[LP CYOA] Spiral

[Nevill]

Don't you guys think though how Shinoseki is being conveniently interrupted whenever he's thinking about waking Amanozaki? And that whatever/whoever may be trying to get us to leave the room before the clock runs out?

Maybe. But what does that tell us about the identity or the intentions of the voice owner?

Whatever/whoever is behind the door does not want us staying in the room and waking/'waking' whatever/whoever is inside. Is that a good thing, or a bad thing?

The haunting is almost identical to the scene in the first chapter, including the cloth over her face, and that hasn't really happened thus far in the LP. It cud be a fake out, you guys.

It could be that the hospital is playing with our senses, though the character has no way of 'remembering' the scene from the first night.

It could also be a tendency of events to run similarly between the nights. Mori always (?) heads to the roof first thing. Mitsuki is always (?) in the toilet that Uehara visits. Shiba and Kozaka end up in a different building. Taketatsu loses his mind.

Who says this is not a part of this pattern?

And our ghostly bruise? It usually hurts more when there's a spirit around, doesn't it? Kinda like Spiderman's spider senses tingling when there's danger. Aaaannnddd... it did stop hurting once we entered the Barrier Room. So if it didn't act up again, it should mean that the barrier is still intact.

Yes. That is weird. But if the barrier is still standing, what is this sense-altering influence we are feeling? How did it creep past the barrier?

The situation can be read both ways. During the first night, when we decided to blame everything on our imagination, we have nearly paid for it. Do we risk it again?

 

[Rex Feral]

A, it's not first time Dead Amanozaki imprints on us to get us killed.

Besides, we don't even know if we're in the same fucking room we were before. The lights went out and it's not like we could distinguish between two rooms of a hospital we barely know in 1 second after waking up.

 

[Nevill]

in 1 second after waking up.

We did not fall asleep. We didn't want to sleep in the first place. We 'phased out' again.

But there were candles in the room, which to me suggests that yes, we are in the same room that we were.

it's not first time Dead Amanozaki imprints on us to get us killed.

Not sure what kind of imprinting you are talking about.

 

[treave]

We did not fall asleep. We didn't want to sleep in the first place. We 'phased out' again.

Nah, there's no real difference between 'sleeping' and 'phasing out' within the text itself, since the first time it happened in the first chapter, it happened when you got tired and dozed off.

 

[LWC1996]

Maybe. But what does that tell us about the identity or the intentions of the voice owner?

Whatever/whoever is behind the door does not want us staying in the room and waking/'waking' whatever/whoever is inside. Is that a good thing, or a bad thing?

A little too convenient to suddenly hear Amanozaki's voice a minute away from midnight, it doesn't seem likely rushing out is going to be a good thing since the protection was faring well so far judging by the non- hurting bruise.

It could be that the hospital is playing with our senses, though the character has no way of 'remembering' the scene from the first night.

It could also be a tendency of events to run similarly between the nights. Mori always (?) heads to the roof first thing. Mitsuki is always (?) in the toilet that Uehara visits. Shiba and Kozaka end up in a different building. Taketatsu loses his mind.

Who says this is not a part of this pattern?

People are more likely do the same things in each night because without an outside eye guiding them, they will tend to do the same thing unlike Shinoseki. The pattern won't repeat without reason. Unless Amanozaki killed herself, or we killed her, and purposely put the cloth over her head too. There's nothing hinting at that.

Yes. That is weird. But if the barrier is still standing, what is this sense-altering influence we are feeling? How did it creep past the barrier?

The situation can be read both ways. During the first night, when we decided to blame everything on our imagination, we have nearly paid for it. Do we risk it again?

I'd put more trust in the bruise as a warning than a barrier's capabilities that we are not 100% sure about. They're not able to cross the barrier 'physically', but there's no rule that says that they can't try to manipulate whoever's inside it.

Also, when the same event happened in the first night, we had not gotten the bruise yet so the two situations cannot be compared.

 

[Nevill]

People are more likely do the same things in each night because without an outside eye guiding them, they will tend to do the same thing unlike Shinoseki.

This 'outside eye' is starting to bother me. It is very obvious that some meta-shenanigans are taking place (hello, Interludes!), and that we are supposed to act on the knowledge the character is not privy to. In a way, we may be another protagonists of this CYOA.

That raises the question, though - if this is a trap, who is it targeted against? Shinoseki, who physically can't recall the previous situation? Or us, who can construct a faulty analogy, panic, and guide Shinoseki to his death?

These 'gods from another dimension' seem a lot like jerks playing for the opposite side in our little match.

Very well, then, I'll bite. In the case it is a trap, how do you suppose C would be different from B, if all we need is to wait out the temptation?

 

[Kz3r0]

B.

 

[LWC1996]

This 'outside eye' is starting to bother me. It is very obvious that some meta-shenanigans are taking place (hello, Interludes!), and that we are supposed to act on the knowledge the character is not privy to. In a way, we may be another protagonists of this CYOA.

