Religion in CRPGs

[Shagnak]

Seriously though, Proverbius is right. AIDS is a completely preventable disease. AIDS is a choice.

Not much of a choice for those poor African virgins who get it from being raped by uneducated males who think it's a cure.
Some sex education may be of benefit.

 

[Human Shield]

They can't help it, we need the government to keep these animals in control! They also can't eat right, they smoke and drink, they are dumb. The almighty state will save us all, lets start more programs!

People in the past knew how to keep their pants on and use their own bodies. The state degrades the idea of personality responsibility at its core, and that is root of most problems.

Have the kid and work in a coal mine to feed it if you have to, rights come with responsibility and failing in a responsibility makes you libel.

 

[kingcomrade]

So the rapists are going to stop and put on condoms?

In case you missed the point of my post, which you did, education IS what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people not being retards, having self-restraint.

 

[Human Shield]

Seriously though, Proverbius is right. AIDS is a completely preventable disease. AIDS is a choice.

Not much of a choice for those poor African virgins who get it from being raped by uneducated males who think it's a cure.
Some sex education may be of benefit.

Some handguns for African virgins would be a greater benefit.

 

[TheGreatGodPan]

I don't understand how anyone can be so fucking idiotic as to think that pre-marital sex and/or adultery are better than condoms. It's like killing someone and eating them, but being sure not to do it on Friday.

Since when is the Catholic church a big mover and shaker in Africa? The Dutch and English both had a large presence there (and still sort of do in South Africa but not as big as before), and they're both mostly Protestant. Belgium had an area, and I think they're Protestant too (not sure though). Germany is part Catholic, but I don't think they're big on missions and evangelism. The French were in North Africa, but anti-clericalism is practically the dominant religion there and their former subjects are pretty mostly Muslim now. Portugal was in Angola, but that went communist. If the church was being blamed for AIDS in latin America, I'd think it was stupid, but could see how someone could come to that conclusion. But when the Church has so little influence on the behavior of Americans, who live in a country where Christianity doesn't really have much serious competition, I doubt they play a big part in Africa. If anything, it's the old culture of polygamy in Africa should bear the blame.

 

[kingcomrade]

but tehre fundamentalist an bad didnt u no white amerikkkan kkkristians r 2 blame 4 evrathing?

 

[Shagnak]

So the rapists are going to stop and put on condoms?

Nope. Where did I say that? I'm not talking about condoms. I'm commenting specifically about the "choice" factor here...(see below)

In case you missed the point of my post, which you did, education IS what I'm talking about. I'm talking about people not being retards, having self-restraint.

No, there is no indication of you using the word "educating" in your post, so I was just bringing in this angle. You were talking about people essentially being "sensible" by our ideals, as though they were already educated in that way.
In some tribal areas it doesn't matter if they are more "discerning" or whether "it's not hard to not have sex with someone", the ignorance is so rife. Part of their idea of a cure is even to fuck a virgin, not realising that they are increasing the problem.
The rape victims aren't making the choice about having sex. They have no control over the others' self-restraint. Not only is rape seen by some of the more ignorant tribals as a cure, but it is also used as a common punishment.

 

[kingcomrade]

I must've confused being intelligent with being educated. My mistake.

So, how are we going to blame the evil Christians if African ignorance is to blame?

I know! It's because Americans aren't paying for African sex educa...wait...let me think of something else. (not addressed at you, Shagnak)

 

[Sarvis]

People in the past knew how to keep their pants on and use their own bodies. The state degrades the idea of personality responsibility at its core, and that is root of most problems.

ROFL!

Yeah, people NEVER had premarital sex before the "modern age."

The term "bastard" has been around for a long, long, LONG time. Even our oldest legends often contain tales of adultery.

The world you are thinking of, where everyone was pure and responsible, NEVER FUCKING EXISTED.

It's a pipe dream to think that it did or can.

 

[Human Shield]

ROFL!

Yeah, people NEVER had premarital sex before the "modern age."

The term "bastard" has been around for a long, long, LONG time. Even our oldest legends often contain tales of adultery.

The world you are thinking of, where everyone was pure and responsible, NEVER FUCKING EXISTED.

It's a pipe dream to think that it did or can.

Good job failing to realize the difference. Mothers took responsibility for bastard kids, and it carried social consequences for the father if it got out (if you weren't a government agent like the King). Mistresses were around and prostitutes had kids, but I don't remember hearing of rampant one-night stands. Guys usually stayed with one mistress for long periods of time.

 

[Sarvis]

Good job failing to realize the difference. Mothers took responsibility for bastard kids, and it carried social consequences for the father if it got out (if you weren't a government agent like the King).

Taking responsibility for a bastard kid is a long, LONG way from contracting a fatal disease because the only educators in the region neglected to tell you abount condoms. The only point here is that abstinence before marriage has been preached for centuries and NEVER WORKED.

...prostitutes... but I don't remember hearing of rampant one-night stands.

Uh-huh.

So exactly how do you thing prostitutes work then?

