Interview Gamebanshee: Feargus Urquhart Interview

[VentilatorOfDoom]

Tags: Dungeon Siege III; Feargus Urquhart; Obsidian Entertainment

<p>After his interview with <a href="http://www.rpgcodex.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=46191">Chris Avellone</a> Gamebanshee chief BuckGB now put up another one of his E3 interviews, this time <a href="http://www.gamebanshee.com/interviews/98583-e3-2010-feargus-urquhart.html" target="_blank">Feargus "Slam Dunk" Urquhart</a> is the subject.</p>
<blockquote>
<p><strong><span class="question">GB: So moving on to Alpha Protocol, what are your feelings on its reception? We really liked it at GameBanshee, thanks to its strong story, excellent dialogue system, reputation system, item upgrades and modifications, and the types of elements that we love about RPGs. Do you think that maybe the action-loving crowd sort of missed the point of the game, simply because they went into it thinking it was going to be "just another third-person shooter"?</span></strong> <br /><br /><span class="answer">Feargus: Yeah, Alpha Protocol delivered on the character story, and all the RPG stuff. And, everyone I&rsquo;ve talked to and all the reviews that I&rsquo;ve read, unless someone was being completely dismissive for whatever reason they felt that way. If they were being dismissive, then we've got the sense that it was just fun to write their review that way and make fun of the game. But, I&rsquo;m not going to name names, but... [laughter] ultimately, I think we hit it on the RPG stuff. The action elements were always a concern to a point, because it&rsquo;s something we had not done as a studio before. And, It was really action-focused in most areas. I think in some ways we maybe got into a "no man&rsquo;s land". It was trying to be too much an action game &ndash; or it was trying to be so much of an action game that we didn't hit all the features an action gamers' wants to see at the level they want to see them. <br /><br />I&rsquo;ll use cover as an example. Let&rsquo;s say we didn&rsquo;t have cover. There probably would have been some reviews that remarked about us not having cover, but then we wouldn&rsquo;t have had a cover system that frustrated some people. You see what I mean? Maybe action gamers would have liked it less because there&rsquo;s no cover system, but then we wouldn&rsquo;t necessarily have been showing a flaw in the game if the cover system wasn&rsquo;t there. <br /><br />In some ways we&rsquo;re pretty aware of what our game is good at, what it&rsquo;s bad at, and things like that. I think what we also feel is that there&rsquo;s more we could have done, but it just wasn&rsquo;t in the cards.</span></p>
</blockquote>
<p>Well, I think if you're pretty aware of what's good or bad with AP... then it's all good.</p>
<p>&nbsp;</p>
<p>Spotted at: <a href="http://www.gamebanshee.com/news/98584-gb-feature-e3-2010-feargus-urquhart-interview.html">GB</a></p>

 

[Dyspaire]

Wow those are actually some really accurate and honest comments about AP... I didn't like the game, because I like to think about my options at my leisure while gaming, and the game's dialogue system was literally the opposite of what I personally enjoy. That said, the greater flaws were almost exactly what Mr. Urquhart listed, imo. How very un-Molyneux of him...

I was right there with the interviewer as he all but begs for Obsidian to make a lower-budget, 2D-Infinity Engine-style game. I will never understand why a company like Obsidian, who seem tailor-made for such projects, don't go after that forgotten market.

The budget on every 2D crpg from Fallout to Arcanum can be measure in only a few millions at most, compared to the tens of millions AAA games can cost nowadays. With that financial picture in mind, you only have to sell 100,000+ copies for it to be worth it. Not multiple millions like the AAA's.

I think every person reading and posting here would buy a AA-quality 2D crpg, as long as it had some sound mechanics to it. I know I would.

Such a huge untapped demographic between games like Eschalon and Avernum, and games like Dragon Age and Fallout 3... I think.

2c

 

[Azrael the cat]

Wow those are actually some really accurate and honest comments about AP... I didn't like the game, because I like to think about my options at my leisure while gaming, and the game's dialogue system was literally the opposite of what I personally enjoy. That said, the greater flaws were almost exactly what Mr. Urquhart listed, imo. How very un-Molyneux of him...