That raises the question, though - if this is a trap, who is it targeted against? Shinoseki, who physically can't recall the prevuious situation? Or us, who can construct a faulty analogy, panic, and guide Shinoseki to his death?

These 'gods from another dimension' seem a lot like jerks playing for the opposite side in our little match.

Very well, then, I'll bite. In the case it is a trap, how do you suppose C would be different from B, if all we need is to wait out the temptation?

Well, it might not lead to any difference, but since Amanozaki said to wake her, and Shinoseki thought about doing it twice thus far, third time's the charm.

Another example, in that toilet ghost encounter we had a loads of options, but probably not all of them would have led to different results, just changes in scene and maybe Shinoseki's personality.

 

[Kz3r0]

Very well, then, I'll bite. In the case it is a trap, how do you suppose C would be different from B, if all we need is to wait out the temptation?

Trying to awake Amazonaki can breack the spell we are under, I suspect that A is a trap and C willget us killed by ghostly influences on our mind.

 

[Rex Feral]

I don't think we are in the same room. Just because there were candles, doesn't mean there aren't or weren't candles anywhere else in the hospital. Besides, it's not the first time we phased out and woke up in another place.

 

[Nevill]

I don't think we are in the same room. Just because there were candles, doesn't mean there aren't or weren't candles anywhere else in the hospital. Besides, it's not the first time we phased out and woke up in another place.

Who else but Amanozaki would place candles in a hospital? For what?

To wake in another place we should have passed corridors filled with hostile spirits. There are better and simpler ways to get rid of us.

Trying to awake Amazonaki can breack the spell we are under, I suspect that A is a trap and C willget us killed by ghostly influences on our mind.

Yes, that may be the case. If it is Amanozaki, she may know a way to neutralize whatever spell we are under.

Heh, a devil we know against a devil we don't. Which is better and why?

The timing is interesting, too. Just a minute until the night ends. Would we be able to achieve anything in just a minute, even if we get out of the room? It does look like an attempt to lure us out.

How would a ghostly influence kill us through our mind, though? Isn't the argument for staying in the room that we are safe here?

Nevertheless, I will switch to B. Maybe relying on something simple and easy to understand, like our bruise, in uncertain situations is the right choice.

Nah, forget it. Still on A.

 

[Rex Feral]

Yeah, like the spirits are always there patrolling the corridors.

And secondly, we have already died, by getting a mark on our ankle, by sitting in a dark room which had a dead Amanozaki with a cloth over her face making the same noises as now. Heck, even the soundtrack is the same one as before.

And also:

As if someone – or something – is crawling about the room. You stare into the darkness, sweat gathering in your palms. Is there movement in the gloom? Or is it just your imagination? Has Amanozaki’s barrier failed? Or…

.

track: whimper

The candles go out, plunging the entire room into a stifling blackness.

Slowly, gradually, you begin to hear a woman's croaking whimper, in between the sounds of your own breathing.

Although soft, it seeps into your ears like a worm wriggling into the deepest depths of your brain.

That's totally safe I guess, never happened to us before, no way.

track: whimper

Slowly, gradually, you begin to hear a woman's croaking whimper, in between the sounds of your own breathing.

Although soft, it seeps into your ears like a worm wriggling into the deepest depths of your brain.

EDIT: They are actually the same, for fuck's sake.

 

[Nevill]

Yeah, like the spirits are always there patrolling the corridors.

You are suggesting we were lured out of the room we were in without our knowledge. To be killed, I suppose?

Well, why lead us into the room with the corpse when they can take us straight to the ghosts?

To me, it is simply easier to assume that we are in the same room than come up with an explanation about how we ended up here.

EDIT: They are actually the same, for fuck's sake.

You are making an assumption anyone of us forgot about what happened the last time. We did not.

The question is, does the situation now differ from the one before in any way? This is what we are discussing, currently.

From the top of my head, the differences:
- We were not alone in this room, at least initially. We saw there was Amanozaki with us. If we never left, then it is likely that she didn't, too.
- We are/were in a room with a protective barrier. Supposedly, leaving the room would render us vulnerable. Nothing of a sort could be said about the room in the first chapter, where there was no incentive to stay.
- There is someone actively trying to get us out. We were on our own back then, no one attempted to influence us.
- If the situation is the same, and that is Dead Amanozaki with us, then why is it her voice that we are hearing? Shouldn't she be, y'know, dead?
- This time, there is a danger indicator on our leg that is not going off despite working flawlessly for the whole chapter otherwise.

One can make whatever they want to from these points, but please do not make it look like the situation is clear-cut.

Edit: I will be very pissed if our leg would be to act up right after we make a decision.

 

[a cut of domestic sheep prime]

Seems like someone doesn't want us to survive the night. C

 

[Akkudakku]

B. Wont fall for your ruse treave!

Also we WERE supposed to wake her up if something happens. So yeah.

 

[Jester]

C - panic mode activated

 

[Elfberserker]

Hmm...
If it's a monster who is calling for us then it would be first time during our stay that they had used talking to misdirect us.