 

[Human Shield]

Taking responsibility for a bastard kid is a long, LONG way from contracting a fatal disease because the only educators in the region neglected to tell you abount condoms. The only point here is that abstinence before marriage has been preached for centuries and NEVER WORKED.

So they know they are going to die and do it anyways? Are they asking to buy condoms? Why don't the "evil condom corporations" go "exploit" them and tell them about condoms?

Why do kids in America do it while knowing the dangers? Lack of long-term time value I believe is amplified by the state.

So exactly how do you thing prostitutes work then?

They have their own business rules and there is a cost involved. If they are running it as a business they have a goal to keep their asset (body) producing as long as possible.

 

[Sarvis]

So they know they are going to die and do it anyways? Are they asking to buy condoms?

Do they know any better, or is the only message they get the Church Approved "Sex is a sin, wait until yo uget married" message? Do they know condoms exist? They don't have trojan ads on tv, or even an education system capable of producing literate adults for the most part.

Why don't the "evil condom corporations" go "exploit" them and tell them about condoms?

Aside from the fact that they have no money? These are POVERTY STRICKEN areas first of all. Second, or maybe actually first, they are poverty stricken because of warlords and tribal violence making it hard to get goods to people. The church does most of the work distributing food and medication in south africa, and if they don't want them to have condoms they won't have condoms.

Why do kids in America do it while knowing the dangers? Lack of long-term time value I believe is amplified by the state.

sorry, try again. STD's are more prevalent in abstinence only religious areas than in evil liberal sex education areas. Those teens who are taught about STDs and how they are actually transmitted actually avoid sex longer due to their knowledge, and when they do have sex they use condoms for protection.

Kids in America who do it mostly <i>don't know</i> the dangers because they only get the same Church Approved message the Africans get.

They have their own business rules and there is a cost involved. If they are running it as a business they have a goal to keep their asset (body) producing as long as possible.

That wasn't the point. You said there weren't one night stands "back then" but that there were prostitutes. One night stands is pretty much what prostitution MEANS.

 

[kingcomrade]

So...
The kids who get the "don't abstain" message abstain, but the kids who get the "abstain" message don't? Religious areas? I'm in Texas, in the county with the highest teen pregnancy rate in the state. Back in high school (and jr high) the sex ed people (who go around to all the schools in the district) certainly educated us about diseases, graphic slides and all, and they weren't preaching abstinence. The only thing she told us to abstain from was anal sex.
So I'm curious how your paradigm fits.

Anyways, you don't have to be religious to think that promiscuous sex is dangerous.

 

[Sarvis]

So...
The kids who get the "don't abstain" message abstain,

That statement alone makes me question how good your sex ed class was! Most sex ed programs are taught from a standpoint of "you shouldn't do this, but if you do here are the risks and the measures you can use to mitigate those risks."

but the kids who get the "abstain" message don't? Religious areas? I'm in Texas, in the county with the highest teen pregnancy rate in the state. Back in high school (and jr high) the sex ed people certainly educated us about diseases, graphic slides and all, and the lady wasn't preaching abstinence. The only thing she told us to abstain from was anal sex.
So I'm curious how your paradigm fits.

Anyways, you don't have to be religious to think that promiscuous sex is dangerous.

I'm tired of digging for statistics tonight, sorry. Look them up yourself, they are fairly well known.

Texas is certianly a red state, which means republican which means a lot of religious people... so I guess the question at this point is how much of the Texas population attends public schools where they do get sex ed vs. private and religious schools where they might not.

 

[Human Shield]

Aside from the fact that they have no money? These are POVERTY STRICKEN areas first of all. Second, or maybe actually first, they are poverty stricken because of warlords and tribal violence making it hard to get goods to people. The church does most of the work distributing food and medication in south africa, and if they don't want them to have condoms they won't have condoms.

Then don't blame the church for whatever help it does do. It can set up whatever order it wants. And there are also people that follow church orders. If the church goers don't want to pay for Africa getting free condoms, it isn't going to happen.

sorry, try again. STD's are more prevalent in abstinence only religious areas than in evil liberal sex education areas. Those teens who are taught about STDs and how they are actually transmitted actually avoid sex longer due to their knowledge, and when they do have sex they use condoms for protection.

Kids in America who do it mostly <i>don't know</i> the dangers because they only get the same Church Approved message the Africans get.

So Bible belt towns have more STDs then New York and California, have any facts for this? I don't know where in abstinence only they hid how it is spread, that would kinda support their idea.

And that wasn't the point I made anyways.

That wasn't the point. You said there weren't one night stands "back then" but that there were prostitutes. One night stands is pretty much what prostitution MEANS.

One night stand means the person leaves and stands up the partner. Doesn't happen in agreed action of prostitution.

 

[Sarvis]

Then don't blame the church for whatever help it does do. It can set up whatever order it wants. And there are also people that follow church orders. If the church goers don't want to pay for Africa getting free condoms, it isn't going to happen.

And millions of people will die because of their attempt to enforce rules they themselvees can't follow.

