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Wasteland Lets talk about quest design and writing

hiver

Guest
Since PoE has threads about its writing and quest designs why not have one for this garbage of a game?

Lets start by the order of appearance:



The start of the game, and the very first mission to get the radio parts.

A Citadel full of high level rangers is too busy doing nothing at all so its up to some random fresh new "recruits" to go and check out whats going on with a super important secret mission the commander and his close friends are doing about some mysterious radio signals.

You are forbidden from entering the citadel... because.... why?

Just because. You never ever get any reason for that. Its never mentioned or addressed at all.

Your characters are not even rangers at all...because... why?

Just because. You never ever get any reason for that. Its never mentioned or addressed at all.
So, from the very first seconds in the game any sane thinking person is required to just stop thinking and accept the incoherent nonsense as establishing facts.


Before you head out, there is one high level ranger who you can take with you... because... why?

Just because.

In fact Angela is willing to go with you only to make the start of the game easier for incompetent morons - which is a complete meta reason not supported by anything in the game internal logic or writing, except some nonsense excuses that again require a conscious player to just stop thinking about any of it.

Angela doesnt know you, she has no reason to think you will find her friend, and no reason to tag along.
Remember, you are not even a ranger at that time and for quite some time after, just a bunch of random idiots with no allegiance to anyone or anything.

All in all the start of the game establishes that the story is just stupid and you as a player should not really think about any of it.
So instead of achieving anything good, it works really hard to re-establish cliches that vidya gaems are for morons.





*
Im quite sure there are some players who will say they just dont mind it and that they enjoyed whatever just the same, but thats not any kind of actual argument that has anything to do with the quality of writing or quest design, but only speaks about their own stupidity.
 

A horse of course

Guest
Since PoE has threads about its writing and quest designs why not have one for this garbage of a game?

I don't think anyone realy expected anything special from WL2's writing.
 

hiver

Guest
Really? Could you show me that telepathy report?
I mean... if we are going to argue about absurdities we may as well do it properly.

Does it have to be "special"? Can ti be just decent? ok? Is that supposed to serve as excuse for complete garbage.... like, its not special so we should swallow complete crap and smile?
Call it awesome?

Lets continue instead, looking at whats really there.
Once you exit the Citadel grounds you can go directly to the radio tower which is the prescribed route. You can swing directly to the north and reach the ... what was it called... Ralphie town? But that doesnt do much of anything, or oyu can swing south which starts the false fake fork between Ag Center and Highpool. You can do one of those but cannot finish them until you get the radio parts.


The radio tower.

You get there and your quest compass pretending to be a dialogue box starts telling you every single fucking thing you need to know or do.

It tells you there is blood on the ground, it even tells you that shining light above a bush is what you should click on, because just having a shining light there isnt enough.

Every cave or point of interest has the same shining light hovering there, because the players the game is made for are of course so fucking stupid they would not be able to figure it out themselves.

Of course the dialogue quest compass also tells you what to click on and Angie advises you not to miss the documents that are right in front of you in the cave with the robot.

You can take a small battery out of the robot and collect his armor a leg... but hey, telling anyone there is a whole advanced robot there so it gets taken whole to be studied in the Citadel is just not an option.
I mean you can say you found a robot there but nobody gives a fuck to do anything about it.

And you have an amazing option of killing or not some pointless raiders. You can also get a few of them to "join the rangers" but you never see them again.


Then you go back to the Citadel, but still cant enter it... WHY? Just because. There is no sane reason for it.

And then you are off to deal with critically important locations, because thats what some random recruits of rangers are for, while the rangers just do nothing in the citadel.
 

jagged-jimmy

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Quests were mediocre, but the direction and design goals were about right. Multiple solutions, branching quest paths - mostly in LA though.
The quality was not very good, but what was the last game where such approach to quests was seen?
 

hiver

Guest
Discuss each quest by its merits.

I didnt make the thread so random morons can come in and make stupid empty declaratory statements to make themselves feel better.
 
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Saduj

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I'm sure I'm going to be dismissed as a shit slurping moron for this but there are claims in the OP that are demonstrably untrue.

