoft breaks them on accident because they don't stress test copying of different file sizes.
-Microsoft breaks them on purpose so you as the developer reluctantly tell people to use the windows build (since it never fucks up)
-Linux breaks them because they also don't quality control copying of different file sizes.
-Unity3D has shitty conversion scripts and that mandatory nullref I see everytime I switch to building a linux build actually affects something relevant once in a while.
-My hardware is defective. It may be motherboard, ports, or hard disks.
-The zip softwares is broken/buggy on the windows or linux end.

I don't have the patience to figure out which it is. Especially since this has had a history of happening at random.


I could update windows and unity. But it likely will introduce even more problems.

 

[TheDeveloperDude]

Now we can set up different difficulty levels and map sizes for playing Steel Breeze. But I do not know who have the patience to play a 64x32 map. For a coffee break I humbly suggest the 2x2 map.
https://youtu.be/ylFjomAtQXs

 

[infidel]

I'm thinking of selling my game for free

Don't. Just don't. The cost of getting anything onto Steam is 100$ and it will at least give you the initial visibility round (read as sales), plus bumps through the discount sales. Even if your game is complete garbage, you will at least have something for the time you've spent on it.

If you set a smaller price, your work will disappear in the sea of mobile ports and shovelware.

I've heard this is a valid strategy for... some on Steam. As in, you make your game have the lowest price possible on the platform (something like 0.25$, I think?) so you're constantly in the "cheapest shit available" list on there and you get some traffic and sales constantly

 

[Bad Sector]

I've heard this is a valid strategy for... some on Steam. As in, you make your game have the lowest price possible on the platform (something like 0.25$, I think?) so you're constantly in the "cheapest shit available" list on there and you get some traffic and sales constantly

Yeah but how much does that make over time? Assuming you can somehow make life work (food, bills, taxes, etc) at ~$500/month, you'd still need at least a hundred sales *per day* at that pricepoint.

Of course we're talking about games that cost a fraction of a ringtone's price, so i guess one can take a ringtone-like approach when it comes to those games' quality and quantity instead of relying on a single one.

 

[d1nolore]

I've heard this is a valid strategy for... some on Steam. As in, you make your game have the lowest price possible on the platform (something like 0.25$, I think?) so you're constantly in the "cheapest shit available" list on there and you get some traffic and sales constantly

Yeah but how much does that make over time? Assuming you can somehow make life work (food, bills, taxes, etc) at ~$500/month, you'd still need at least a hundred sales *per day* at that pricepoint.

Of course we're talking about games that cost a fraction of a ringtone's price, so i guess one can take a ringtone-like approach when it comes to those games' quality and quantity instead of relying on a single one.

Making enough money to live off for a solo dev on Steam is a bit of a pipe dream. The guys are being realistic. You gotta focus on other metrics for success and build on that to progress going forward. Most people would have to work at least part time while doing it as well.

From a business sense you would want to reinvest all + more money into new projects going forward. That’s if you want your games to progressively get better.

 

[zwanzig_zwoelf]

I've heard this is a valid strategy for... some on Steam. As in, you make your game have the lowest price possible on the platform (something like 0.25$, I think?) so you're constantly in the "cheapest shit available" list on there and you get some traffic and sales constantly

This might work if you release dozens of games per year, but I doubt it's going to be quality games. Anyone with a semblance of conscience would probably break down after a while.

I think it's a better strategy to focus on making a good game, but also preparing to make quick (and refined) sequels / spin-offs / expansions to keep hungry players satisfied and build your catalog until you're 100% sure you can afford to move on to the next big thing and make it even better.

 

[Joonas]

Released a free PDF-"book" that documents various development related things of the roguelike game Zorbus. It's just 30 pages with lots of images, but might interest you if you're into procedural map generation.

Available here:
http://building.zorbus.net

The game just got updated:
http://www.zorbus.net

 

[infidel]

Yeah but how much does that make over time? Assuming you can somehow make life work (food, bills, taxes, etc) at ~$500/month, you'd still need at least a hundred sales *per day* at that pricepoint.

Yes, those people are not living off it, for sure. In fact, living off Steam sales is indeed not something I would pursue (it will not be a very good living for a long time). I think it's way better to treat "I have a game on Steam" as a hobby that gives you some beer money in addition to your normal income. But you do forget that $500/month is very livable in some parts of the world and those parts aren't even all that bad.

This might work if you release dozens of games per year, but I doubt it's going to be quality games. Anyone with a semblance of conscience would probably break down after a while.

You don't need to be consciously aware that you're making garbage and feel some regret about it if you just have bad taste. The amount of garbage on Steam is a good indicator. Plus there's the memeness factor to consider. There's always the chance that the younger audience will suddenly LOVE this shit and it'll sell like hot cakes :D

 

[infidel]

There's no code in this book, the game is closed source, and there's no easy way for players to edit or modify it

I'm curious, why go with closed source, especially if the game is free? Roguelikes have a long tradition of open-source, too.

