Improve Fallout 1/2's combat

[Lance Treiber]

In an alternative timeline, you're the lead game designer on a real, isometric Fallout 3. Your job is to improve Fallout's combat system.

A cover system - would it even benefit F1/2? After all, side-stepping behind a corner already provides a cover.
Controllable companions - is it really necessary? It's a game about loneliness and melancholy, after all.
What else you got?

 

[Butter]

You need less vertical item progression, so there's more incentive to swap equipment based on the encounter.

Random encounters need to be designed, so you're not just being dumped in a stretch of open desert next to some enemies.

Add some Underrail-inspired thrown items like nets and EMP grenades.

 

[Humbaba]

I would make it RTWP.

 

[agris]

Non-sticky cover combined with stances would make it better. Taking a knee behind a rusted out car to provide +aim while making yourself harder to hit would be fun.

Making the companions controllable isn’t a good idea imo. I do wish the AI were smarter and you could give verbal orders ala the party orders mod, but companions you don’t directly control is part of the fallout experience. Frustrating as it can be, it’s one of the factors that makes the games unique.

 

[Disciple]

Make going for the enemy's eyes or head with firearms less OP.

Redesign 'concatenated-encounter' quests like the one involving the cleansing of the Regulators in the Boneyard.

 

[buffalo bill]

permadeath & remove save system

even more gruesome death animations

 

[Cross]

Just copy what Jagged Alliance 2 did. They already have more than a few things in common: open world, targeting of body parts, recruitable companions, stealth/speech/repair/doctor skills.

 

[JarlFrank]

Add full party control

done

 

[Turn_BASED]

I don't remember much of a Fallout 1, 2 combat, but for a starter I would love to make a different terrain types, heights, weather and temperatures to have an impact on combat and also weapon jamming.

Super Mutant was hit for 10 hit points. It is hot outside.

 

[PapaPetro]

RTwP for trash mobs.
TB for bosses.
Simultaneous moves.

 

[Serus]

Add full party control

done

That would be a move in the right direction but certainly not enough. You need more diversity* in combat too. Somehow. It is too shallow as it is now. Copying JA2 would be the easiest way. Possibly with some improvements like better rules and role for suppressive fire. Built-in ironman mode would be a nice, small addition. Better random encounters or instead many possible fixed encounters would be nice as well.
Also, difficulty. With full party control you make games that were easy to begin with even easier. You need to counter it.

*I don't mean niggers and trans-lesbians.

 

[laclongquan]

Smoke caused by fire, or certain grenades. Stand inside will increase tohit difficulty by 20 points, also raise accuracy diff by 20 points. aka you are harder to hit, and hit others more difficult.

 

[Ryan muller]

Fallout combat is fine, but way too simple. The obvious change would be better A.I and a more well designed cover system with some destructibility, but i would add some stuff

For example, i dont like how we have poison as a stat condition but we cant apply oils to melee weapons that can be poisonous, nor the fact the game has no poison grenades, shit like negative stat ailments help a lot when it comes to tactical gameplay and its quite lacking here

Criticals as they are do convey lethality well, but they are shit for more tactical combat, it would be better if the weapons just dealt more damage as they were or the player had less HP, so regardless of criting, a shotgun still would kill you at close range

im also all up to adding more action points per turn if the game dont give you the full party control (which would be preferable )

 

[Lt Broccoli]

Able to use guns as improvised melee weapon
Weapon/Armour part replacements (can be improvised)
No access to inventory without heavy penalty
Limited Ammunition reloads (see above about no access to inventory without heavy penalty)
Grapple mechanics
Incremental Weight/Load penalties
Overheat mechanics on Energy/Heavy Weapons
Vehicles
Use of height/elevation
Fog of war penalties
Cover mechanics
Stand/crouch/prone conditions
Controllable NPCs
Indirect Fire/Indirect LOS
Environmental destruction impacts
Greater use of Traps
Disease
Temperature/Weather impacts (and in conjunction with armour)
Psychological effects (PTSD, phobias, etc...)
Nuclear Fusion Critical Hit detonations

 

[Bester]

You have a few good ideas, but some of your stuff is just so bad...

Psychological effects (PTSD, phobias, etc...)

