Game News Deus Ex: Mankind Divided 101 Trailer

[Crescent Hawk]

This whole angle of racism against augs is complete crap, looks like fucking X men. HR also had a shitty story even if the mood was okay.

Is it that difficult to create a cyberpunk story? Just put a crazy enigmatic ai that talks in poems, existential angst, shady corporate conspiracies, fucking aliens, you know, LIKE FUCKING DEUS EX 1.

I hate Canada.

 

[Athos]

a crazy enigmatic ai, existential angst, shady corporate conspiracies.

Human Revolution already did this.

 

[Crescent Hawk]

a crazy enigmatic ai, existential angst, shady corporate conspiracies.

Human Revolution already did this.

Eliza was as crazy as a, well, a normal woman is. Game was fun, but flawed, IW had me much more paranoid.

 

[Infinitron]

If anything, I would say Human Revolution is closer to the classic cyberpunk template of punks, hackers and all-powerful megacorporations. Although the Deus Ex series as a whole isn't really about that stuff at all.

 

[Mozg]

I hope they play up people calling Jensen a paranoid loon for that "ONLY I KNOW THE TRUTH" vibe. It's one of the ways to pay off sticking with the same character instead of just making a new protagfellow, which would have left them with the old "this conspiracy stuff... you minor NPCs are so silly" thing you did in the first HR game/in the original.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

If anything, I would say Human Revolution is closer to the classic cyberpunk template of punks, hackers and all-powerful megacorporations. Although the Deus Ex series as a whole isn't really about that stuff at all.

It could have been though, cut out all the political and philosophical/existential stuff and you could end up with a first person Syndicate game (I don't mean the crappy game we actually got as a modern reboot), a dystopian future where cyborgs are merely the tools corporations use to one-up each other. In general, I feel games too often lock the player into the role of a Messiah/Chosen One that stumbles around like a blind idiot (foiling antagonist's intricate plans on the way via a series of lucky coincidences) that eventually gets to decide the fate of the mankind (the only reason HR didn't do this completely is precisely because it was a prequel set in a world whose future has been already shaped by previous games in the series). Sometimes, I'd prefer more focus on faction play and the role of an enhanced operative breaking into high-tech facilities and less on having a needlessly epic overarching plot.

 

[Crescent Hawk]

I would say you could have a epic overarching plot by precisely by focusing on faction play and the role of an enhanced operative breaking into high-tech facilities, you never know what AI you can find in the depth of Corp Inc . You could choose to learn more it.

 

[HoboForEternity]

looks pretty good, probably won't be as good as the first, but HR was great on its own accord. i'm pretty optimistic, and my only worry is how overpowered the augs are and there are several bullshit powers there. homing stunning electrical missile? check. steel skin magic spell? check. next they are gonna put a tactical nuclear warhead inside him

 

[Carrion]

next they are gonna put a tactical nuclear warhead inside him

A non-lethal tactical nuclear warhead.

On the other hand, the new Deus Ex games actually don't have the extremes of high tech you see in the original game's corporate labs. There are no power armored soldiers with built in rocket launchers, no genetically engineered beasts, no Universal Constructors capable of manufacturing anything at the atomic level, no omniscient AIs that control the entire Internet, and no nano-lightsabers. We'll see what this game does, though.

On the other hand you do have stuff like a guy with a machinegun literally built into his hand, an AI that pretty controls the entire world's media, and detractable three-feet long arm blades.

But that wouldn't make sense what with Deus Ex portraying mechs as outdated and in decline.

The problem with Human Revolution, if you really like to think of it as a prequel rather than a reboot or a separate series, is that it doesn't really portray mechanical augmentations as inferior technology compared to nano-augmentations, quite the opposite. In many ways Jensen is superior to JC Denton, with augs that don't require a separate power source to function and in general are as good if not better than Denton's supposedly super-advanced augmentations. They're apparently pushing it even further in the sequel. Jensen also looks like a normal guy and can move as switfly as a cat, which clashes with the way mechanical augmentations were portrayed in Deus Ex. It's easy to look at Gunther and understand that he's feeling like an outdated piece of junk, but it's very difficult to imagine Jensen ever having to face a similar problem.

It'd have been much cooler if HR's augmentations were actually really ugly, clumsy and maybe even a bit unreliable, perhaps even requiring regular maintenance to remain functional (neuropozyne doesn't count), so that all the hate for them seemed actually warranted.

 

[Infinitron]

On the other hand you do have stuff like a guy with a machinegun literally built into his hand and detractable three-feet long arm blades.

Stuff like that seems like it could exist in Deus Ex, although you don't actually ever get to see a "skul-gun" or similar augmentation in action (due to technical limitations?).

 

[Athos]

On the other hand you do have stuff like a guy with a machinegun literally built into his hand, an AI that pretty controls the entire world's media, and detractable three-feet long arm blades.

Nothing can beat the drone factory in your skull But the new shield looks like a worthy contender, let's see how it will be explained in the game. By the way is it ever explained from where the drone comes out?