I was right there with the interviewer as he all but begs for Obsidian to make a lower-budget, 2D-Infinity Engine-style game. I will never understand why a company like Obsidian, who seem tailor-made for such projects, don't go after that forgotten market.

The budget on every 2D crpg from Fallout to Arcanum can be measure in only a few millions at most, compared to the tens of millions AAA games can cost nowadays. With that financial picture in mind, you only have to sell 100,000+ copies for it to be worth it. Not multiple millions like the AAA's.

I think every person reading and posting here would buy a AA-quality 2D crpg, as long as it had some sound mechanics to it. I know I would.

Such a huge untapped demographic between games like Eschalon and Avernum, and games like Dragon Age and Fallout 3... I think.

2c

I agree, but the trouble is that even at the lower 2D cost, they still need a publisher if they're going to get the broad sales that will support a professional studio. And publishers in gaming - unlike films, books, TV and music - haven't cottoned on to the idea of appealing to untapped segments rather than competing for the same mainstream each title.

 

[Volourn]

"I will never understand why a company like Obsidian, who seem tailor-made for such projects, don't go after that forgotten market. "

The answer is obvious. Obsidian wants to be at BIO's level. It's why they now have over 100 employees, and always strive for blockbuster titles and well known franchises (AP being the only exception thus far).

 

[Mangoose]

What he said about the cover system is a sad point. People will get pissed off at a game for not having a one-button cover (even when it's not necessary!) and I've seen it happen in one review already.

 

[Silellak]

What he said about the cover system is a sad point. People will get pissed off at a game for not having a one-button cover (even when it's not necessary!) and I've seen it happen in one review already.

The alternative, of course, would be for Obsidian to make a cover system that didn't fucking suck.

 

[Dyspaire]

I agree, but the trouble is that even at the lower 2D cost, they still need a publisher if they're going to get the broad sales that will support a professional studio. And publishers in gaming - unlike films, books, TV and music - haven't cottoned on to the idea of appealing to untapped segments rather than competing for the same mainstream each title.

The answer is obvious. Obsidian wants to be at BIO's level. It's why they now have over 100 employees, and always strive for blockbuster titles and well known franchises (AP being the only exception thus far).

Sadly, I have to agree with both of you. Both assessments are related, I think.

I would wager the next great 2D crpg will come from a company like Stardock.

 

[Azrael the cat]

"I will never understand why a company like Obsidian, who seem tailor-made for such projects, don't go after that forgotten market. "

The answer is obvious. Obsidian wants to be at BIO's level. It's why they now have over 100 employees, and always strive for blockbuster titles and well known franchises (AP being the only exception thus far).

Probably right, but I wouldn't cite Bioware as the example they're aiming at in terms of success. I'd say the logical thing is that they want to be at Interplay's old level. The collapse of Interplay and Black Isle would have stung like fuck, especially given that the development side remained profitable (and even the publishing end didn't directly send them bankrupt - their parent company, i.e. Herve's, went under for its own reasons and took them with it). I would have thought 'let's start our own company and get as big as Interplay was' would have been foremost on their minds.

Back then you could do that with great games for the purist crpg market, unfortunately I don't think the same can be done right now.

Maybe steam and other direct download services might change that (in before DRM debate). This interview is about the 5th time in three weeks that I've read a developer/publisher say that PC is looking more promising than a few years ago. There must have been some industry figures that came out showing that the expected mass migration from PC hasn't happened (people who think PC gaming isn't fully replicated on consoles! shock!). It isn't necessarily just a case of customer numbers either - with everyone jettisoning the PC for consoles, there's a lot less competitors per customer in the PC market, making it more lucrative for those who target it.

 

[yaster]

As we stopped working on Alpha Protocol in late summer of last year everybody transferred over either to a private internal product we’re making right now - which I want to talk to you about soon - or they went to Dungeon Siege III.

I wonder what does he mean by private. No publisher involved and self-founding therefore low budget, downloadable, kinda indie-style? Would be interesting.