If your character has -10% to hit spiders because of a phobia, it's pretty much irrelevant.
If your character loses self control and runs away, it sucks because nobody likes control being taken away.

Grapple mechanics

It's a sprite based game with 99% combat involving multiple targets, while grapping is a 1 on 1 activity with a lot of transitions that need visual representation (a ton of sprite animations) and it's frankly not even interesting. How many people here watch Submission Underground? How many here even know what an Abu Dhabi championship is? You don't want grappling.

Use of height/elevation

It's an isometric game, which is ill suited for heights. Do you want a non-isometric game? Should've opened up with that.

Overheat mechanics on Energy/Heavy Weapons

Is this fun? How?

Temperature/Weather impacts (and in conjunction with armour)

Do you really want to micromanage your character depending on whether it's raining or not? Is this fun?

 

[Tavar]

The only two things I dislike about Fallout's combat are the brain dead companions and how long it takes in big fights. I'm not sure what the best fix for the second problem is, though. I don't think Fallout needs more stuff in it. Adding covers, poison, stances, etc. just makes the game more complicated, but not necessarily more fun.

 

[NecroLord]

Controllable companions - is it really necessary? It's a game about loneliness and melancholy, after all.
What else you got?

Fallout 2 had this up to a certain point.
However, you cannot completely control the behavior of some companions. There is nothing more infuriating than having Marcus charging like a dumass while being completely surrounded on all sides by heavily armed raiders. Don't even get me started on companions using burst firearms. Just, for the love of God, do not give any of them burst weapons. You will regret it otherwise.
My choice would be to allow complete control over the behavior of companions.
Leave the original Fallout combat as it is, with its glorious Aimed Shots system, Action Points and brutal kill animations.

 

[xuerebx]

Make it first/third person with real time combat with an optional quasi turn-based/slow-mo mode. Just kidding, that would never happen!
















Right?

 

[ItsChon]

I'm shocked no one has mentioned Age of Decadence/Dungeon Rats yet. Despite all of the comparisons to Fallout that Underrail has received, I consider AoD/DR to be far more comparable to FO. Both games have similar action point mechanics, the ability to target limbs, similar movement/pacing, etc. Both AoD and DR have superior combat to FO, and I think that you could take a lot of the elements that are utilized in those games to improve FO, though I do think you'd have to make some changes/improvements to FO as well to make it compatible to such changes. Improved visual clarity to be able to better determine sprite positioning for mechanics such as flanking/backstabbing/etc, is just one example.

 

[ghostdog]

- Add deep customization to companion combat AI behavior.
- Better random encounters
- Extensive combat arsenal (more grenade / trap / throwing options) that can help you create new specialized builds.
- Better perks, that can help your specialized builds.

 

[Trithne]

I'm shocked no one has mentioned Age of Decadence/Dungeon Rats yet. Despite all of the comparisons to Fallout that Underrail has received, I consider AoD/DR to be far more comparable to FO. Both games have similar action point mechanics, the ability to target limbs, similar movement/pacing, etc. Both AoD and DR have far superior combat to FO, and I think that you could take a lot of the elements that are utilized in those games to improve FO, though I do think you'd have to make some changes/improvements to FO as well to make it compatible to such changes. Improved visual clarity to be able to better determine sprite positioning for mechanics such as flanking/backstabbing/etc, is just one example.

Also Colony Ship, which makes me think of Fallout too, but the full party control improves it drastically.

 

[PapaPetro]

Nuclear Fusion Critical Hit detonations

Let's talk damage numbers.
We hitting 9999 Final Fantasy caps or we doing 32-bit integer limits?

 

[Zboj Lamignat]

Realistically?

1. Make aiming much more difficult, not only requiring a bigger skill investment, but also highly dependent on the type of weapon, mods, additional perks and so on. This would also partially fix character development system.
2. Improve companion ai and add more scripts to customize their behavior + maybe allow some choices on their level ups. Basically give the player an incentive to actually use them. Giving full control would mean the need to completely overhaul the entire combat and all encounters, so not really achievable.

 

[Beans00]

Add full party control

done

I dunno, I feel like these frustrations turned into great childhood memories.

 

[Bester]

Improved visual clarity to be able to better determine sprite positioning for mechanics such as flanking/backstabbing/etc, is just one example.

How? Transition from hex to square grid?