Not saying you are wrong, just saying that it's pretty fucking coldhearted.

So Bible belt towns have more STDs then New York and California, have any facts for this? I don't know where in abstinence only they hid how it is spread, that would kinda support their idea.
[/qoute]

Abstinence only education is basically:

"Sex is a sin, don't have it until you're married."

It doesn't stop people from having sex, and they have no idea what dangers they face.

One night stand means the parent leaves and stands up the partner. Doesn't happen in agreed action of prostitution.

No, one night stand simply means that you have sex and then never see the person again. And where the ruck do parents get into this? Most one night stands are young, single people.

Also we were talking about Africa, and somehow I doubt you have the slightest clue as to what kind of sex lives these people lead. It's not like they go out clubbing every friday, there is every possibility that they only sleep with each other in commited relationships... but commited relationships break up all the time and if just one partner cheated or was raped they can both spread aids to their next partner.





Anyways, it's not like they actually have a choice since all their decisions until the end of time have already been made so that God can know them.

 

[kingcomrade]

Private schools? In this town? lol
This ain't Dallas.

You don't need statistics, I'd just like you to explain. I don't know how long ago it was you were a teenager, but sex ed classes are laughable. They always were. Anyone who is capable of not choking on his own drool knows what STDs are. Ditto for "where do babies come from?"

There was a homosexual guy (well, there were several, but I only really knew one) at my high school. For the time I knew him, he was mostly just narcissistic and obnoxious, but senior year he got disgusting. In addition to graduating from marijuana to ecstacy (not that he didn't stop smoking weed, as my still-offended nostrils can attest), he slept with every gay man in the entire town, and would tell us about it at lunch. Great! I love to hear "afterwards I farted in the shower and cum splattered out" while I'm eating.
Anyways, he got pulled out of school at the beginning of the second semester, he had ended up with some disease. Surprise, who saw that one coming.
Sex for pleasure is a self-indulgance. There's not really anything WRONG with it, but god damn, people. When you can get a disease that can destroy your life or an unexpected pregnancy that can completely change it (usually for the worse), you'd think they'd be a little more cautious. lolz buy tis fun

 

[TheGreatGodPan]

I'm pretty sure if you look at the stats for 50 years ago in America, there will be a lower illegitimacy rate, a higher marriage rate, fewer sexual partners per person per year and less disease.

A better analysis than I could give on AIDS in Africa

 

[Shagnak]

That blog you link to has a link to an article on Dry Sex and its contribution to the AIDS epidemic.

The preparation of the vagina pre dry-sex sounds rather painful.

 

[bryce777]

ROFL!

Yeah, people NEVER had premarital sex before the "modern age."

The term "bastard" has been around for a long, long, LONG time. Even our oldest legends often contain tales of adultery.

The world you are thinking of, where everyone was pure and responsible, NEVER FUCKING EXISTED.

It's a pipe dream to think that it did or can.

Good job failing to realize the difference. Mothers took responsibility for bastard kids, and it carried social consequences for the father if it got out (if you weren't a government agent like the King). Mistresses were around and prostitutes had kids, but I don't remember hearing of rampant one-night stands. Guys usually stayed with one mistress for long periods of time.

Like george washinton and thm jefferson who had hundreds of affairs?

 

[Sarvis]

Another incredibly important point about Catholicism:

Several of you are making the point that if people lived a proper Catholic lifestyle they would be perfectly monogamous and therefore safe from AIDS. This is because Catholicism teachs that sex outside of marriage is sinful.

However, what is the big, GIANT, ABSOLUTELY FUCKING HUGE overriding principle of Catholicism?

People are incapable of living without sin.


By Catholicisms own tenets simply preaching monogamy is not an effective way to fight AIDS, because their tenets say people are incapable of avoiding sin.

Their sins can be forgiven through a relationship with jesus, and/or performing various rituals... but these priests are leaving the bodies condemned for behavior that cannot be avoided because humans are not capable of leading a perfect life.

Their own doctrines pronounce that their approach to fighting AIDS will fail.

 

[kingcomrade]

Actually, this isn't a principle that originated with Christianity. The "fallen state of man" has been one of the principles of Western thought since Hellenic times until very recently (~100 years ago), when the mostly leftie groups decided they knew better, and that they could remake "eden," a secular Heaven on Earth by molding people into the right roles. It's what communism is based on, it's what a lot of modern leftist thought it based on.

 

[Sarvis]

Actually, this isn't a principle that originated with Christianity. The "fallen state of man" has been one of the principles of Western thought since Hellenic times until very recently (~100 years ago), when the mostly leftie groups decided they knew better, and that they could remake "eden," a secular Heaven on Earth by molding people into the right roles. It's what communism is based on, it's what a lot of modern leftist thought it based on.

Even if you're right, the church knows people cannot live up to it's ideals and should therefore act accordingly.

 

[kingcomrade]

I don't think Catholocism says "lol ure gonna do it anywayz have fun!"

Dry sex! Wonderful!