Obsidian's Pillars of Eternity [BETA RELEASED, GO TO THE NEW THREAD]

[Grunker]

PST only forces you to do 3 fights

Keyword: forces. You can stealth past, run through, or otherwise skip every fight in the game except for the Zombie in the first room of the mortuary, Ravel, and Trias.

If running past enemies you are clearly meant to fight does not count as obligatory encounters for y'all, then more power to you. For me, that constitutes even worse gameplay than the alternative. I'm sure it wouldn't have been difficult to enable the same thing in Infinite.

 

[hiver]

OR you can take punch daggers skill and proceed to whop ass across the planes causing all kinds of butthurt.

- a superior option in my opinion.

 

[tuluse]

If running past enemies you are clearly meant to fight does not count as obligatory encounters for y'all, then more power to you. For me, that constitutes even worse gameplay than the alternative.

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

 

[Grunker]

If running past enemies you are clearly meant to fight does not count as obligatory encounters for y'all, then more power to you. For me, that constitutes even worse gameplay than the alternative.

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

just enable godmode and you're set, same thing

running in ps:t is clearly unintended gameplay

 

[Athelas]

Unintended? The first conversation of the game has Morte telling you that zombies are slow and that you can always run to safety. The meat and bones of the game clearly lies in interaction with NPC's - as an immortal, combat is supposed to be an afterthought. It's not like Bioshock: Infinite where the gameplay is completely at odds with the story.

 

[Grunker]

Zombies are not the entire game. Even if it was intended (it wasn't), it is still absolute crap gameplay to run past enemies like that.

 

[Shadenuat]

Change your class to Thief and stealth through then. Sneak is an intended skill.

 

[Bilgefar]

Even if it was intended (it wasn't)

Source? Seems pretty intended to me. You can't run past the vast majority of combat in any other IE game, but it just so happens that in the one that you can it was a complete accident?

 

[tuluse]

PST didn't even do the "you must gather your party before venturing forth", so you just had to get one character to the transition area.

 

[coffeetable]

Zombies are not the entire game. Even if it was intended (it wasn't), it is still absolute crap gameplay to run past enemies like that.

If you *had* to run past all but 3 fights, that'd be shit gameplay. Giving players the *choice* of running past though is great gameplay in the context of PST.

 

[Hormalakh]

the only thing we don't talk about in this thread is Project Eternity. Thank god at least we changed the topic name.

 

[Infinitron]

http://forums.obsidian.net/topic/64...o-torment-tides-of-numeneras-tides/?p=1388720

A little more on the labels used for each personality type: we need to use a label because it's a helpful abstraction for how the behavior can be characterized, but different characters will interpret that reputation in different ways. "Clever" can be interpreted as sarcastic, witty, foppish, or irreverent. "Benevolent" can be interpreted as charitable, kind, soft, or weak. "Aggressive" can be interpreted as hot-headed, bold, or impatient. Each of these interpretations has a value judgment associated with it but they are all reactions to similar types of behavior. One character will look at your "Aggressive" behavior and (negatively) think that you fly off the handle at everything, provoke fights, and cause trouble. Another character will look at the same "Aggressive" behavior and admire you for taking charge, being decisive, not letting people push you around, etc.

Very Tidey.

 

[Rake]

OK, theory.

The Bioshock "B-Studio", 2K Marin, the guys that made Bioshock 2, is apparently shut down or in the process of being shut down.

Obsidian's secret project? Bioshock spin-off game.

Good. So he can make all the enviromental storyteling he wants to get it out of his system in a game i care nothing about.

When you examine something in Fallout to get a description, it's a form of environmental story-telling. In tpp/fpp games, this is generally done through visual communication (e.g. Half-Life). I imagine this visual aspect of it is what MCA is fascinated with.

So, yeah, it's not some popamole thing to be treated as taboo.

Fallout had the storyteling through text though, which is a superior form in my opinion. I never said enviromental storytelling through visuals alone is popamole or bad, but as i have zero interest in tpp/fpp games, i would prefer Avellone do this in Bioshock/Fallout sequels and not in PE for example.

 

[Koschey]

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

So, would you say a button to bypass this unwanted gameplay is acceptable?

 

[Rake]

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

So, would you say a button to bypass this unwanted gameplay is acceptable?

My gut reaction would be no, by i can't deny that most AAA RPGs would be better with a skip combat button. So confused...

 

[Grunker]

I fail to see how what you guys are supporting doesn't amount to a Game-Be-Gone feature. I would rather play my games that run past them, thanks. If the gameplay sucks, a "skip game" feature does nothing but hammer home that fact. This whole thing reeks of apologism to be honest.

In any case "you can skip it" is a very, VERY poor defense of shitty game mechanics, which everyone hopefully agrees Torment's combat is.

 

[Zed]

Grunker I read the manual (or maybe it was the vision document) before playing and it says something about "if you don't want to fight just run away from the area".

it's very much intended and it's one of the ways the game breaks the mold set by previous infinity engine games.

it is super intended.

 

[Roguey]

Being given the agency to bypass any content you don't/won't enjoy = good for the most part.

That being fun in and of itself? Not a chance unless it also has enjoyable gameplay attached to it. Replacing combat with Thief-style (as opposed to IE-style) stealth for example.

PoE is not a BG clone.

25:19

Chris is not the project director.

 

[Infinitron]

Chris is not the project director.

