Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Grunker]

You just lick the levelling button and see what get.

sounds like AD&D

 

[Shadenuat]

The dance of these last couple of pages

The +1 bonus itself doesn't matter as much to worry about it.

The feat matters like some of the nodes you go through in PoE in your build matters. Or not, depending on your build. It's up to you to make things in your build matter, dood.

We played the game, I went through beta 3+ times, all 4 chapters, with specialists and without, martials and without. Game supported my choices. It has fuckton of kewl weapons (including shit like "if you have feat x, and spend y, then get z"). You can build larp build or ineffectfaggotry. it has epic system that expands on your choices.

 

[Grunker]

Well I suppose the argument to be made is that sure, surface specialisation is kinda boring, giving only +2 attack and 4 damage, but it unlocks additional options like the ability to ignore DR or crit enemies that can't be crit.

The dance of these last couple of pages:

"I think specialization is awkward because it reduces the utility of experimenting with interesting weapon options and brings no benefits."

"No it doesn't, because the feats are so minor they don't matter in the least, and the benefit is to be the fantasy of truly mastering a weapon."

"But if they don't matter, they don't fulfill that fantasy?"

"AHA! BUT THEY DO MATTER!"

I imagine we can spin that roundabout till we're all dead without having completed Wrath of the Righteous

If you really want to start an autism war I suggest you post this question on the pathfinder society discord.

I'm just asking you to pick one: either they matter a lot or they matter a little. Can't be both

 

[fantadomat]

The dance of these last couple of pages

The +1 bonus itself doesn't matter as much to worry about it.

The feat matters like some of the nodes you go through in PoE in your build matters. Or not, depending on your build. It's up to you to make things in your build matter, dood.

We played the game, I went through beta 3+ times, all 4 chapters, with specialists and without, martials and without. Game supported my choices. It has fuckton of kewl weapons. You can build larp build or ineffectfaggotry. it has epic system that expands on your choices.

Well it depends on the build,haven't played this one. But if it is anything like kingmaker's levelling,well it does add up,especially the shield specialization. It is not a critical feat but a mid/late game thing to give a small buff to your build. A bunch of +1 hit/damage does add up.

 

[Sharpedge]

Well I suppose the argument to be made is that sure, surface specialisation is kinda boring, giving only +2 attack and 4 damage, but it unlocks additional options like the ability to ignore DR or crit enemies that can't be crit.

The dance of these last couple of pages:

"I think specialization is awkward because it reduces the utility of experimenting with interesting weapon options and brings no benefits."

"No it doesn't, because the feats are so minor they don't matter in the least, and the benefit is to be the fantasy of truly mastering a weapon."

"But if they don't matter, they don't fulfill that fantasy?"

"AHA! BUT THEY DO MATTER!"

I imagine we can spin that roundabout till we're all dead without having completed Wrath of the Righteous

If you really want to start an autism war I suggest you post this question on the pathfinder society discord.

I'm just asking you to pick one: either they matter a lot or they matter a little. Can't be both

They do not matter in a mechanical sense, they do matter in a flavor sense. If the feat did nothing at all and just stuck a piece of text calling you master of X weapon, the people wanting to larp as that would probably still pick it.

 

[Shadenuat]

Well it depends on the build,haven't played this one. But if it is anything like kingmaker's levelling,well it does add up,especially the shield specialization. It is not a critical feat but a mid/late game thing to give a small buff to your build. A bunch of +1 hit/damage does add up.

It's far superior than Kingmaker, that's the thing. That one had shit itemization for starters, so there, if you picked weapon focus: sling, or whatever, but there are no slings in the game, IT DEFINITELY DIDNT MATTER I SWER ON 7 GRUNKERS. *

*on release

 

[Tacgnol]

Well I suppose the argument to be made is that sure, surface specialisation is kinda boring, giving only +2 attack and 4 damage, but it unlocks additional options like the ability to ignore DR or crit enemies that can't be crit.

The dance of these last couple of pages:

"I think specialization is awkward because it reduces the utility of experimenting with interesting weapon options and brings no benefits."

"No it doesn't, because the feats are so minor they don't matter in the least, and the benefit is to be the fantasy of truly mastering a weapon."