They do give you a reason why you aren't allowed in the Citadel. You're a rookie who has to "earn" it. I thought it was a pretty bad explanation but that's your explanation. I agree that it didn't make much sense to me to have rookies carrying out an important assignment.

Angela's motivations are actually pretty obvious. She wants to know what happened to her friend. Going to the place where he was headed/likely killed is a rather obvious place to start looking for clues.

After the initial radio tower, I thought quest design was above average (some good, some typical crap that every crpg has) until you get to the end and "LOL it was the big baddie from the first game all along!".

EDIT - Also, it wouldn't be unusual for a military organization to have rules that they don't feel the need to explain to new recruits.
 
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markec

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Codex 2012 Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Dead State Project: Eternity Codex USB, 2014 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
But VD said writing goes from good to great. Anyone wanna bet hes gonna pull the Rybicki maneuver for Torment preview.
 

hiver

Guest
I'm sure I'm going to be dismissed as a shit slurping moron for this but there are claims in the OP that are demonstrably untrue.
You wont because you actually tried made a proper argument instead of just posting empty declaratory statements.
On the other hand you are claiming i am claiming something that i am not, but i understand why you think so and it seems as an honest misunderstanding of what i am saying.
I expected such a counter argument, only presented in a much more retarded way.

They do give you a reason why you aren't allowed in the Citadel. You're a rookie who has to "earn" it.
Yes and that doesnt make any fucking sense at all. Because it is never explained why is that SO - So its completely worthless as an excuse/reason and its completely empty and stupid too.

That is nothing more then saying "you cant because you cant" - understand?

I thought it was a pretty bad explanation but that's your explanation.
That is not my explanation nor is "an explanation" good or acceptable just because it exists and especially if its completely stupid and nothing more then a complete nonsense without any logic. Its not just pretty bad, it is worthless.
Its a non-reason.


Angela's motivations are actually pretty obvious. She wants to know what happened to her friend. Going to the place where he was headed/likely killed is a rather obvious place to start looking for clues.
She doesnt know where you are going or why. And of course she has no reason to do so with some retarded "recruits" - is what i am saying.

After the initial radio tower, I thought quest design was above average (some good, some typical crap that every crpg has) until you get to the end and "LOL it was the big baddie from the first game all along!".
And you started so good... trying to make some actual arguments... and now you just put the whole game in a single declaratory sentence ... just stating it is so.

EDIT - Also, it wouldn't be unusual for a military organization to have rules that they don't feel the need to explain to new recruits.
:facepalm:

You are saying to me that there is some mysterious invisible "reason"... that nobody ever heard of... and thats supposed to ... do what?
You are arguing from non existent reasoning?


I would urge you to think about it all and not repeat it in this thread.
 

Saduj

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Messages
2,554
I'm sure I'm going to be dismissed as a shit slurping moron for this but there are claims in the OP that are demonstrably untrue.
You wont because you actually tried made a proper argument instead of just posting empty declaratory statements.
On the other hand you are claiming i am claiming something that i am not, but i understand why you think so and it seems as an honest misunderstanding of what i am saying.
I expected such a counter argument, only presented in a much more retarded way.

They do give you a reason why you aren't allowed in the Citadel. You're a rookie who has to "earn" it.
Yes and that doesnt make any fucking sense at all. Because it is never explained why is that SO - So its completely worthless as an excuse/reason and its completely empty and stupid too.

That is nothing more then saying "you cant because you cant" - understand?

I thought it was a pretty bad explanation but that's your explanation.
That is not my explanation nor is "an explanation" good or acceptable just because it exists and especially if its completely stupid and nothing more then a complete nonsense without any logic. Its not just pretty bad, it is worthless.
Its a non-reason.


Angela's motivations are actually pretty obvious. She wants to know what happened to her friend. Going to the place where he was headed/likely killed is a rather obvious place to start looking for clues.
She doesnt know where you are going or why. And of course she has no reason to do so with some retarded "recruits" - is what i am saying.

