Game News New Dead State Screenshots Revealed

[GarfunkeL]

Yes. It's an old joke which you should remember. The IMP guy is not Laptop Guy and Laptop guy has no stats, hence JA2 is not an RPG.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Yes. It's an old joke which you should remember. The IMP guy is not Laptop Guy and Laptop guy has no stats, hence JA2 is not an RPG.

Then it isn't an RPG, of course ..

(I always used to think the IMP was the Laptop Guy)

 

[GarfunkeL]

Yup but it's not game over if you don't hire IMP guy or he/she dies, so clearly they are different from the laptop guy.

 

[Burning Bridges]

And how could it be an RPG anyway. There are no swords and no magic, no one calls me Chosen One ..

 

[zool]

JA2 is an RPG, and it's much more than just a "squad-level tactical simulator".

Well, I disagree but I guess we don't have the same definition of what an RPG is.

What is missing to make it a RPG?

I must say I'm having difficulties understanding why you seem to consider it so important to qualify JA2 as being undeniably an RPG rather than something else. Who cares, really, about what genre it is? The game is awesome, and it is clearly one of those games that are at the crossroads of at least two different genres. I (and many others) view it primarily as a squad-tactics simulator with lots of RPGish elements, and an awesome atmosphere on top of that. Others see it as an RPG with a very developed tactical combat engine.

I just pulled my old JA2 box out of the closet and took a look at it: it is alternatively described as a "Role-Playing Strategy Game" or simply as a "Strategy Game". It also reads "Perfect blend of strategy, role-playing, and tactical combat". So, there you go, none of the genres is presented as being more prominent in JA2 than the others. That's why I say that it's not an RPG - but maybe should I have been more specific and written "it doesn't fit into the pure RPG category".

 

[Burning Bridges]

That's why I say that it's not an RPG - but maybe should I have been more specific and written "it doesn't fit into the pure RPG category".

You should have, because that's a completely different statement.

Who cares, really, about what genre it is?

That's you, obviously, just read what you wrote on page 2.

I must say I'm having difficulties understanding why you seem to consider it so important to qualify JA2 as being undeniably an RPG rather than something else.

Never said " undeniably an RPG rather than something else". I just got aroused by the statement "not an RPG".

JA2 rather, as you wrote yourself, excels in a number of genres simultaneously:

"Perfect blend of strategy, role-playing, and tactical combat"

Labelling it as "not an RPG" because it is "already" a tactical game means holding against the game that it is among the best games in not one, but several genres.

Imagine JA2 with a party limit, without the map and the laptop, and you would still be left with a full fledged RPG.

By the way, why do I get the feeling some people assume that a "pure" RPG comes with no strategy and no tactical combat, or only a very primitive implementation?

 

[Burning Bridges]

Since I have contributed to turning this thread into JA2 discussion it's probably necessary to explain why.

The way I understand it, a game like Dead State should allow you to:

- make decisions on a kind of (city) map

- hire people

- equip them

- manage teams of people in combat

- explore the city

- discover (lots of) items

- have 1 or more base and stuff it with equipment

- have some sort of crafting system

Now, the following may be my personal interpretation of the story "I am Legend" and the film "The Omega Man".

But in my perfect zombie / vampire game, there should be an exploration part where the player must find and move large amounts of gasoline, ammunition, food, medicine, weapons etc into their base, and at other times a combat mode in which you fight off waves of zombies. All this while following some kind of storyline.

For this kind of game JA2's structure would be the perfect blueprint, even if the combat in JA2 is deemed too complex to implement.

It should also offer a large degree of freedom so that the player really feels like the governor of the city, not just a spectator of someone elses story. And again, this is one of things that JA2 does better than most other games.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Those may be great ideas, but they are too big for me to put into reality. Don't expect an announcement soon

But if I were given 300.000$ like SubBAssman though ..

I'm on and off working on something else, which is a 2D turn based strategy game. I will give you word if I have something to show, your opinion interests me.

The space engine was never intended to become a game, but rather a labor of love because I like planets and moons, and because I hate the look of them in most commercial space games.

If all else fails for design just shout out "I'm making teh unofficial Jagged Alliance 3!" and get kickstarting.

I am not that megalomaniac ..

 

[Luzur]

A big school with a big courtyard doesn't look like a good idea of a shelter, not unless you have an army at your disposal to protect it. The thought of actually re-enforcing that huge fence seems more scary than a legion of zombies. Oh well, I guess the playground can be used for training your party members.




Nevertheless, it's good we have more info about DS.

well yeah you need to tear down atleast 2 wooden plank buildings to get the necessary resources to fortify all that chain link, plus atleast 2 men every 50-100 meters as guards with guardtower.

 

[Luzur]

I really want to know whether those are in-game mock-up scenes to communicate the design concepts or really screenshots from implemented and working features.