 

[Azrael the cat]

As we stopped working on Alpha Protocol in late summer of last year everybody transferred over either to a private internal product we’re making right now - which I want to talk to you about soon - or they went to Dungeon Siege III.

I wonder what does he mean by private. No publisher involved and self-founding therefore low budget, downloadable, kinda indie-style? Would be interesting.

I think that's too much to hope for. They've said they'd love to do more indie stuff, and I give them the benefit of the doubt, but it seems to be such a long way outside their business strategy that I can't see it happening.

It would make sense though. It fits Feargus' idea of using a minimal-effort pre-existing engine/setting and just telling a new story in it. I know he gets some flack for the 'slamdunk' thing, but frankly I think that's one of the best ideas I've heard. Crpgs would be a much healthier market if there was more focus on making a good game with the existing tools/setting and less on trying to one-up the graphics of the last game. Think how many games the infinity engine spawned. Or the early wizardry model. Or the Gold Box. Or Geneforge. I think all of the various crpg fanbases would see more of what they liked if that was still viable - it would mean greater emphasis on C+C, story, combat design, maps...as that would be the main basis for differentiating each product from the last.

But as much as they talk it, I just can't see it happening beyond doing a solitary sequel to other companies' games.

 

[Sannom]

The BG to BG2 example was great in that regard. Less areas, less characters, less quests, but a lot more developed, unique and interesting.

I think that's too much to hope for. They've said they'd love to do more indie stuff, and I give them the benefit of the doubt, but it seems to be such a long way outside their business strategy that I can't see it happening.

I think Feargus mentioned, in his first interview to Gamebanshee, that the Onyx Engine was part of a strategy to develop lower budget, more personal projects beside the "normal" ones. Perhaps we will never see it, but hey...

 

[hoochimama]

My money's on a D20 rpg, whether or not it gets the BG3 brand on it depends on Feargus' salesmanship.

 

[Azrael the cat]

My money's on a D20 rpg, whether or not it gets the BG3 brand on it depends on Feargus' salesmanship.

depends on Feargus' salesmanship.

depends on Feargus' salesmanship

depends on Feargus' salesmanship

[has visions of an aliens crpg crashing and burning]
So it's a brandless D20 rpg then?

 

[Azrael the cat]

I agree, but the trouble is that even at the lower 2D cost, they still need a publisher if they're going to get the broad sales that will support a professional studio. And publishers in gaming - unlike films, books, TV and music - haven't cottoned on to the idea of appealing to untapped segments rather than competing for the same mainstream each title.

The answer is obvious. Obsidian wants to be at BIO's level. It's why they now have over 100 employees, and always strive for blockbuster titles and well known franchises (AP being the only exception thus far).

Sadly, I have to agree with both of you. Both assessments are related, I think.

I would wager the next great 2D crpg will come from a company like Stardock.

Well, I'm not so sure about 2D, but Stardock HAVE made the call that (from my recollection, no links unfortunately):
(a) they'd love to do an isometric, party-based older-style crpg (no mention of turn-based, though they certainly don't seem to hate that as a gamestyle);
(b) they don't believe the customer base ever abandoned that kind of game and there'd still be a good market out there for it;
(c) it would be possible to make a good game with a cheap engine and effort put into the gameplay and story;
and (d) it's a sad thing that very few companies have the know-how to make that kind of game anymore.

So I had the impression that they'd do it if they (a) didn't have their plate full and (b) thought they had the expertise to pull it off (probably the biggest barrier).

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

Never fear, Obsidian is here to save the RPG genre. Whew, rest easy, Codexia.

 

[Awor Szurkrarz]

Isn't Broken Hourglass going to be the next BG-style popamole RTwP decline bullshit disappointment outdated RPG without stat-based dialogue and with pretty 2d graphics?

 

[Mister Arkham]

I'm glad to hear that this is the kind of thing that they think about. On some level, the fact that these guys even think about doing lower budget, old fashioned types of games says a lot about how grounded they keep themselves. The fact that they'll have open and frank discussions about what does and does not work on their released products is remarkably refreshing as well. Sure, I'd love for Obsidian as a whole to release more consistently strong products, but the fact that they know when their shit stinks and don't mind admitting it puts them miles and miles ahead of a lot of companies. It's heartening to see a non-indie development house who are still capable of treating the games that they develop as an opportunity to experiment.

