KingComrade said:
No, that's not what I'm tired of. I'm tired of people jacking off about their amazing and impressive knowledge of pedanticism.
Oh, foolish me. But:
Some random dictionary said:
2 a : one who makes a show of knowledge b : one who is unimaginative or who unduly emphasizes minutiae in the presentation or use of knowledge c : a formalist or precisionist in teaching
A: I am not making a show of knowledge, since it was pertaining to what i was answering and i just exposed a general definition, not my knowledge on the topic. If you think a definition is knowledge, your opinion is worthless anyway B: I would have been emphatizing minutiae in the presentation or use of knowledge had i began quoting some obscure passages of some obscures FMs or similar, not a pretty simple definition of a word. Definitions are always implied in words, i just pointed at it and said "Hey, you used it in an ambiguous way" C: Since i am not teaching anything anyone, it does not follow.
See the difference? Now i am being pedantic, and even then not really. Before, he said tactics, i pointed why he was using the word in a wrong way to reach the conclussion he wanted to reach. Go flame someone else.
Dpayne said:
I actually think a lot of the spirit of Fallout combat would be lost in an FPS situation.
Fallout combat had not spirit, to begin with. Even if most people around here acts like it was the second comming, it was just a quite simple click-click-click thing without tactical depth outside called shots and quaffing a pot... a drug if things got ugly. Make a system for called shots to work in real time, make it real time, and you have something not very different from diablo, whit some companions running around like headless chickens without any kind of situational awareness. I would say Diablo II, but then all those spell like skills gave that one more tactical depth than the fallout combat systems ever had.
Yeah, burn me in the stake, but before think about what i am saying. Tell me one instance of deep, thoughtful, complex tactical combat in Fallout that relies not on abusing the braindead AI and the fact it had the same situational awareness your companions did.
I can remember quite a few instances of walking around the wasteland and getting some jet guys to "Random Encounter" me. The battle begins: They all zerg rush me in a big, pretty packed up bunch, through open ground (was there other kind?). That brings me memories of Diablo II in Hell Mode, just that it was easier in this case, since i just had to spam eye-shots until boredom.
Such a deep system, such spirit!
Give me a break. If someone here loves Fallout because of his combat system, he is an hypocrite.
[note] The funny thing? I never used weapons other than PISTOLS in my "serious" playthroughs. So much for deep, intellectual, challenging combat systems.
Dpayne said:
Numerous perks, abilities and combat skills would essenially be meaningless if I was even remotely competent.
Just like in the original, but this time depending on your skill and not in weak design? Wow.
I am not defending Beth, as i don't believe they can do it, but in either ITB or FPS a good character system can be used that would make the point rather pointless. System Shock II worked pretty well with his hybrid system, and even when it was not a full fledged RPG it made a precedent. Your own skills may have defined how things worked out in SOME cases, but then the character system said what you could do and what you could not even try. It is not perfect? Develop it and make it so. Do not make a prison out of some concept just because it is already done, and not as flawlessly as everyone suggests to begin with.
Disclaimer: I am not saying TB is dead or anything like that. But since this is a theorical discussion, as in "whatever we say is not going to change anything," i am saying you should be not making a flag out of something without being sincere about it to begin with, and consious that the fact you can't imagine something else working well does not mean is not possible.
In conclusion: Stop stereotyping FPSs and begin thinking how can you make a full fledged character system work well in one of those. Bethesda is going to do his own thing wichever conclusion we reach here.
Now, if you just want to bitch about it, be my guest. This is the Codex, bitching is our religion.