 

[Carrion]

Nothing can beat the drone factory in your skull

Yeah, Jensen could only afford a pair of sunglasses.

 

[Rhuantavan]

"they hid more implants in me than I thought"

I also winced at that, but the game still looks very promising.

 

[vivec]

Deus Ex was about giving the player the choice of how to play the game. To decide what they do and then later see the consequences. This was not just in the storytelling, but also behind the overall design. Was it perfect? of course not. was it great? You better believe it! IW made the game too console-y. That was its sin. Also, it was lacking the depth of the original, which came via the world depicted through the emails, the books, and the conversations. DE:HR is a step in the right direction *from* IW. However, it was never even close to the greatness of DX. The new iteration seems to be more of the same to me.

 

[ZagorTeNej]

The problem with Human Revolution, if you really like to think of it as a prequel rather than a reboot or a separate series, is that it doesn't really portray mechanical augmentations asinferior technology compared to nano-augmentations, quite the opposite. In many ways Jensen is superior to JC Denton, with augs that don't require a separate power source to function and in general are as good if not better than Denton's supposedly super-advanced augmentations. They're apparently pushing it even further in the sequel.

It does seem like it will be the case in the sequel but based on HR alone while many of the stuff Jensen can do are visually impressive (modern graphics at work) don't see in what way is he superior to JC. Use of Typhoon to clear out a room maybe (I didn't use it much cause I've found it to be too derpy)? I mean we're talking about the guy who has to eat a candy bar if he wants to punch two guys in a row vs someone who can regenerate limbs even when under heavy gunfire in a matter of seconds.

Jensen's biggest power in the game is the mighty sticky cover, take that away and the guy's quite vulnerable when outnumbered. On the other hand, a specced out for combat JC can easily take head on (without the use of a cloak or any sort of cover) a squad of troopers backed up by heavy mechs without much trouble, even on Realistic difficulty.

Jensen also looks like a normal guy and can move as switfly as a cat, which clashes with the way mechanical augmentations were portrayed in Deus Ex. It's easy to look at Gunther and understand that he's feeling like an outdated piece of junk, but it's very difficult to imagine Jensen ever having to face a similar problem.

Mechanical augmentations are way too slick in HR, no question about it. That said, Gunther is more of a heavily augmented machine specialized for combat in the vein of Tyrants (HR's bosses that barely have human anatomy anymore) not a multi-purpose agent with more subtle enhancements like Jensen or JC. It is my impression that Tyrants are meant to be able to outmatch Jensen in a straight fight and he's supposed to beat them relying on guile instead of raw power.

It'd have been much cooler if HR's augmentations were actually really ugly, clumsy and maybe even a bit unreliable, perhaps even requiring regular maintenance to remain functional (neuropozyne doesn't count), so that all the hate for them seemed actually warranted.

Yeah, true.

 

[Wise Emperor]

Deus Ex albeit great, was just a glorified mish mash of cool topics popular in 90's, especially inspired by X-files. Therefore praising story in Deus Ex is a bit of a stretch, in other words nostalgia.

But...

I'm hungry for a bit cyberpunk, so I will take whatever guys from Eidos/Square will serve.

 

[Carrion]

It does seem like it will be the case in the sequel but based on HR alone while many of the stuff Jensen can do are visually impressive (modern graphics at work) don't see in what way is he superior to JC. Use of Typhoon to clear out a room maybe (I didn't use it much cause I've found it to be too derpy)? I mean we're talking about the guy who has to eat a candy bar if he wants to punch two guys in a row vs someone who can regenerate limbs even when under heavy gunfire in a matter of seconds.

Jensen's biggest power in the game is the mighty sticky cover, take that away and the guy's quite vulnerable when outnumbered. On the other hand, a specced out for combat JC can easily take head on (without the use of a cloak or any sort of cover) a squad of troopers backed up by heavy mechs without much trouble, even on Realistic difficulty.

You could probably make an argument either way. JC can get a very powerful health regeneration aug, but it takes the place of another aug and uses up energy (which is plentiful but finite), whereas Jensen has a weaker regeneration that is always active for free. JC is completely dependent on energy cells, whereas Jensen can function perfectly well even without the candy bars and also has a whole bunch of passive abilities that require no additional energy whatsoever. JC needs a medbot to help him install his augs, whereas Jensen can just use a praxis kit when he feels like it (yeah, I know it's because the augs have already been installed into him, but it's still somehow too convenient). Some of the overlapping augs of the two games are easier to get in Human Revolution, like the ability to see through walls. JC can get the Speed Enhancement aug, which allows him to jump down from a rooftop without taking much damage, but Jensen has the landing system that allows him to fall from pretty much any height without taking a scratch. For most of the time JC has to rely on his own eyes and ears, but Jensen has the magic radar with him at all times, and it can be upgraded even further to give you the sticky cover experience without sticky cover. In general there are few things that JC can do but Jensen can't, aside from the ability to eat a few more bullets when augmented to the max. And of course swimming, which is the most important ablility of them all.