After the initial radio tower, I thought quest design was above average (some good, some typical crap that every crpg has) until you get to the end and "LOL it was the big baddie from the first game all along!".
And you started so good... trying to make some actual arguments... and now you just put the whole game in a single declaratory sentence ... just stating it is so.

EDIT - Also, it wouldn't be unusual for a military organization to have rules that they don't feel the need to explain to new recruits.
:facepalm:

You are saying to me that there is some mysterious invisible "reason"... that nobody ever heard of... and thats supposed to ... do what?
You are arguing from non existent reasoning?


I would urge you to think about it all and not repeat it in this thread.

I haven't played the game in a while but I thought Angela did know where you are headed when she asks to tag along. If I'm wrong then I agree that it makes no sense that she'd want to join your party.

As far as my arguing for "reasons that don't exist", I think the reason for such a policy should be pretty obvious. Why would they want you to "prove yourself" before letting you see their operation? Probably because some people finish the training but then wash out when sent into the field and they want to make sure people are going to stick around before they let you see anything sensitive. The Rangers don't say this but a real military operation wouldn't explain it either. Having said that, the policy is undermined by the fact that later on you can recruit NPCs and immediately send them to the Citadel and they are allowed inside. Also, IMO, it doesn't make sense to send people into the field with substandard equipment if their mission is important. So yeah, it bothered me too but not for long....

As far as my general opinion on the rest of the quests, I remember that there was plenty of "find this for me" or "clear out the baddies from this area". I'm sure there was some fedex work in their too. But Rail Nomads had a good main quest (somewhat ruined by keyword solution that doesn't happen anywhere else in the game). The main Canyon of Titan quest stood out. From what I remember the main Mannerite quest was meh but a couple of the side quests were pretty good. Hollywood pretty much gets killed here but the main quest was actually well done (once bugs were fixed). The prison also had an interesting peaceful solution available but I preferred to kill those bastards. Damonta was crap. Not sure about Rhodia because I went hostile right away and killed off the way underpowered raiders.
 

hiver

Guest
bs6mSS3.jpg


It just astounds me that you are not capable of logically connecting the points you make yourself.


As far as my arguing for "reasons that don't exist", I think the reason for such a policy should be pretty obvious.
If thats obvious then why dont those reasons exist in the game in any shape way or form? You are actually inventing some kind of stupid excuse that is not in the game and saying thats an excuse.
And i will tell you why it is stupid, although i should not really even consider it or waste time on this it at all. Since it doesnt exist! Its just something you invented to try and excuse an incredibly idiotic setup.

There is no "operation to see" inside the citadel. Nobody is doing anything at all inside. There is nothing to hide.

If some people "finish the training and then wash up" why the fucking hell would such people be given a mission of critical importance.... when there is many high level rangers inside the citadel?
(let alone sent to do it with lowest equipment possible... hey... could that be the real reason? eh, EH?)

Not just one mission of finding another high level ranger and getting some critical equipment, but also deciding the fate of two critically important locations just after that?

Why is the citadel closed all that fucking time?
Because. There is no sane reason at all - its all literally incoherent stupid garbage.

You could have just as well started as full rangers, with access to the citadel as would be fucking sane and expected. But i guess those ingenious game designers could not have figured out how to prevent you from ... shopping for better weapons? Because thats a difficult thing to prevent or find an excuse for.... in a fucking post apocalyptic setting that is supposedly based on scarcity. Or it was just because the boss had that brilliant idea of you "proving you are worthy of rangerism" and then it just went downhill from there.


In any case its all pointless stupid shit.
I dont care what excuses you have to invent to make it seem better for yourself. Thats not the subject of this thread.



AG CENTER AND HIGHPOOL

Are nothing more than cheap forced fork in the story.

They are both internally completely stupid and incoherent and whats worse, whatever you do and choose you still get the exact same consequences happening in the world as a result. Even if you choose to let them both get ruined - YOU STILL GET to deal with those stupid, pointless infected places and the Wreckers base, as a result.

The story of their importance is illogical crap. Ag center provides the food and several NPCs tell you if it gets destroyed everyone will be dead within a weak. That of course never happens.
Highpool is the source of water (although Railnomads has plenty but who cares about that stupid shit EH?) and several NPCs tell you everyone will die in a few weeks if that place gets destroyed, but of course that never happens.

