Interview Pete Hines on Fallout 3

[kris]

From dictionary.com:

Guild

- An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards.
- A similar association, as of merchants or artisans, in medieval times.

Faction

- A group of persons forming a cohesive, usually contentious minority within a larger group.
- Conflict within an organization or nation; internal dissension: “Our own beloved country... is now afflicted with faction and civil war” (Abraham Lincoln).
- n 1: a clique (often secret) that seeks power usually through intrigue [syn: cabal, junto, camarilla] 2: a dissenting clique [syn: sect]

i would have to agree with Bruce.

 

[kingcomrade]

Wow! Dikshunary definitions FTW!!

No. You don't seem to comprehend the difference between a fluff organization and a guild in TES games. The central purpose of the guilds in TES was to give you quests. The central purpose of the BOS, was to enhance the setting. You could get quests from individual brothers, of course, but all of the Quests that the Elders give you are plot-based.

Unless you are going to tell me that The Hub, Vault 13, etc. are all guilds in Fallout?

 

[aweigh]

I cast Magic Missile and attack the darkness!

 

[bryce777]

Wow! Dikshunary definitions FTW!!

No. You don't seem to comprehend the difference between a fluff organization and a guild in TES games. The central purpose of the guilds in TES was to give you quests. The central purpose of the BOS, was to enhance the setting. You could get quests from individual brothers, of course, but all of the Quests that the Elders give you are plot-based.

Unless you are going to tell me that The Hub, Vault 13, etc. are all guilds in Fallout?

Well, I am not talking about tes per se. In daggerfall the guilds were generic and the quests were, but it was procedurally generated which was nice.

I just find it riduculous in so many games every city has a thieves' guild, a mage's guild etc. etc. where you train up, buy things, maybe get quests blah blah. It makes even less sense in the fallout world than other places.

There is no brotherhood of steel profession, though. Calling it a guild is just bizarre crazy talk that I can't even comprehend. Like you said it would be like saying the mutants are a guild. Also the purpose they serve is mostly to advance the plot - one common theme is guilds NEVER advance the plot. Oh, they have a level 2 million wizard on call 24/7 to train you, but they have never even heard of the evil whatsit plaguing the land.

 

[Drakron]

BOS was a closed organization devoted to recover of pre-war technology.

Its was not something open to everyone (except in Tactics but the east branch became rather diferent that the original organization) and not having the type of "services" as TES guilds have.

 

[kingcomrade]

BOS in Fallout Tactics WAS a guild of the sort we're talking about, thank you for reminding me.

 

[Noviere]

Titter

 

[Killzig]

you're defining "guilds" as morrowind's use of them. (IE if they're not obvious and feel like completely manufactured quest mills -- its not a guild) that's a design issue. Like I said, as far as the game world is concerned, THE BOS IS A GUILD.

"- An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards."

Thanks Kris.

You could also say the Rangers, the Followers of the Apocalypsewere all guilds in the FO world, too. Just because Tim Cain & Co. didn't design the game so that you could go to Cabot and say "I Killed Foozle and brought you teh skroll. Plz give me new quest." Doesn't mean they weren't.

 

[Killzig]

There is no brotherhood of steel profession, though. Calling it a guild is just bizarre crazy talk that I can't even comprehend.

Just because you can't comprehend it doesn't make it untrue. It just makes you an idiot.

Like you said it would be like saying the mutants are a guild.

No its not. You could call the mutant army a guild of sorts. But they had human collaborators, in case you forgot, and not all mutants in the FO world were part of it by FO2.

Also the purpose they serve is mostly to advance the plot - one common theme is guilds NEVER advance the plot. Oh, they have a level 2 million wizard on call 24/7 to train you, but they have never even heard of the evil whatsit plaguing the land.

That's a design issue and that's why guilds in Morrowind are so fucking boring. Had Timmy C and company had the technical means/expertise/inclination to make the BOS and other in game world groups more organic and "playable" (as seems to be your determining factor for "guilds") they probably would have. You did have a few quests for the BOS. You did become an initiate. In FO2 you got yourself a ranger badge. etc.

I don't see why you're having such a hard time comprehending. You need to break the association of GUILD = FANTASY and evaluate the word for what it is.

 

[kingcomrade]

Killzig, you're hardly one to accuse others of incomprehension. It doesn't matter what guilds really are in the real world because we aren't talking about literal guilds, we're talking about guilds as a game mechanic in the way of Morrowind.

