Pathfinder Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[ERYFKRAD]

finally enjoy yourself

Yeah right.

 

[volklore]

I have been testing out unfair a little a bit and some of the scrolls you can buy at the vendor in the tavern are pretty sick, it woke up some swordflight degen consumable stacking instincts in me. Sadly, you can't really use the great ones with UMD (checks are too high - 30 ich DC) but if you come from a class that has it in their spell list, they can cast it without a check. Magus, alchemist, sorcerer and wizard can use the polymorph and dragonkind scrolls (+4 form natural armor, +4 str, some con and fire resist) to either turn themselves or a pet/companion into a dragon for 15 ish minutes (and get a 1 time breath weapon that pretty much wipes out one encounter). With that (+a bunch of potions and low level scrolls), I was able to solo most of the easier market square fights on sylvan sorc, magus and vivisectionist, with very minimal reloads (the odd natural 20 from those barb enemies). Sylvan sorc was the easiest as I would just turn the pet to a dragon, buff it with potions and scroll and cast grease for CC.

You actually don't need to kill that much in the market square to get to the quest objectives and get a good exp headstart before you recruit companions. With 3 of those scrolls you can solo the market square quests, nenio encounter, and tower of Estrod and skip the tavern defense.

 

[Technomancer]

Magus, alchemist, sorcerer and wizard can use the polymorph and dragonkind scrolls

Can use a brown fur merc instead. On lvl 20 they even get an extra bonus for polymorph stats.

 

[Daidre]

You actually don't need to kill that much in the market square to get to the quest objectives and get a good exp headstart before you recruit companions. With 3 of those scrolls you can solo the market square quests, nenio encounter, and tower of Estrod and skip the tavern defense.

Or you could solo tavern defence too and get even more xp. And then solo market mini boss for 1800 xp + ghouls.

 

[volklore]

You actually don't need to kill that much in the market square to get to the quest objectives and get a good exp headstart before you recruit companions. With 3 of those scrolls you can solo the market square quests, nenio encounter, and tower of Estrod and skip the tavern defense.

Or you could solo tavern defence too and get even more xp. And then solo market mini boss for 1800 xp + ghouls.

Can you though? I remember tavern defense being pretty hard on hard already and some of the fights in the market were still borderline impossible (There was a few mobs spamming mass inflict wounds that I could only do on the sylvan for CC). The magus/vivi would require too many reloads. Granted I haven't looked through all of the scrolls yet.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Now I see how deftly Owlcat Games dealt with alignment restrictions.

Spoiler

To open the Azata path the player needs to save, first, the Desnan priest, and then 3 of his miscreants. To do this it is mandatory to make two choices of an Angel and one good choice. Anything else - and Azata path is unavailable for the whole playthrough (as I understand).

Considering that alignment shifts are more significant in Wrath than in Kingmaker, I understand how the player is forced to make decisions that align him with the chosen path. And it is all done without Kingmaker prompts "[Requires Lawful]", which are justifiable, but could be irritating for some.

 

[Daidre]

Can you though? I remember tavern defense being pretty hard, some of the fights in the market were still borderline impossible (There was a few mobs spamming mass inflict wounds that I could only do on the sylvan for CC). The magus/vivi would require too many reloads. Granted I haven't looked through all of the scrolls yet.

I did it on Hard, not on Unfair, so it will be a quite dicier there I guess. I had the least amount of problems with Mounted Sohei bowman who had 4 attacks at this point and could kite almost anything from the horseback, only thing required is enough space. There is nice generic +3 composite longbow looted from the filthy drow that helps to hit through DR. So, imho, that build with the scroll use (anyone could get it as class skill with Scholar background) is the prime Unfair material.
My favorite scrolls are Summon Elemental, 5 and 6 lvl version for 1125 and 1650gp. Animate Dead and anything with difficult terrains helps too (and guaranteed damage on top of it) for easier encounters.

Dragon transformations turned out really disappointing for me - hitting through DR with dragon's natural attacks is pain.

One thing I can't imagine how to reliably solo on Unfair is probably final Gray Garrison fight - the second Minagho hits you with 35+ DC Phantasmal Putrification, I suppose anyone is dead.

 

[Sharpedge]

You actually don't need to kill that much in the market square to get to the quest objectives and get a good exp headstart before you recruit companions. With 3 of those scrolls you can solo the market square quests, nenio encounter, and tower of Estrod and skip the tavern defense.

Or you could solo tavern defence too and get even more xp. And then solo market mini boss for 1800 xp + ghouls.

Can you though? I remember tavern defense being pretty hard on hard already and some of the fights in the market were still borderline impossible (There was a few mobs spamming mass inflict wounds that I could only do on the sylvan for CC). The magus/vivi would require too many reloads. Granted I haven't looked through all of the scrolls yet.

Buy 2 cloudkill scrolls, drop them on the 2 main choke points and then sit around and wait. That more or less clears the encounter. This was how I did it solo on unfair.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Also, this reminds me of InEffect guides:

Spoiler

"You need a spellcaster in the party!"