"But if they don't matter, they don't fulfill that fantasy?"

"AHA! BUT THEY DO MATTER!"

I imagine we can spin that roundabout till we're all dead without having completed Wrath of the Righteous

If you really want to start an autism war I suggest you post this question on the pathfinder society discord.

I'm just asking you to pick one: either they matter a lot or they matter a little. Can't be both

Depends on the build.

Martials are my most played character type on the Pathfinder tabletop. If I'm playing a Fighter I'll pick up the weapon focus feat and long feat chains as I have feats to spare and there are some neato feat chains. Fighters can get a lot of mileage out of a lot of the more unusual combat feats.

If I'm playing a Barbarian, I rarely pick up a significant amount of feats as all my feats get turned into extra rage powers. I usually only take Power Attack, Furious Focus and Raging Brutality.

That said, as I've mentioned earlier in the thread. Regardless of martial, I pretty much always choose one weapon at the end of the first book and will stick to that as a primary weapon for the rest of the books in the AP.

I've never really done the whole "weapon magpie" thing.

Edit: And Raging Vitality on Barbarians. No one likes sudden barbarian death syndrome.

 

[Grunker]

Well I suppose the argument to be made is that sure, surface specialisation is kinda boring, giving only +2 attack and 4 damage, but it unlocks additional options like the ability to ignore DR or crit enemies that can't be crit.

The dance of these last couple of pages:

"I think specialization is awkward because it reduces the utility of experimenting with interesting weapon options and brings no benefits."

"No it doesn't, because the feats are so minor they don't matter in the least, and the benefit is to be the fantasy of truly mastering a weapon."

"But if they don't matter, they don't fulfill that fantasy?"

"AHA! BUT THEY DO MATTER!"

I imagine we can spin that roundabout till we're all dead without having completed Wrath of the Righteous

If you really want to start an autism war I suggest you post this question on the pathfinder society discord.

I'm just asking you to pick one: either they matter a lot or they matter a little. Can't be both

They do not matter in a mechanical sense, they do matter in a flavor sense. If the feat did nothing at all and just stuck a piece of text calling you master of X weapon, the people wanting to larp as that would probably still pick it.

Strong design enforces flavour with mechanics. It's why Gone Home is a shit game. So if you want to make people feel like they've truly mastered a weapon, a bad way to do that is through insignificant mechanics.

Regardless, I think you disagree with Tacgnol, or rather you are talking about different versions of the game. Tacgnol was talking about P&P, in which many of the WF-feats are excellent (as opposed to WotR).

If I'm playing a Fighter I'll pick up the weapon focus feat and long feat chains as I have feats to spare and there are some neato feat chains. Fighters can get a lot of mileage out of a lot of the more unusual combat feats.

Indeed, and so if that is the case, my argument against specialization cannot be dismissed by claiming that WF as a feat chain don't matter.

 

[Tacgnol]

Tacgnol was talking about P&P, in which many of the WF-feats are excellent (as opposed to WotR)

This is actually a good point, I often get annoyed at how many good feats don't get implemented. Many of them got implemented into Kingmaker via the Call of the Wild mod.

It does seem to be a little bit better with Wrath in terms of the feats they've put in.

Out of interest, have they implemented furious focus natively this time around?

 

[fantadomat]

Well it depends on the build,haven't played this one. But if it is anything like kingmaker's levelling,well it does add up,especially the shield specialization. It is not a critical feat but a mid/late game thing to give a small buff to your build. A bunch of +1 hit/damage does add up.

It's far superior than Kingmaker, that's the thing. That one had shit itemization for starters, so there, if you picked weapon focus: sling, or whatever, but there are no slings in the game, IT DEFINITELY DIDNT MATTER I SWER ON 7 GRUNKERS. *

*on release

Yeah but if you are that retarded to pick that shit,you kind of deserve it. There is fucking rpg that caters to all the retarded weapons. You go for the basic 10-15 weapons and ignore the rest. Only retards go for shitty weapons like sling staffs or sai,they deserve punishment.

