Games with living worlds

[Malamert]

There are a lot of games out there that are marketed as having living worlds that change and evolve on their own, without the player's input. Sounds good, doesn't it? Then you play them and realize that they're static, boring and empty worlds that revolve entirely around you, the player.

Are there any games out there that deliver on the promise of a living world? The only ones I can think of are:
-Space Rangers 2. Rangers, pirates and other pilots all go on about their business, trading, fighting, doing missions and so on. Sectors constantly get taken over, friendships are made and broken, the galaxy advances its technology on its own and so on. There's even an option when starting a new game to allow NPCs to purchase items from the same shops as the player.
-modded S.T.A.L.K.E.R. games. The Zone isn't as complex as the universe in Space Rangers, but it's still pretty good. Stalkers go on raids, loot enemies, upgrade their equipment, hunt for artifacts and pretty much live out their own lives. Mutants prowl about the zone and cause havoc constantly. Skirmishes between different factions break out constantly and there's always something happening.

So what other games deliver on this promise? Been looking for a fantasy game with such a world, but I've had no luck whatsoever in finding anything.

 

[overly excitable young man]

Mount and Blade

 

[Seigneur Locklear]

I guess Bannerlord does it the best at the moment.
Kenshi too to a degree I suppose, if you're into that sort of thing.

 

[Malamert]

Mount and Blade

I guess Bannerlord does it the best at the moment.

Oh, completely forgot about Mount & Blade. Yea, that works.

Kenshi too to a degree I suppose, if you're into that sort of thing.

Played Kenshi during Early Access. It seemed pretty rad at the beginning, but then I realized that nothing was really happening. The place where I set up camp had two factions warring each other, the zealots and some other dudes. It pretty much ended up in an eternal stalemate with nobody ever getting the upper hand. It looked cool though with fields of blood and gore all over the place. Dunno if that's any different now in the full game.

 

[Seigneur Locklear]

Played Kenshi during Early Access. It seemed pretty rad at the beginning, but then I realized that nothing was really happening. The place where I set up camp had two factions warring each other, the zealots and some other dudes. It pretty much ended up in an eternal stalemate with nobody ever getting the upper hand. It looked cool though with fields of blood and gore all over the place. Dunno if that's any different now in the full game.

Eh, I liked the concept of Kenshi on the paper, but I found the realization itself didn't stick with me, so I dropped the game after a couple of hours. But I reckon Kenshi truly shines when adequately modded, or at least many people claim so.

 

[kreight]

I guess any grand strategy or 4x game has this sort of thing. Even Total War games. This is all rather superficial however I would say. The game is created to be played by a player not a computer. The player has to decide how to change the game world.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

kenshi is 100% static. anything changing is a band aid for stuff happening by chance. nothing happens without the player being around.
mount & blade would be much more living if only the campaign ai hadn't been braindead, leaving 15-20 days long sieges only to chase some minor lord, or sometimes leaving just because.

anyway, i'd like to add oblivion: "if you wait too long some npc will finish the main quest instead".

 

[Malamert]

anyway, i'd like to add oblivion: "if you wait too long some npc will finish the main quest instead".

I guess with mods it could end up being quite lively indeed.

 

[Malamert]

One hundred percent serious. Easy to mod and you can alter NPC schedules with ease. So it could be easy to make cities seem livelier with NPCs actually having more things to do around them. Have traveling NPCs with complex routes to follow and have them scripted to visit a city from time to time to rest at an inn and trade items. Allow them to loot items from dead bodies. You get the idea.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

then let me give you a slightly different rating.

 

[Malamert]

Thanks, that's very kind of you.

 

[samuraigaiden]

Soldak Entertainment games can have a lot of nonsense going on if you choose the appropriate settings before beginning the game. Unfortunately, all his games are Diablo-clones so the living world doesn't amount to much in terms of interactivity.

 

[octavius]

Oblivion.
But making complex schedules for thousands of NPCs is CPU demanding and will lead to weird bugs and ever more frequent crashes.

 

[Taka-Haradin puolipeikko]

Wouldn't Pirates! and its later versions have primitive version of this?
At least great powers have random wars and cities do change ownership.

 

[good fucking shit happen]

Wouldn't Pirates! and its later versions have primitive version of this?

It had ports that will thrive, decline and get invaded without you being around. It's a shame it wasn't very deep and you couldn't get any involved missions.

Speaking of boats, Silent Hunter 3 had a simulated war going on in the background, does that count?

 

[DalekFlay]

Oblivion.

I thought of Bethesda's games when I read the OP, but then I thought about how I don't think they really change the world at all, they just kinda do their daily AI circles over and over. I think any change to the world is still mostly player driven, either by completing a quest or choosing a faction or whatever, though there could be some exceptions I'm forgetting.

Did Gothic 3 do human/orc war stuff without you around? I didn't get that far in that game due to glitches, but I recall reading something like that.

 

[Konjad]

Did Gothic 3 do human/orc war stuff without you around? I didn't get that far in that game due to glitches, but I recall reading something like that.

No, it's completely static. All NPCs will stand in the same place throughout the whole game until you encounter them, and nothing will change in any city unless ie. you kill 100% of orks (99% doesn't count), then suddenly the town is liberated and you can't do quests in it anymore, but ork NPCs are replaced with human NPCs and other than that there's 0 other changes.

Some flight and submarine simulators have wars going on in the background, but dunno if it's much, I only played limited time of submarine sims, never flight sims.

ArmA 3 has some mods with war simulation too, but you'd have to mod it. But even without modding it's at least pretty good in authentic responses (i.e. attacking an enemy road point and starting killing them off causes them to call reinforcements from nearby base) - this does work when AI combats AI as well.

M&B series was already mentioned.

X series has some (very limited though) changes.

Strategy games are obvious, same with economy gamed, as obviously AI is supposed to compete with the player and other AI.

 

[Curratum]

The X series from EgoSoft

 

[minakami]

Dwarf Fortress

 

[Atrachasis]

Some flight and submarine simulators have wars going on in the background, but dunno if it's much, I only played limited time of submarine sims, never flight sims.

Off the top of my head, "Their Finest Hour: The Battle of Britain" comes to my mind. In campaign mode, your personal success in your mission would affect the overall progression of the war. Fail to protect a factory against the Luftware, and next turn, the RAF would see their resupplies lowered. Fail to defend a radar site, and next month, those bombers would show up much closer to home as you scramble. A limited vision of what a "living world" might be, though...

 

[deama]

Darklands?

 

[Hag]

Rain World.

 

[Clink]

Wings Over Flanders Fields has the dynamic campaign with heaps of squadrons flying on different missions, pilots fighting and dying etc.

 

[Terenty]

Rain World.

This.

Rain World has the most impressive illusion of an ecosystem. I say illusion because it doesn't evolve actually, but the way the AI interacts with each other, has different priorities etc totally sells the idea of being thrown into a living hostile environment, very impressive stuff.

Other than that Space Rangers still hasn't been beaten

 

[Baron Dupek]

"if you wait too long some npc will finish the main quest instead".

Speaking of STALKER - when GSC was still bumming around with THQ's money they had this concept to be implemented, but we know what happend - a lot of cuts to meet final deadline.

IIRC only one project might restore this feature - NLC (New Level Changer) for Shadow of Chernobyl.

 

[laclongquan]

Patrician 3 and Port Royale 2. The markets consumes trade goods and produce new ones, and different trader vessels can buy different amount of goods, thus the price fluctuate unpredictably. Sometimes the city councils can decide to build up city walls thus expand the area.