And Wenduag seems to have a thing for aasimars - sexual, culinary, or both.

 

[Sharpedge]

Can you though? I remember tavern defense being pretty hard, some of the fights in the market were still borderline impossible (There was a few mobs spamming mass inflict wounds that I could only do on the sylvan for CC). The magus/vivi would require too many reloads. Granted I haven't looked through all of the scrolls yet.

I did it on Hard, not on Unfair, so it will be a quite dicier there I guess. I had the least amount of problems with Mounted Sohei bowman who had 4 attacks at this point and could kite almost anything from the horseback, only thing required is enough space. There is nice generic +3 composite longbow looted from the filthy drow that helps to hit through DR. So, imho, that build with the scroll use (anyone could get it as class skill with Scholar background) is the prime Unfair material.
My favorite scrolls are Summon Elemental, 5 and 6 lvl version for 1125 and 1650gp. Animate Dead and anything with difficult terrains helps too (and guaranteed damage on top of it) for easier encounters.

Dragon transformations turned out really disappointing for me - hitting through DR with dragon's natural attacks is pain.

One thing I can't imagine how to reliably solo on Unfair is probably final Gray Garrison fight - the second Minagho hits you with 35+ DC Phantasmal Petrification, I suppose anyone is dead.

Its really easy actually. The transformation you get given from Areelu during that fight makes enemies automatically roll a 1 on saves against any of your spells. Casting Phantasmal killer on her auto wins the fight. CC spells like grease also more or less auto win the fight.

 

[volklore]

Dragon transformations turned out really disappointing for me - hitting through DR with dragon's natural attacks is pain.

One thing I can't imagine how to reliably solo on Unfair is probably final Gray Garrison fight - the second Minagho hits you with 35+ DC Phantasmal Petrification, I suppose anyone is dead.

I only tested market fights, nenio and estrod since I went for a tavern defense skip strat. Do you get that much more xp/gold for doing the defense ? I guess the miniboss does tip the scales. Ofc I couldn't kill the ghosties since I did not have magical fang. But apart from that everything was okay. There isn't that many hard fights involving demons (except those pesky inflict wound spammers) on the market and the estrod fight is pretty easy by sticking to the right ledge as choke point to fight them 1 by 1. No doubt I'll have to use different things for fights involving more demons.
Tbh Idk If I wanna go solo all the way to lost chappel, maybe just enough for an exp bump before recruiting ember, daeran, nenio, woljiff etc...

 

[Sharpedge]

Dragon transformations turned out really disappointing for me - hitting through DR with dragon's natural attacks is pain.

One thing I can't imagine how to reliably solo on Unfair is probably final Gray Garrison fight - the second Minagho hits you with 35+ DC Phantasmal Petrification, I suppose anyone is dead.

I only tested market fights, nenio and estrod since I went for a tavern defense skip strat. Do you get that much more xp/gold for doing the defense ? I guess the miniboss does tip the scales. Ofc I couldn't kill the ghosties since I did not have magical fang. But apart from that everything was okay. There isn't that many hard fights involving demons (except those pesky inflict wound spammers) on the market and the estrod fight is pretty easy by sticking to the right ledge as choke point to fight them 1 by 1. No doubt I'll have to use different things for fights involving more demons.
Tbh Idk If I wanna go solo all the way to lost chappel, maybe just enough for an exp bump before recruiting ember, daeran, nenio, woljiff etc...

Depending on how you plan on routing through, the difficulty can vary a lot. The route I usually go for is Woljif's quest -> Tower of Estrod -> Silken Thread Atelier -> Rest at Tavern -> Market District (There will be 1 or 2 rests here) -> Save Daerun (you will temporarily Acquire Nenio and Daerun here, the main reason to do this is to complete the azata quest) -> Travel back to Tavern -> ditch companions and then turn in quests. If you still have enough time after this to do some more clearing, I go Topaz Solutions -> Tirabade Residence -> Pitaxian Wine Celler and then Storyteller. This is hardly ever the case however and usually I just go to the storyteller followed by the tavern defense. Tavern Defense gives significantly more XP than not doing Tavern Defense so its something I never skip.

Hardest fight in my opinion on early game unfair is the fight where you save Daerun. There is very limited space to maneuver and you have to deal with the Schir. I usually unload the midnight bolt on the Schir here. Most of these early fights are won using consumables, the guy who sells scrolls has a solution to every encounter.

 

[Daidre]

I only tested market fights, nenio and estrod since I went for a tavern defense skip strat. Do you get that much more xp/gold for doing the defense ? I guess the miniboss does tip the scales.

Iirc, tavern defense + miniboss + extra trash that spawns on the market is about 10k xp.

