Drop-in D20 mechanics

[Elzair]

I am currently taking a class on Databases, and to further my knowledge, I thought I might engage in a little project. I have noticed that, for indie/homebrew developers, there are many pre-existing renderers, physics engines, sound libraries, networking libraries, toolsets, etc. out there, but there does not appear to be many pre-existing RPG rulesets out there (especially none that can easily be dropped in to a new project). Therefore, I think it would be cool to package D20 in an sqlite database and set of easy-to-use scripts.

I just have a couple of questions for any D20 playing Codexers out there with DBA experience:

1.) Should I use the Pathfinder SRD, or the D&D 3.5 SRD?

2.) What kind of architecture should the DB have (types of tables, rows and columns, etc.)?

3.) What outside scripting language should I use (I assume I will need something besides raw SQL queries if it is to be a drop-in library)?

4.) Is there another similar project out there whose work I can steal whose ideas I can examine?

 

[Elzair]

Any suggestions?

 

[muffildy]

sued

either of those sounds good, but i think its kind of pointless since any game creator would first need to get rights to use the ruleset or theyd end up being sued.

 

[Excidium]

Use the 3.5 SRD since with the OGL it's free to use in game projects, unlike Pathfinder.

 

[Grunker]

^ for feasability (i.e. for the project to actually be useful), listen to excidium.

If you just want the best system, use Pathfinder

 

[Elzair]

Thanks for mentioning that, Excidium. 3.5 it is!

 

[JrK]

Use the 3.5 SRD since with the OGL it's free to use in game projects, unlike Pathfinder.

How is PF not under OGL?

 

[Grunker]

Wow, you're right. At least according to http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-use

Did not know that. Use Pathfinder then, Elzair!

 

[Elzair]

Jrk, I also thought the Pathfinder SRD was available under the OGL, but I wasn't sure. Does anyone know for sure?

 

[Excidium]

Wow, you're right. At least according to http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-use

Did not know that. Use Pathfinder then, Elzair!

I didn't know either, thought the OGL only covered default 3.5 rules without the copyrighted material, and any change or addition of new stuff by a company was its property.

Good to know.

 

[Elzair]

Alright, Pathfinder it is!

 

[Excidium]

Edit:
Using Pathfinder rules in CRPG

The Pathfinder RPG rules are available as open content under the OGL, and there's nothing in the OGL that prohibits using it for computer games. (Wizards' d20 System License could not be used for interactive electronic games, but that's largely irrelevant here.)

The OGL *does* prohibit indicating compatibility using trademarks owned by others without a license, so while you can use the rules for your game, you can't call it "Pathfinder" without a license from us. (The Pathfinder RPG Compatibility License, which is what allows print and PDF publishers to specify compatibility with the Pathfinder RPG, deliberately does not apply to computer games.)

Our setting material is not open to commercial use, and that's actually the part that's going to have the most appeal to a computer game publisher.

We do hope to work with an established computer game industry leader on a Pathfinder computer game someday—which is part of why we're not giving those rights out for free—but we're in no particular hurry.

 

[skuphundaku]

Use the 3.5 SRD since with the OGL it's free to use in game projects, unlike Pathfinder.

How is PF not under OGL?

PF is under OGL:

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/faq:

I am a publisher. Can I produce products that support the Pathfinder Roleplaying Game?

The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game is published under the OGL, and game rules that do not involve Paizo's intellectual property (such as our deities) are generally open and available for use by other publishers according to the terms of the Open Game License.

In addition, we've also created a Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Compatibility License that allows other publishers to indicate compatibility with the Pathfinder RPG on their product.

It seems that you are to free to use the ruleset as long as you remove anything that references the PF IP. I have no idea how difictult that would be. A question for people more experienced than me with PF and D&D 3.5 is if it would be worth doing it or if doing it would just reset the PF ruleset to D&D 3.5.

 

[Grunker]

The "world" or fiction of Pathfinder is useless, only the ruleset is interesting. So go for it.

 

[Elzair]

Which scripting language do you guys think I should write the non-SQL parts in? I was thinking either Python, Lua, Scheme or Javascript.

I know Python the best, but I don't like it that much. I don't know very much about Lua, but it seems to be easy to learn and still seems to be the go-to language for scripting purposes. I would like to learn Scheme (or another Lisp) and think it is cool. Using Javascript would make it easier for developers to turn their games into Web 2.0 apps.

 

[villain of the story]

I remember a D&D 3.5 implementation made with Unity for iPhone (uses Javascript) and a full blown app to replace the pen and the paper for playing PnP on iPad. Search Unity forums. If they are there, you should be able to find them quick.

 

[Quilty]

Wow, now this is a good idea. Keep us updated!

 

[deuxhero]

The PF splat on the SRD is OGL right?

If it is, go PF, as core 3.5 doesn't have a lot of options.

 

[Flatlander]

Which scripting language do you guys think I should write the non-SQL parts in? I was thinking either Python, Lua, Scheme or Javascript.

I have been thinking about doing something similar with my vaporware. That is, the core game mechanics and rules would be implemented as black box module that has interfaces for the scripting, UI and editor modules. I thought about making the core as portable (for the three main desktop platforms almost anything goes, but the handhelds are a bit harded) as possible and the best options to me seemed to be Lua, Javascript or C++. Both Lua and JS are widely ported and known, same with C++ but in addition it would be easy to build the engine as a shared library that could be used from $my_favourite_language. The higher level languages (like Scheme or Ocaml) runtimes are less portable and not all can easily build libraries usable from other languages.

But in the end I scrapped the idea of portable core and went with Scheme all the way. I can always embed Lua for scripting if needed, or implement my own scripting language.

 

[Elzair]

I just had a quick question about licenses. While browsing the Feats DB, I learned that most feats seem to be licensed under the CUP, whatever that is. I looked and noticed the Combat Casting feat, licensed under the CUP, seemed to be the same as the Combat Casting feat in d20, licensed under the OGL. Is the CUP open too?

 

[deuxhero]

http://paizo.com/paizo/about/communityuse


Nope then.

Go go 3.5!

 

[Excidium]

This is p. confusing.

 

[Elzair]

3.5 it is!

 

[Grunker]

This is p. confusing.

It's like you need to be lawyer to understand copyright or something

 

[Kosmonaut]

In before monolithic tables with hundreds of columns.