Of course, if your brain isnt completely dead by now you may ask how does Ag center produce food without water...and what do people in Highpool eat?




Ag center is an overblown empty convoluted location that doesnt make any sense at all.

There is some infection inside that is turning people into plant zombies but you heal that with a mcguffin ventilation. There are some "scientist" to save but if you dont it doesnt matter. There are some NPCs to save or not but that doesnt matter at all for anything either.
One is used as a cheap schlock excuse - as you can get him to see you killing his son that turned to a plant zombie, OR NOT.
The other one will heal you or not based on whether you lied to him about some other NPC death over which you have no ifluence...or any reason to lie to him about.... but you never have any reason to return to Ag center after that ever again.

Two main NPCs are Matt Forestall who turns into a plant zombie based on if you return from underground half way through or not. And if you tell him you found some fungicide or not. Thats the only thing that decides that.
You are basically given a convoluted option to behave like a stupid asshole or NOT. If you dont and "heal him" he gives you some really good loot. If you are an asshole you dont get it.
So its literally a stupid schlock option that nobody sane would choose.

Kathy Lawson is your exposition box and even if you decide to let Ag center get ruined she will still be there, impaled on some mutated vines that are killing her - but still able to give you a full rundown of the situation, including telling you where the magic cure is and who done it, even joke and laugh while you talk - as she is being killed by mutated vines.

Oh and there is the villain who will wait for you in the exact same setup, regardless if you save the location or if it gets destroyed. The only difference is that devs copy pasted that encounter from the basement to the front door to save you from going through that whole stupid shit.
Apparently, his motivation for doing all that shit is to lure some rangers there so he can kill them.... which is just mindbogglingly stupid.

- the real reason for that "villain" is of course to show the player there are some strange cyborgs/robots around.
 
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hiver

Guest
Highpool


A place designed in such a way that the siege that is happening there doenst make any sense at all.
The walls of Highpool are so high and dense that not even Titan Canyon monks would manage to conquer it with frontal assault, let alone low level "wreckers".
There is simply no way such a force can do anything to such a location.

Whats worse, the inhabitants of Highpool do not use that enormous advantage in any way. Nobody is shooting down from those high walls, nobody is even throwing anything at the attackers.

The setup is nonsensical from the get go.


Once you go up, and see the place is full of NPCs that did not do a single thing during the siege, you get to run through a super obnoxious mini dungeon in order to turn 9 ... NINE (or is it more?) valves around to prevent some ridiculous fake catastrophe from occurring there, while opening and closing numerous doors, because someone designed their water facility to be the stupidest cheapest gamey ploy ever - instead of anything that actually makes sense - fighting stupid pointless weak roaches along the way to make it last even longer.

After that you have a few fetch subquest to handle which supposedly influence the "elections" in that place. Elections which dont make any sense at all.
One candidate is pro-rangers... one is for the other faction that does not matter in the game in any way. The Red Scorpions of the Prison location.

So in a post apocalyptic adventure action game, you get to deal with pointless "politics" and elections that make no sense whatsover, doing fetch quests and simply clicking on one or the other candidate.

Whats worse, the only thing you can do with Red Scorpions later is either kill them all - which makes going for their candidate pointless, or convince them to join the Rangers - which makes going for their candidate pointless.
You may think something like "oh kewl, this is inxile being ironic about politics." but they are not. This is all done with straight face and they actually meant it without an ounce of any kind of irony or sarcasm.


According to Vault Dweller "review" this was entertaining and awesome, but weve already been over that.
 
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Lord Azlan

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To the OP - have you ever played a computer game before or even watched a film?

Why should you be able to go into the Citadel - why would they let you in?

Why should you start the game as full blown rangers?

I missed Angela on my first play through - after you have a discussion with her - why shouldn't she join your party. She decides after the conversation you have. Are you saying a full blown experienced ranger is a bad judge of character?

You made some points how the team is low level noobs - isn't that the whole point of nearly any RPG computer game that ever existed - you start from level noob and end up saving the world or the girl?