Nuh uh uh, he said "we", not "I". I'm sure Project Director Josh would not let him speak falsely in his name. That would be incompetent!

Nuthin' wrong with a nice Baldur's Gate clone. I'm sure it'll have more C&C than Bioware's games, Obsidian do that stuff in their sleep without even trying after all. I just doubt it'll have as much of it as a game that intentionally focuses on it.

 

[Arkeus]

Nuh uh uh, he said "we", not "I". I'm sure Project Director Josh would not let him speak falsely in his name. That would be incompetent!

Nuthin' wrong with a nice Baldur's Gate clone. I'm sure it'll have more C&C than Bioware's games, Obsidian do that stuff in their sleep without even trying after all. I just doubt it'll have as much of it as a game that intentionally focuses on it.

Hard to know though- from what i can see, Obsidian has the best odds of doing good C&C out of all the kickstarter games because of expertise with it as well as tighter development oversight (E.G, i trust Feargus to know how to balance a budget).

Also, while the 'target' is BG, BG itself had its own mini-C&C.

We'll see how it goes, though.

 

[Roguey]

Nuh uh uh, he said "we", not "I". I'm sure Project Director Josh would not let him speak falsely in his name. That would be incompetent!

Josh can't really control what Obsidian co-owner Chris Avellone does or say to the public, much like he couldn't do anything about Feargus Urquhart's misstatements/falsehoods other than say no.

Nuthin' wrong with a nice Baldur's Gate clone. I'm sure it'll have more C&C than Bioware's games, Obsidian do that stuff in their sleep without even trying after all. I just doubt it'll have as much of it as a game that intentionally focuses on it.

But they are focusing on it. It's how Josh defines role playing games. I don't know how you could look at a game that'll have non-combat skills, reputation, and disposition and think "Total Baldur's Gate clone here." Looks more to me that PoE will be to The Black Hound what New Vegas was to Van Buren.

 

[AN4RCHID]

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

So, would you say a button to bypass this unwanted gameplay is acceptable?

My gut reaction would be no, by i can't deny that most AAA RPGs would be better with a skip combat button. So confused...

They wouldn't be better though... Skyrim or Dragon Age without combat would be unending monotony (I mean ever worse than they already). Those games don't have the non-combat content to support a fun no-kills playthrough. Planescape: Torment, Fallout: New Vegas, and small handful of other RPGs do.

 

[Infinitron]

Looks more to me that PoE will be to The Black Hound

Ah, so what you're saying is that Baldur's Gate 3 would ALSO not have been a Baldur's Gate-style game?

Yeah that totally makes sense!

 

[Rake]

The ability to bypass gameplay you don't want to partake in is a strength. If I could have run past 50% of the splicers in Bioshock 1 it would have been a better game.

So, would you say a button to bypass this unwanted gameplay is acceptable?

My gut reaction would be no, by i can't deny that most AAA RPGs would be better with a skip combat button. So confused...

They wouldn't be better though... Skyrim or Dragon Age without combat would be unending monotony (I mean ever worse than they already). Those games don't have the non-combat content to support a fun no-kills playthrough. Planescape: Torment, Fallout: New Vegas, and small handful of other RPGs do.

I didn't say no combat, i said skip combat. Dragon Age:O would be way better and replayable if one could skip half the trash combat in the game. DA2 woulg be better with a skip game button, but that's another matter.
Witcher 2 would be better as well if you could avoid the twichy combat. Skyrim, i don't know. If you skiped combat, there isn't much left to do. The game is a waste of time one way or the other.

 

[Roguey]

Looks more to me that PoE will be to The Black Hound

Ah, so what you're saying is that Baldur's Gate 3 would ALSO not have been a Baldur's Gate-style game?

Yeah that totally makes sense!

You know it was a BG3 in-name only right? Because Interplay only had the rights to make D&D games called Baldur's Gate or Icewind Dale and IWD3 wouldn't do for what they wanted.

Highlights from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baldur's_Gate_III:_The_Black_Hound#Gameplay

As in Fallout 2, no single weapon would have been better than other weapons and each weapon would have had its own traits.
...
Originally, players would have only been able to advance up to level 5. This was later changed to level 8. This was for two reasons: for the player to be able to level up to higher levels in the sequels and for the player to use more strategy. The game was originally planned to have player's focus less on leveling up and more on using their brains to solve problems presented within the video game.
...
The game was said to be truly non-linear, where the player has freedom to visit any location and perform any action they wanted, keeping in mind that there will always be repercussions for the player's actions in the game. Failed/incomplete quests would have had consequences as the game progressed. Unlike previous games, the player was able to switch between alignments depending on the actions in the game. This would have also required the player character to make difficult decisions which could affect his reputation with one group in order to maintain his reputation with another.
...
There would have been several types of reputations in The Black Hound: Regional Reputation, Factional Reputation, Fame/Infamy, and Epithets. The first three all have positive and negative scales. Some characters may only care about positive reputation in an area, others might only care about negative reputation in an organization, and others might try to balance a number of reputations when they speak to the player. Regional Reputation is a positive/negative counter that depends on the actions the character performs in a specific region. Not only will Factional Reputation affect dealings with certain organizations, it will also affect your dealings with the allies and enemies of those organizations. Fame and Infamy would have been awarded to the player character depending on their actions. Their reputation would be displayed in epithets.