Also that is way i say that it is a mid game feat,you pick it once you had tested the waters and know which weapons are good for your build. That is why it is called a fucking build,if you are a dipshit your build will suck lol,same as life. We don't exist in a world where everyone have the same cognitive abilities,there is plenty retards.

 

[Grunker]

That one had shit itemization for starters

my god, man. do you want to wake the dragon

 

[Sharpedge]

Strong design enforces flavour with mechanics. It's why Gone Home is a shit game. So if you want to make people feel like they've truly mastered a weapon, a bad way to do that is through insignificant mechanics.

Regardless, I think you disagree with Tacgnol, or rather you are talking about different versions of the game. Tacgnol was talking about P&P, in which many of the WF-feats are excellent (as opposed to WotR).

I agree that it would be better if specializations did matter and were interesting, but I don't see owlcat suddenly redesigning all the weapon focus feats.

 

[Shadenuat]

That one had shit itemization for starters

my god, man. do you want to wake the dragon

He knows my opinion on itemization in PK and knows Wrath is superior in that aspect (but not ideal, as I stated during beta; Owlcats desire to add every idiotic exotic and such into 1 game is a big problem, and would be a problem, for any RPG)

 

[fantadomat]

Strong design enforces flavour with mechanics. It's why Gone Home is a shit game. So if you want to make people feel like they've truly mastered a weapon, a bad way to do that is through insignificant mechanics.

Regardless, I think you disagree with Tacgnol, or rather you are talking about different versions of the game. Tacgnol was talking about P&P, in which many of the WF-feats are excellent (as opposed to WotR).

I agree that it would be better if specializations did matter and were interesting, but I don't see owlcat suddenly redesigning all the weapon focus feats.

Specialization is not bad as it is lol. It could be made better for sure tho.

 

[Grunker]

That one had shit itemization for starters

my god, man. do you want to wake the dragon

He knows my opinion on itemization in PK and knows Wrath is superior in that aspect (but not ideal, as I stated during beta)

I was kidding. I completely agree with you. Though "shit" might be just a tad harsh

 

[Grunker]

This is actually a good point, I often get annoyed at how many good feats don't get implemented.

I have many qualms about Owlcat's specific approach, but complaining about lack of rules implementation in these games seems a mite unrealistic considering how much shit they've implemented

(I too missed proper tripping though :'( )

 

[Shadenuat]

When game has dragon but you can't make armor of it scales it's shit

 

[fantadomat]

When game has dragon but you can't make armor of it scales it's shit

I hope that there is no equivalent to the retarded craftsmen quests from kingmaker.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I hope that there is no equivalent to the retarded craftsmen quests from kingmaker.

I hope there are. Best small quests in the game.

 

[Infinitron]

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[Shadenuat]

I hope that there is no equivalent to the retarded craftsmen quests from kingmaker.

has crusades. those are even worse.

 

[NJClaw]

I hope that there is no equivalent to the retarded craftsmen quests from kingmaker.

I hope there are. Best small quests in the game.

The artisans' quests are an insult to the human intellect. The fact that the rewards are amazing doesn't excuse their pathetic design and abysmal writing. A couple of them are somewhat interesting, but the vast majority are bland, poorly written, and are characterized by an inexplicable gap between what happens and how your character can react through dialogue options. They really stand out as the worst content in the entire game, right next to Deal with the Devil.

 

[LannTheStupid]

The artisans' quests are an insult to the human intellect. The fact that the rewards are amazing doesn't excuse their pathetic design and abysmal writing.

Jedem das Seine.

I consider traveling with Mim to Talon Peak one of the best small side quests in RPG. It is quite small and very touching - if you take effort to learn the gnome's lore. She is desperate to delay the inevitable, and it is shown quite well.

 

[Salvo]

The artisans' quests are an insult to the human intellect. The fact that the rewards are amazing doesn't excuse their pathetic design and abysmal writing.

Jedem das Seine.

I consider traveling with Mim to Talon Peak one of the best small side quests in RPG. It is quite small and very touching - if you take effort to learn the gnome's lore. She is desperate to delay the inevitable, and it is shown quite well.

Then there's the cursed smith quest

 

[LannTheStupid]

And I was so glad to let this elven-lizard humanist to die. Whatever clothes he could have made.