I am interested in what you are saying about the plot but can you elaborate a bit more?
 

hiver

Guest
You sure make me want to elaborate more by asking idiotic questions like that first one.

Why should you be able to go into the Citadel - why would they let you in?
Why should you start the game as full blown rangers?
WHY THE FUCK NOT?

You are supposed to play as a ranger you stupid fuck.



Another thing i forgot to add to considerations of Highpool plot. The illogical nonsense of letting it get destroyed.

...Jesus this is so fucking stupid it hurts my brain to think about it...

Highpool is THE source of water for that whole area, right? Thats what the game story and narrative and crucial NPCs tell us. Without it everyone will DIE in a few weeks (days actually but whatever)

Wreckers are attacking it and in case you let it get destroyed... you can come there and find it all ruined. Completely. You cannot even climb to the highest part because everything is destroyed.

But you can of course find one NPC who serves as an exposition box to click onto, so he tells you the whole story and sends you to clear the wreckers base anyway!... hey... what happens with wreckers leader, the Jackhammer chick, if you play like this? Do you ever see her anywhere after? Back in the wreckers base? i didnt.

Anyway... it seems that wreckers destroyed the only source of water in that whole area...

Which would kill them all.

:lol:
 
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Unwanted
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hiver fighting the good fight for once.


But don't bother it's a lost cause. As you can see from this sub forum much less people here bought WastedLand 2, or at least wanted to talk about it, but somehow it's ok if it wasn't anywhere close to a classic cRPG and mediocre even by modern standard.

This place can't stop sucking the professional panderer's dick. Someone who based his entire campaign pitch on the evil publisher vs developer dichotomy.
 

Atchodas

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Except critical logical mistakes at the start of the game ( we got a chopper but you new recruits have to sacrifice one of the most important post apocalyptic towns because we cba to leave the base ) i actually enjoyed writing of the game : Canyon of Titan , Rodia , Holywood were all very well written imo , most important is to ignore crappy implementation of choice early and forget it as soon as you are done with it .
 

hiver

Guest
Thank you for that declaratory statement about how much you enjoyed it after shutting down higher brain functions.
Thats what this thread is about after all, right? proclamations !

We will get to that stupid shit too.

All in good order.
 

Atchodas

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It seems like creators wanted us to make an early choice and live with it more than they wanted that it made sense . This sux i agree , but you cant deny that places like Rodia are decently written and interesting to playtrough atleast twice .
Seems you are rly butthurt about the begining of the game , did you try to play after or it hurt toooooo much?

Edit : not only you seems like half of negative stuff about WL2 is based on first 2 Missions That include you being blocked out of RC and having to make choice between AG and HP , nobody mentions how game gets way better after that
 

hiver

Guest
Ah, the ad hominems schtick, gee what a surprise from an imbecile. The self masturbatory presumptions of a stupid moron. Cant read either eh?

Im getting to other locations, one by one, i said we will get to others too. Do i have to repeat it a few more times?
 

Rpgsaurus Rex

Guest
The straw that broke my patience with WL2 was discovering a grand slave compound or some such behind that brothel in Hollywood and (yet again) seeing it have no impact on the game or the story whatsoever. The whole quest design thing felt like you were playing a game to guess the "correct" choices instead of doing the obvious thing. It's like they put in the encounters, areas, NPCs, quests, etc but ran out of time or money or just stopped caring when it came to actually them into a fun, reactive RPG. Same with everything about WL2, really, it's like the devs didn't even play their own game. I doubt any sane person would go though opening their 50th random chest with 33% success rate (maxed lockpick still, of course) to find yet another RNG "treasure" trash and think "this is good game design".

Oh, another thing that almost made me RQ - if you side with the military people in the Canyon (the nuclear missile mission) and pick their side they still treat you like dogs, same as before, even though you've just wiped out an entire enemy faction. The fuck? Here you are, a team that just Rambo'd an enemy base without any casualties and you talk them down like they're some random newts?

WL2 needed at least 2-3 more years of hard work, playtesting and polish, IMHO.
 

hiver

Guest
Thats jumping too far ahead but the game is riddled with such scenes who serve only one function.