"- An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards."

Like I said to the tard before, "OMG DIKSHUNARY DEFINISHINS FTW." The literal definition isn't relevant because that's not what we're talking about, it's a genre moniker for a game mechanic.
You might want to look up Non-Sequitur

 

[Killzig]

Killzig, you're hardly one to accuse others of incomprehension. It doesn't matter what guilds really are in the real world because we aren't talking about literal guilds, we're talking about guilds as a game mechanic in the way of Morrowind.

"- An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards."

Like I said to the tard before, "OMG DIKSHUNARY DEFINISHINS FTW." The literal definition isn't relevant because that's not what we're talking about, it's a genre moniker for a game mechanic.
You might want to look up Non-Sequitur

I know what it is. But by limiting yourself to it as a game mechanic and defining the game mechanic so rigidly you're throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Why can't guilds be used to both add atmosphere as in Fallout AND let players participate in their functions and give them a sense of accomplishment and belonging by raising them in rank/rewarding them for participating? Is that really THAT difficult to understand? I think the bottom line is this, the problem with BethSoft is that they define guild as rigidly as you and Bryce do thus in the end we're left with uninspiring results.

 

[kingcomrade]

I never said they couldn't. "guilds" as in associations are in pretty much every single game ever. But we are talking about Bethesda Softworks and their game TES5: Fallout. Of course the bottom line is BethSoft, that's what we've been talking about the whole time, dipstick.

 

[Stella Brando]

Don't you mean TES5: Fallout 3 ?

 

[kingcomrade]

That's it, you aren't getting any tonight.

 

[Stella Brando]

Anyone is "ripe for the picking" when they're face down and asleep.

 

[kingcomrade]

Not with AnusGuard<tm> you filthy buttfucker.

 

[Stella Brando]

That aint your only hole, pumpkin.

 

[Killzig]

so you two fags are just going back and stating the obvious between each other. That's great. Let me know next time you want to chase your tails for a couple of hours so that I'm not mistakenly thinking that I'm joining a "discussion" ..

 

[mrhappy1991]

<b>Pete Hines</b>, We're trying to move the series forward,

sounds familiar

 

[TruthDecay]

Okay, can anybody explain the recent rash of thread necromancy that is ruining my lurking experience?

 

[bryce777]

There is no brotherhood of steel profession, though. Calling it a guild is just bizarre crazy talk that I can't even comprehend.

Just because you can't comprehend it doesn't make it untrue. It just makes you an idiot.

Like you said it would be like saying the mutants are a guild.

No its not. You could call the mutant army a guild of sorts. But they had human collaborators, in case you forgot, and not all mutants in the FO world were part of it by FO2.

Also the purpose they serve is mostly to advance the plot - one common theme is guilds NEVER advance the plot. Oh, they have a level 2 million wizard on call 24/7 to train you, but they have never even heard of the evil whatsit plaguing the land.

That's a design issue and that's why guilds in Morrowind are so fucking boring. Had Timmy C and company had the technical means/expertise/inclination to make the BOS and other in game world groups more organic and "playable" (as seems to be your determining factor for "guilds") they probably would have. You did have a few quests for the BOS. You did become an initiate. In FO2 you got yourself a ranger badge. etc.

I don't see why you're having such a hard time comprehending. You need to break the association of GUILD = FANTASY and evaluate the word for what it is.

The word itself has nothing to do with what you are saying. You are making no sense at all.

 

[bryce777]

Killzig, you're hardly one to accuse others of incomprehension. It doesn't matter what guilds really are in the real world because we aren't talking about literal guilds, we're talking about guilds as a game mechanic in the way of Morrowind.

"- An association of persons of the same trade or pursuits, formed to protect mutual interests and maintain standards."

Like I said to the tard before, "OMG DIKSHUNARY DEFINISHINS FTW." The literal definition isn't relevant because that's not what we're talking about, it's a genre moniker for a game mechanic.
You might want to look up Non-Sequitur

You have decided to use morrowind, not everyone else. reason 2 million and 22 you are an idiot.

 

[kingcomrade]

You reply to a post I made 5 months ago and I'm the idiot?

 

[bryce777]

You reply to a post I made 5 months ago and I'm the idiot?

I didn't see it til now, but I'd hate to miss an opportunity to point out this fact.