A for now.

 

[Nevill]

If it's a monster who is calling for us then it would be first time during our stay that they had used talking to misdirect us.

Yes, this is pretty much what settled it for me.

That there are two sides present with somewhat valid rationalizations, and that there is a third side with not an insignificant number of people wanting to abstain, indicates to me that there is no way to logically determine which solution is right (or that we failed to pick up the right clues), despite what the proponents of each choice might think. Of course when their choice proves to be correct, they will claim they knew it all along, but the fact remains that no convincing arguments were made yet.

Reminds me of our demon fight in Legend.

In that case, we might want to consider the possibilities of failure.

If we fail with A, it will be the case of 'Huh, I didn't know they could do that. I'd better take note'.
If we fail with B, it will be 'I can't believe I was so retarded to fall for the same ploy two times in a row'.

One of them give us new information to process, while the other does not. Not much of a consolation, I know, but at least it is something.

 

[oscar]

Certain defeat (we tried playing dead/remaining still last time) vs possible defeat

 

[TOME]

If we fail with A, it will be the case of 'Huh, I didn't know they could do that. I'd better take note'.
If we fail with B, it will be 'I can't believe I was so retarded to fall for the same ploy two times in a row'.

One of them give us new information to process, while the other does not. Not much of a consolation, I know, but at least it is something.

Well said. A.

 

[Nevill]

Certain defeat (we tried playing dead/remaining still last time) vs possible defeat

See, I do not subscribe to that 'certain defeat' theory.

We have tried to charge a spirit with a mop, and prevailed. Do you think taking a mop and venturing out on a hunt would be a good idea now? What worked once may not work again, and what didn't before may work now, given the right context.


Anyway, I have a few crazy theories of what is happening with the place, and one of them has this place connect to various parallel dimensions with events occuring independently in each one. That is one way to 'explain' away how we are able to converse with people who by all accounts should have been dead, or how the others are able to see us when we know we weren't there. There is usually some sort of 'spacing out' happening when these events occur, which may or may not be a symptom of moving between the 'worlds'.

It is crazy, but the concept of iterations promotes these wacky conspiracy theories, and it is no more weird than this time-space warp already going on...

Maybe I am just trying too hard to rationalize how this Not-/Dead-/Whatever- Amanozaki - if it is indeed the case - got there when she wasn't here before. We just 'shifted' to the world where she is dead.

 

[Kz3r0]

Actually there is a precedent, when Uheara called us out of the room where her corpse wa, even if wasn't clear if was our mind playing tricks or her ghost.
So, it's possible that a dead Amazonaki is trying to save us by getting us out of the room, on the other hand the situation is quite different from the other times, I still think that trying to awake Amazonaki is the best course of action, if something managed to kill her why didn't kill us?

 

[Nevill]

if something managed to kill her why didn't kill us?

Well, it ties in with another question.

What killed Uehara during the first night? What killed Amanozaki when we were the only other person in the room?

Some people have suggested that we are the killer. That we have become possessed and hallucinated an 'explanation'. Indeed, that part in Chapter 1 gave me the feeling (which is another way of saying 'I can't prove shit') that we knew she was dead right after we awoke from a nine hour timeskip. Of course, this is completely at odds with the 'different dimensions' bullshit I mentioned earlier.

That would indicate that this 'something' can't kill directly, and is using other people to target its prey. Like, us to kill Amanozaki. And now, 'Amanozaki' to kill us.

It might be wrong to think 'why didn't it kill us' when it is trying to do so even now, and it may succeed.

We need to talk to Sakaki one of these days to learn about the rules the ghosts follow. There are too many things we have no clue about.

 

[Kz3r0]

Actually, until now the 'ghosts' didn't kill anyone as far as we know, the culprit was always a 'living' person.
Hence, or Taketatsu entered the room and killed Amazonaki leaving us alive because he thinks of us as the matermind of the whole affairor we we are the killer, in both cases we are the key to understand the whole situation.

 

[Tigranes]

It has to be A or B. The premonitions are so clear (the parallels between previous dark room incident) that this is a dangerous moment, I have no idea why anyone would think sitting still is a great idea. It boils down to whether we act on the single major difference this time, Amanozaki's voice, or we distrust it and try to wake Amanozaki.

Sure, this is a strange and occult setting, but that doesn't mean we have to act against common sense for no reason. There's very little reason that the real Amanozaki, sleeping, would cover her face and lie straightly prone. One of the few reliable recurring hints we've had of death and danger were covered lying bodies converted into trash bags. Amanozaki's voice in and of itself could be false; we've previously experienced deceptions involving human voices or even our hallucinating human conversations. But we have no reason to doubt that the appearance of covered body is not a sign that death is afoot. (And if it did turn out to be a trap, that's actually a valuable information we gain - that there are cases where covered body does not entail death and danger necessarily. Whereas if we go for the body then get fucked by the crawler, we haven't learnt any new information, only that what nearly killed us last time kiled us this time.)

A