To create cheap schlock moments.

Nothing else.
And each is so amazingly dumb its just incredible anyone actively tried to do it. I would put them all in one single list, just to enhance how ridiculous and cheap they are but im not sure if ill have the stamina for that much horrible schlock.
(of course there are other bad things in the game but im trying to keep this thread focused only on writing)


Next up the mini location of Level up mine...

To cut the description of it short,
Its a small circular map, full of stupid badgers.
The setup is that some miners are trapped inside and you need to get some dynamite caps to them in order for to blow up some rocks that are preventing them from getting out.
You go in, clear out HP sponge badgers (easy to do with energy and melee weapons) and get to the miners who just stand there in a completely open space.
Badgers just didnt attack them because...

because....

because...

anyway, it is up to you to put those caps on dynamite and blow up the rocks.
While miners and your team just stand next to them.
You dont need any explosive skill to do so.

But before you do it, you can stop for a second and realize that the miners and your team can just go back the way you came in, because you cleared it.
So there is no need to blow up anything. Only thats not an option.

because...?

:retarded:


Outside there is one guy (pretty strong melee build) who will ask to join you because you saved his mother but he wont offer that before because...


:retarded:
 

hiver

Guest
Rail Nomads...

You enter the location from a side, instead through the front gate only so a completely incoherent and stupid quest can be pushed into your face. The actual front gate is even changed into a simple transition to the second half of the area - only so you really have to run into that stupid quest every fucking time you come there.

A "kid" is drowning in the lake... standing barely few meters from the shore, and his girlfriend and the "witness" NPC standing close to it all dont do anything to try and help him out.
The girl runs away to that side entrance of the map so you have to run into her when you come there, and the witness only reacts if you try to help but then accidentally fail, or succeed.

Also, look - a whole fucking lake of water!
So... what was that about Highpool? Does this ever get even mentioned? Does it play any role in anything? - Nope.

Angela, your companion will "shout" at you how you just simply have to save that kid!!! because thats her role in the game - but if you simply walk away and do nothing at all or shoot the bastard yourself she wont say a thing.
She will also berate you for killing any civilians and even leave the group if you do so a few times - but wont react at all if you actually shoot and kill Ralphie.
- even better, five minutes after that she will kill a completely innocent civilian herself in a scripted event, for no sane or defensible reason whatsoever except forcing that stupid cheap schlock moment onto the player. -

General Vargas will also call over the radio if you honestly try but accidentally fail to save the kid, because he apparently monitors and sees everything you do - only he will not say anything if you kill the stupid shit yourself and he will never again call in many other such similar cases when you kill someone just because.

:retarded:

Thats not enough, so if you do save the fucking moron by clicking on one of the fucked up "totems" that just stand there ... him and his girlfriend will run straight to a spot where there is ... A BOMB ON A CHILDRENS BYCYCLE!!! OH GAAWD!!!
And if you dont remove that bomb he will get killed, oh gaaawd! And they are even called Jessie and Ralphie... for fuck sake... because the main plot of the area is about two sides fighting eachother...

:retarded:


Then you have another companion there, with the stupid cheap schlock moment of him attacking you if you try to dig the only unmarked grave on the local graveyard... which is then revealed to be his wife grave!! shockiiingg!!
Of course, any sane player will just reload when that happens, with optional throwing up or going into :retarded: catatonic mode from such amounts of stupidity. Plus several other smaller incoherent filler details not worth mentioning at all, equally pointless and cheap.


The main plot of the area is not that bad as a concept. Rather simple and cliche setup of two previously friendly sides fighting and your role is to step in and make something happen.
But the execution of it all is so fucking laughably stupid and contrived, its just disgusting to be forced to play it.
Old spaghetti western "fist full of dollars" is a Shakesperian work of epic ingeniousness compared.

There is also a third side-force there, right in the middle between two sides so you have to go through them to reach the other tribe. They are antagonistic to both sides, stronger and better equipped then anyone else - but they just stand there doing nothing at all, serving only the purpose of you having some fighting to do.