My first act solo route is usually (on Hard)
- Market, everything but Ember
- Silken Thread Atelier
- Tower of Estrod
- Woljif's quest, recruiting him with 45k xp, lvl 7. First rest
- Pitaxian Wine Cellar
- Daeran recruiting, hitting lvl 8 here
- Desnan quest
- Library, often no combat here
- Gwerm Mansion, duo with Camelia, second rest around here
- Topaz Solutions + Tirabade Residence, tavern defense triggers
- second Market clear, several new packs of trash + mini boss
- recruiting Ember, hitting lvl 9
After it I usually drop soloing and go trio with Daeran + Woljif + martial PC until White chapel, and go with full party after Chapel. Everyone at lvl 11.

Edit: But I had not tried to do it with Sorc/Wiz yet. My dream build is illusion focused Silvan Sorc with Second Bloodline Arcane, but somethings is always broken in some part of that one(

 

[volklore]

Pretty sure they fixed second bloodline for sylvan sorcerer in this patch. I had to resepec my sorc hard playthrough (from sylvan to arcane) after I noticed to the bug in the previous version but with the new patch it should be working properly. Emphasis on should :D

 

[Daidre]

Pretty sure they fixed second bloodline for sylvan sorcerer in this patch. I had to resepec my sorc hard playthrough after I noticed to the bugin the previous version but with the new patch it should be working properly. Emphasis on should

But now all the Shadow line is broken!
I could live with lower DC on the Shadow Conjuration, I could live with shitty Athletics check on Ice Prison, but half of the idea was extending Spell list with Shadow Evocation/Conjuration. But they just do not work(
Sorry...
I have everything - pretty portrait, backstory, excel file with build for that one char... But I can't play her and I am sad.

 

[volklore]

I am sad for you, because owlcat properly fixing shadow spells would be as impressing as them fixing crane wing - at least they look like they are trying so... maybe ?
I have made my peace and accepted that shadow spells don't exist since my first caster playthrough in KM. So in wrath I just conjuration early and expand to illusion at M2. Now with these degen solo strats that's actually a bit too slow though

 

[LannTheStupid]

I am sad for you, because owlcat properly fixing shadow spells would be as impressing as them fixing crane wing - at least they look like they are trying so... maybe ?

If horses can crane wing, then something in the second hand of a humanoid should not be an obstacle. I consider it "Owlcat Games house rule."

I have everything - pretty portrait, backstory, excel file with build for that one char... But I can't play her and I am sad.

Wouldn't your main be a duplicate of Nenio, but without her story?

 

[Daidre]

I am sad for you, because owlcat properly fixing shadow spells would be as impressing as them fixing crane wing - at least they look like they are trying so... maybe ?

Well, maybe Nenio's presence in the game will work to my advantage and this bug will get enough publicity for Owlcat to fix it faster.
Beside, they have already fixed 2 biggest issues with my dream sorc - Second Bloodline availability, as you mentioned, and missing CL on Loremaster 1. Now, I only need them to fix Shadow line. Well, adding missing Wizard/Cleric/Druid spell to Loremaster would be great too but that's too optimistic.

Wouldn't your main be a duplicate of Nenio, but without her story?

I hate Nenio. And beside, that taxidermist's nightmare could never compare to the glory of my radiant Azata with Favorable + Zippy Magic.

 

[LannTheStupid]

I hate Nenio.

Do you like Ember?

 

[LannTheStupid]

"Check!" (C) Nenio.

I love Nenio even after short time in Chapter 1.

 

[Daidre]

I love Nenio even after short time in Chapter 1.

I would be ok with Nenio in some "Tales of..." JRPG. But in Wrath, I hated her from the moment I've seen her portrait - even such a small thing is already clashing with the artstyle. And the dialogue is not much better. Only piece I really liked:

Spoiler

Btw, I have some minor issues with Ember later story development too though, and some major issues with her spellbook, so she also loses her party place after ch 2.

 

[volklore]

So, imho, that build with the scroll use (anyone could get it as class skill with Scholar background) is the prime Unfair material.

This one I did not get. Can this background cast scrolls without a UMD check?

 

[Sharpedge]

My experience solo has probably been very different to Daidre since I have almost exclusively been playing casters. I definitely needed to rest more as a result, but I suspect that in grey garrison (and after act 1) I probably had an easier time as a result of this.

 

[Daidre]

This one I did not get. Can this background cast scrolls without a UMD check?

No, but it helps to get to 6-10 UMD mark (not many classes had got it as a class skill), so character is able to cast DC 25-28 scrolls at least out of combat after some failures. Big thing for some of my martial chars who does not have their own spellbook and always need UMD check for scrolls.

 

[volklore]

This one I did not get. Can this background cast scrolls without a UMD check?

No, but it helps to get to 6-10 UMD mark (not many classes had got it as a class skill), so character is able to cast DC 25-28 scrolls at least out of combat after some failures. Big thing for some of my martial chars who does not have their own spellbook and always need UMD check for scrolls.

Ah I see. So it's not a bug that scrolls don't disappear when used from inventory after failing the UMD checks. Not sure i'd have the patience to wait for a success.