 

[Joonas]

I'm curious, why go with closed source, especially if the game is free? Roguelikes have a long tradition of open-source, too.

Some reasons:

1. I'm ashamed of my programming practices. I've never really leveled up from the "advanced beginner" stage.
2. At this point I don't want variants or forks of the game. Open-sourcing software is good so that projects don't die, but I've never been that fond of the roguelike variants scene. I also like how single developers or small teams more often have really focused vision versus what community projects might have.
3. Occasionally I still think of putting the game on Steam, but that would need a cleanup of all things D&D, a custom tileset, etc.

 

[infidel]

Some reasons:

Okay, reason two I get. You don't want variants, fair enough. Reason one always cracks me up when I hear it, though. You believe someone's gonna make fun of your code or something? "Hur-hur-hur, his multithreading code is shit and UI is totes garbage" Reason three... I don't believe I've ever seen anyone other than the original author (or someone with permission) putting up an open-source game on Steam. Though it's legally possible I guess?

 

[Twiglard]

I don't believe I've ever seen anyone other than the original author (or someone with permission) putting up an open-source game on Steam. Though it's legally possible I guess?

I've had my BSD-licensed utility software rebranded with minor changes and put on Steam. Made me implement some of the minor features that the guy who did this, implemented into his fork.

 

[Joonas]

I don't believe I've ever seen anyone other than the original author (or someone with permission) putting up an open-source game on Steam. Though it's legally possible I guess?

NetHack: Legacy is on Steam:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/837200/NetHack_Legacy/

Related discussion (3 years ago):
https://www.reddit.com/r/nethack/comments/968xgf/nethack_on_steam/

 

[infidel]

Okay, that's interesting. Though I wonder why they don't bother commenting on Vulture in that same thread.

 

[Bad Sector]

Yes, those people are not living off it, for sure. In fact, living off Steam sales is indeed not something I would pursue (it will not be a very good living for a long time). I think it's way better to treat "I have a game on Steam" as a hobby that gives you some beer money in addition to your normal income.

If it is a hobby might as well do it for free. And TBH there is something wrong, IMO, when a single dev cant even expect to make a low yet livable income from Steam in an industry worth many billions of dollars and on a platform with more than a hundred million accounts.

But you do forget that $500/month is very livable in some parts of the world and those parts aren't even all that bad.

Yes, which is why i mentioned $500/month as this is more or less (actually lately is "less" :-P) my own monthly expenses, though that is because i am single, i do not have to pay rent and rarely go out.

 

[d1nolore]

Yes, those people are not living off it, for sure. In fact, living off Steam sales is indeed not something I would pursue (it will not be a very good living for a long time). I think it's way better to treat "I have a game on Steam" as a hobby that gives you some beer money in addition to your normal income.

If it is a hobby might as well do it for free. And TBH there is something wrong, IMO, when a single dev cant even expect to make a low yet livable income from Steam in an industry worth many billions of dollars and on a platform with more than a hundred million accounts.

How do you do it, what’s your formula?

I wonder how many solo devs are making a living off Steam. It would be interesting to break down the sales/profits of a solo dev. There’s 1000’s of RPG maker games on Steam, I wonder if people make a profit off those.

 

[Bad Sector]

How do you do it, what’s your formula?

I don't do it :-P. I wouldn't bother if i wasn't going to make a game that wouldn't let me live from selling it, which is why the games i make and release that are purely for fun are free and on itch.io (which doesn't require any upfront fee - if it did i'd just give them from my own site).

I wonder how many solo devs are making a living off Steam. It would be interesting to break down the sales/profits of a solo dev. There’s 1000’s of RPG maker games on Steam, I wonder if people make a profit off those.

There are developers who make money living off Steam though obviously not all do, but for me starting with the assumption that i wont make living money is the wrong approach to have for a commercial endeavor.

 

[rusty_shackleford]

If it is a hobby might as well do it for free. And TBH there is something wrong, IMO, when a single dev cant even expect to make a low yet livable income from Steam in an industry worth many billions of dollars and on a platform with more than a hundred million accounts.

There's nothing wrong, the market is flooded with shitty indie games.

 

[Zanzoken]

https://howtomarketagame.com/2020/10/19/steamgenres/

Charts

I don't know if this is a reputable source or if the data presented is reliable, but the tl;dr is that the market is flooded, but only in certain genres. If you're trying to make the next hit platformer or whatever, then you have to be extremely good or extremely lucky to not drown in the sea of competition. But in more monocled spaces like RPGs and strategy, getting noticed is much less of a problem.

This lines up well with my experience as a consumer. I doubt there is anywhere on the internet that tracks the RPG market more closely than the Codex... if there's a good RPG out there, no matter how small, someone here will find it. And yet more often than not, I find myself without anything interesting to play.

There's a lot of fertile ground still out there, just waiting for someone to come along and farm it.