Again, the whole location comes down to series of cheap forced schlock moments that are simply insulting to intelligence and forces the player to stop thinking completely, in order to go through it all, including the super stupid resolutions to the "situation" - which doesnt affect anything at all in the game, except maybe some ending slides - despite the setup telling you how important is that location.
 

hiver

Guest
I think the writing quality and facts of each setup or location speak for themselves.

However, not every single location is on this level of horrible complete nonsense - and thats putting it politely. Although the examples of something better are flukes, accidents or material that somehow escaped the CEO direction.



CITADEL


Of course as everyone knows, after you finish one of the two simple Fork locations, and before you get to Rail Nomads, you get allowed to enter the Citadel. Which is actually a really nice location.
Very nice visual design and several gameplay connections to a few other game quests.

Unfortunately... it also shows you how much the starting setup is forced and idiotic nonsense. Since the Citadel is full of high level rangers, practically swimming in high level equipment and weapons.

And you... as a ranger... doing these critical missions for the Ranger.... have to buy ammo and weapons... otherwise they wont give them to you....

Because thats what you do, right? When you are the leader or commander of some post apocalyptic rangers, when you send a team of rangers (lets put aside the idiocy of using complete noobs and not rangers) to do some important missions - then you send them without or with worst armor and weapons available - and you dont give them any ammo.

:retarded:


But anyway, there is a few good things in the Citadel, the museum is a very nice feature with a few actually interactive and important bits. Like a head of a former enemy that has a pass code for an entrance to his base you find later.
There is also a nuclear bomb there that you can activate... which is kinda stupid but acceptable stupid fun. Since it is just openly silly, honestly tongue in cheek feature.
There is one prisoner that you will need to lead you to an important part of equipment.
Someone you can give the weird robots parts to check out and study - although that is less then sensibly done sine no one cares for whole robots you find... - and it doesnt produce anything important.
A few more similar smaller things like that.
And you can report any new locations you discover to the cartographer ... although that means that he and the rangers somehow just forgot where those locations are.


So... lets presume you decide to look for Darwins base now, since you get notified it exists around this point in the game.
No you cant find it yourself just by traveling over the map.





DARWINS BASE

Becomes available only after gen Vargas notifies you about it and the cartographer tells you where it is, which makes it appear on the world map.
If you go there before, there is nothing to find on the world map. (much non linearity eh?)

Anyway, its the first usual basic quality cRPG location.

You get there and find some easily killable zombie-mutants. And you get to the door which the code on the head in the Citadel museum unlocks. I was shocked that you dont get any hints or hand holding to figure that out.

Once inside you get involved in a relatively simple but well done quest.
The only silly thing is that its AGAIN - case of some VERY SERIOUS plague that you solve by flipping ventilation on - just like you do in AG center.

You have two option on how to solve the problem, that depends on the skillsets you have in your party - which is very nice and the first time you see that in the game - although due to fucked up skill/xp leveling system you will have ALL skills available by that time.

There is a nicer way to go about it and you need high and very high lockpicking, demolition and electronic skills. (demolition is not that important in this case but its easier with it)
And if you dont have them (for some reason) you have to do it through direct violence - killing everything that moves.
Both ways have their own consequences which fit. Simple stuff but ok.


The thing i liked the best was the option to liberate a strange creature which then tags along your team, as an independent non-controllable follower, which in turn can make combat more difficult since you have to worry about keeping them alive.

That was a good feature in the game.
That is something i expected out of such game.

This tag along "companion" has a lot of HP so you dont have to worry about it getting killed, so most of the time it can serve as a aggro attracting target for enemies, which makes combat a bit easier.
And you can feed it with some items you find and dont have much use for otherwise, which make the whole thing creepily interesting.

The other such tag along companion you can get in a different location is very vulnerable so it makes combat more difficult, since you have to work hard to save them in harder encounters - but it has a pretty awesome power.
Which is completely silly, but fun and useful tongue in cheek feature.

You also have a nice option of reporting all this to Vargas, or lying about it.



And then you are back to complete shitfest retardation of the Prison location.
 

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