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

Yeah, they may develop bad games, but at least they KNOW they develop bad games.

 

[Shannow]

Yeah, they may develop bad games, but at least they KNOW they develop bad games.

Compare them to Piranha Bytes. They accepted the criticism of Gothic 3, learned from it and Risen was again much closer to the glory of Gothic 2. Sadly not better, but much closer than G3.
So it's not impossible to learn from one's mistakes. The problem I see is that what's wrong with Obsidian today is exactly what was wrong with them from the very beginning. They've had years to learn from their mistakes.
But their newer games are just as unpolished and buggy as their first ones. Their development management is just as bad as when they started out. (Not to mention that they're going ever more toward popamole akshun turds...)

 

[Lockkaliber]

Yeah, they may develop bad games, but at least they KNOW they develop bad games.

Calm down and stop breathing through the mouth, Flying Skyway Monster-san.

 

[MasterSmithFandango]

Yeah, they may develop bad games, but at least they KNOW they develop bad games.

Compare them to Piranha Bytes. They accepted the criticism of Gothic 3, learned from it and Risen was again much closer to the glory of Gothic 2. Sadly not better, but much closer than G3.
So it's not impossible to learn from one's mistakes. The problem I see is that what's wrong with Obsidian today is exactly what was wrong with them from the very beginning. They've had years to learn from their mistakes.
But their newer games are just as unpolished and buggy as their first ones. Their development management is just as bad as when they started out. (Not to mention that they're going ever more toward popamole akshun turds...)

Whew, I was about to jump down your throat with the first sentence. Anyway, Piranha Bites knows what it wants to do, and they tend to do it with relative success each time (even G3 had a lot of bright points, although the state of its release was horrible). Obsidian... they don't know what they want to accomplish. They just know they want to sell games. I hope Fallout:New Vegas sells eight copies so we can finally bury this mediocre developer.

 

[Dyspaire]

Well, I'm not so sure about 2D, but Stardock HAVE made the call that (from my recollection, no links unfortunately):
(a) they'd love to do an isometric, party-based older-style crpg (no mention of turn-based, though they certainly don't seem to hate that as a gamestyle);
(b) they don't believe the customer base ever abandoned that kind of game and there'd still be a good market out there for it;
(c) it would be possible to make a good game with a cheap engine and effort put into the gameplay and story;
and (d) it's a sad thing that very few companies have the know-how to make that kind of game anymore.

So I had the impression that they'd do it if they (a) didn't have their plate full and (b) thought they had the expertise to pull it off (probably the biggest barrier).

I perhaps should have said AA instead of 2D.

I would love to see what the current state-of-the-art 2D or 3D isometric engines look like, if such a specialized thing still exists. I have no idea how much art tools have improved over the past 10+ years, but I would think the ease and speed with which a talented artist could create the type of environments and art needed for such a game, has increased drastically.

That's extremely encouraging news you shared. While I can't say I'm thrilled with the choice in art-direction Stardock chose for Elemental: War of Magic, I still look forward to playing it quite a bit. God, if they designed or licensed a sound rpg system and implemented it properly into a AA-level game, sign me up.

Thanks.

 

[Shannow]

Some more screenshots: http://community.demonicon.de/index.php ... hreadID=36

 

[Jaesun]

What game is that from Shannow?

Finally read the entire interview, good stuff.

Sad to hear Atari and Hasbro are still keeping the D&D license in limbo because they still haven't come to an agreement yet.

And a new MYSTARY game hmm.. I'd also bet a D20 game as others have suggested.

And it was interesting to note The Wheel of Time project is just still in talks and funding. I thought they were already doing work for it, but I guess not.

 

[Sannom]

What game is that from Shannow?

And it was interesting to note The Wheel of Time project is just still in talks and funding. I thought they were already doing work for it, but I guess not.

If I had to guess, I would say Drakensang.

We also thought that Obsidian would only do technical/grunt work on it, apparently no, they would do the whole project.