Is it an RPG or Sim Zombie Shelter?

mayeb its like a Settlers game but with zombies.

 

[Luzur]

The 10 years old baby would scale this wall, even after the upgrade, this is how this should be done:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/3-21-9/chap6.htm#fig6-14

wouldnt zombies disregard the barbwire, climb over the cars and then jump over the other barbwire?

 

[Burning Bridges]

Can it be so hard to figure out how to properly barricade a house? I hope the devs watched Night Of The Living Dead?



I thought the defenses in Omega Man were less convincing, some things are quite logical, others aren't. For example it makes no sense to me to defend a row house like this.

 

[villain of the story]

Wasteland isn't an RPG because none of the characters in your party were central. You could replace any one of them as long as you still had someone so it begs for the question: who or what *is* the remote hivemind that controlled all these characters? Sorry, not an RPG.

Unless you are willing to accept the hard fact that JA2 is an RPG.

Anyway, here's a quote from 2010 confirming my fear about "tactical depth" of the game:

Currently, you can't crouch, go prone, or sidestep and cover is mostly about staying out of the lines of sight. Most of these options would only benefit long-range weapon users, which would a small percentage of builds. We'd also have to spend time teaching friendly and enemy AI to deal with it, not to mention do additional into/out of animations for hits or grapples to prone/crouching enemies. It just wasn't worth the time, especially since we wanted to balance the game for melee/ranged rather than tailor the game to styles of ranged combat. The zombies tend to keep people moving, which is another reason we don't have a lot of options to dig in and fight.

http://www.irontowerstudio.com/forum/index.php/topic,1694.msg55267.html#msg55267

I understand his position, he has valid points and I sympathise with it but still: A zombie RPG where you can't crouch or prone for cover, whether to avoid Zombie's LOS or hostile humans... Can't help thinking that a scope-wise simplistic mod for JA2 V1.13 would be a better zombie RPG. Writing and narrative better be excellent or this shit won't fly with me.

 

[Burning Bridges]

Wasteland isn't an RPG because none of the characters in your party were central. You could replace any one of them as long as you still had someone so it begs for the question: who or what *is* the remote hivemind that controlled all these characters? Sorry, not an RPG.

But then Bards Tale, Wizardry, ToEE and most other RPGs are not RPGs either.

 

[Commissar Draco]

The 10 years old baby would scale this wall, even after the upgrade, this is how this should be done:

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/3-21-9/chap6.htm#fig6-14

wouldnt zombies disregard the barbwire, climb over the cars and then jump over the other barbwire?

IF this a concertina razor wire with lots of tin cans noone can sneak throu, you want to stop zombies not delay them bunker down in medieval castle with intact walls.

And don't forget about claymores and other mines pegged ahead. Didn't knew the zombies can jump btw if yes those kids in school are fucked up with this low wooden wall.

 

[GarfunkeL]

AFAIK, Brian is going with the old-school Romero zombies who are strong but not lack mobility. They cannot climb, run or jump. A simple fence is enough to stop them. If they see/hear/smell food behind the fence, they will try to break the wall through power of numbers leaning on it, nothing more advanced than that. So a wooden wall is better than chainlink fence because the zombies won't see humans moving around the school yard.

 

[villain of the story]

Wasteland isn't an RPG because none of the characters in your party were central. You could replace any one of them as long as you still had someone so it begs for the question: who or what *is* the remote hivemind that controlled all these characters? Sorry, not an RPG.

But then Bards Tale, Wizardry, ToEE and most other RPGs are not RPGs either.

tell that to the retards who insist that ja2 isn't one.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

being a rpg makes JA2 objectively better because I like rpgs more therefore they are the bestest genre

 

[Crooked Bee]

Someone has already added Dead State to GOG.com's wishlist:

http://af.gog.com/en/wishlist/games/dead_state?as=1649904300

 

[A user named cat]

In Romero's "Day of the Dead", a massive hoard large amount of zombies could not break through a basic chain link fence with a padlock. Just putting that out there.

 

[villain of the story]

it wasn't a massive hoard up up until the last part when they finally had become one at which point they did break through.

 

[A user named cat]

Massive hoard was an exaggeration but there were a lot of them built up and they never broke through on their own. The armless, out of his mind Spanish soldier unlocked the gate and let them in as they invaded the underground base.

 

[sgc_meltdown]

IIRC dead state outline stated it was more about the psychological/survival aspect rather than sweet, sweet tactical combat against single file walking trash mobs

 

[Roguey]

IIRC dead state outline stated it was more about the psychological/survival aspect rather than sweet, sweet tactical combat against single file walking trash mobs

Brian said the greatest threat would be other humans.

 

[Clockwork Knight]

That doesn't necessarily mean you'll be tactically fighting humans while brushing off zombie nuisances. Going somewhere on a fool's errand while the questgiver helps himself to your stash is just as bad as having a shootout that attracts a hundred deadies.