I'm not really that much into sperging over this kind of stuff, because quite obviously they went gameplay first in both games and wanted to make the augs as much fun as possible, and I don't blame them for that. The games are mechanically quite different, so there's not that much point to a direct comparison between the effectiveness of different abilities — I never used the cover system myself, but it is almost certainly the number one reason for Jensen being as fragile as he is; on the other hand Jensen having permanent health-regen is just the modern FPS standard, and the aug is there just to give it an easy in-game explanation. For me the whole thing is more of a question of aesthetics, and JC is kind of like a nuclear plant whereas Jensen runs on solar power instead. JC uses medical bots to install some heavy-ass shit into him whereas Jensen unlocks new stuff on the go like he was just donwloading new apps into his smartphone. It's that convenience that makes HR's technology seem more advanced in parts.

 

[Manmower]

I hate Canada.

As a Canadian, I agree with you.

If anything, I would say Human Revolution is closer to the classic cyberpunk template of punks, hackers and all-powerful megacorporations.

TBH, the megacorps of HR didn't feel all that powerful. IMHO, the game was more about people being assholes for the purpose of acquiring power - the corps were castrated and portrayed as weak. Sarif could've sent legions of soldiers, acquired an army of mercenaries, and paid for an entire arm of lawyers and investigators, but instead they send just one guy? I know it's for the purpose of plot, and a lot of it has to be handwaived, but the original DE had a much better atmosphere as far as the classical omnipresent megacrops cyberpunk template is concerned.

 

[Athos]

I hate Canada.

As a Canadian, I agree with you.

If anything, I would say Human Revolution is closer to the classic cyberpunk template of punks, hackers and all-powerful megacorporations.

TBH, the megacorps of HR didn't feel all that powerful. IMHO, the game was more about people being assholes for the purpose of acquiring power - the corps were castrated and portrayed as weak. Sarif could've sent legions of soldiers, acquired an army of mercenaries, and paid for an entire arm of lawyers and investigators, but instead they send just one guy? I know it's for the purpose of plot, and a lot of it has to be handwaived, but the original DE had a much better atmosphere as far as the classical omnipresent megacrops cyberpunk template is concerned.

Sarif is a newfag, his company is small compared to Tai Yong or Versalife. The Belltower company is the private army for the Illuminati, abducting people and managing off the grid military bases.

 

[Manmower]

Sarif is a newfag, his company is small compared to Tai Yong or Versalife

True, but it's mentioned multiple times in the game just how much money they're making. Even the smallest megacorp is a massive beast, even by national standards. You gotta handwave a bunch of logic and common sense in order to put together a fun plot (at least this is what most devs think), but I'm just saying that the original DE had a much grimier and more oppressive atmosphere where you FELT like the damn companies really DID control everything. YMMV, but I didn't get that vibe from HR.

 

[Infinitron]

I said "closer", not close. As I said, I don't think any of the Deus Ex games are prototypical cyberpunk works. The creator of Cyberpunk 2020 agrees with me.

Deus Ex doesn't have "companies that control everything", it has secret societies that manipulate the UN and the US government. The power of VersaLife, the game's largest corporation, doesn't extend outside its walls, where the streets are patrolled by the troops of a still-powerful and independent Chinese government. That is not typical cyberpunk.

 

[Athos]

Sarif is a newfag, his company is small compared to Tai Yong or Versalife

True, but it's mentioned multiple times in the game just how much money they're making. Even the smallest megacorp is a massive beast, even by national standards. You gotta handwave a bunch of logic and common sense in order to put together a fun plot (at least this is what most devs think), but I'm just saying that the original DE had a much grimier and more oppressive atmosphere where you FELT like the damn companies really DID control everything. YMMV, but I didn't get that vibe from HR.

The original game was set after the shit of the world had hit the fan and the Majestic12 could basically operate in the open. Human Revolution is set in the past, in my opinion it was right that the main actors still tried to mantain a low profile.

 

[Mozg]

Deus Ex is kinda right-wing cyberpunk

 

[Manmower]

it has secret societies that manipulate the UN and the US government

By working through proxy corporations. They're pretty much synonymous. But I agree, DE isn't 'hard' cyberpunk.

right-wing

How so?

 

[Mozg]

Chesterton quotes as a motif, sympathetic portrayal of a secessionist militia, media narrative control by dark elites (as opposed to "capitalist media" that is evil because it's chasing a buck), '90s conspiracy theories, UN-is-evil. Instead of a punk fringe protagonist JC is a brainwashed superman-in-the-blood that wakes up to the truth. Money and transnational corporations are merely tools of the true elite.

Edit - and also, as far as the corny "racism against augs" thing - HR had the "purity vs. augs" debate that in their advertising seemed like it was intended to be a philosophical hook for the game, but when you actually played it was just a fake issue orchestrated by the sexy media controlling AI character for the benefit of shadowy conspiratorial elites that wanted to keep all real power to themselves.