Game News Shadowrun Returns Kickstarter Update #75: Dragonfall DC details, release date is September 18th

[Bubbles]

Looks like an Underrail rip-off.

 

[Septaryeth]

DF was a nice little breeze, but that's about it.
I was genuinely surprised by how much they improved from DMS.
But I'm not sure if this new DF can warrant another playthrough, probably why it's free for backers/owners of the old DF.
Anyway, still a bro move compare to many other "director's cut". Hopefully this gives them enough to make an even better campaign.

 

[Alfons]

A lot of people are really pushing the money excuse for this.Do you guys even realize that aside from story most of the problems that dragonfall solved we're caused by the incompetence of the game designers and programmers.
The first of these so called solutions that come to my mind are the addition of a dedicated team and more skill checks throughout the game,both of these things require moderate amount of thought and minimal amount of coding to implement.Seeing as these motherfuckers consider the option to save your game as a feature should clue you in on how capable they are,for fucks sake I can still remember how these assholes tried to hide their incompetence by saying unity doesn't support saves.

As for story,I don't know how writers charge for their work,if it's per word or per page but again I don't think it would have cost that much to have 4 more back stories for team members.As for coding the,there are already guys you can hire in the fuckin game they should have just made them permanent companions.

I enjoyed both DMS and DF and I might pick this up if it has actual improvements to combat or skill balance.There aren't enough details yet to know if the directors cut is more "expensive" but seeing as the devs could have made DF from the start but couldn't I highly doubt that.If you like the dev or the game that's fine but don't try to bullshit me or yourself for that matter that the problems of the initial release existed because of the low budget.

 

[SuicideBunny]

I enjoyed both DMS and DF and I might pick this up if it has actual improvements to combat or skill balance.

if you have df you get the dc for free.

There aren't enough details yet to know if the directors cut is more "expensive"

um, time is money and it requires extra time over df, so yeah, it is more expensive.

 

[Roguey]

Seeing as these motherfuckers consider the option to save your game as a feature should clue you in on how capable they are,for fucks sake I can still remember how these assholes tried to hide their incompetence by saying unity doesn't support saves.

Josh Sawyer sez making games on a tight schedule results in making bad engineering decisions. The save system was one of those. They could have done it in the timeframe they were given, but we would have lost something else; what that would have been, who knows?

As for story,I don't know how writers charge for their work,if it's per word or per page but again I don't think it would have cost that much to have 4 more back stories for team members.As for coding the,there are already guys you can hire in the fuckin game they should have just made them permanent companions.

Additional content requires more time which requires more money that they didn't have since they had to take out an additional loan just to complete DMS as it was.

 

[Alfons]

if you have df you get the dc for free.

Yeah and I might not bother downloading it.

um, time is money and it requires extra time over df, so yeah, it is more expensive.

+Brilliant fuckin observation ,however if X requires the same amount of time and effort to make as Y then the cost of X=the cost of Y.If you still don't understand the point I'll elaborate further,I am not interested in the cost it takes to unfuck a fucked project I am interested in how much money it takes moderately competent people to produce the final product.They can use a million bucks to make something shitty and another million to make it decent the cost was 2mil,but if they could have made the final product with the initial mil if they applied more thought than the product is worth a million not 2.

Josh Sawyer sez making games on a tight schedule results in making bad engineering decisions. The save system was one of those. They could have done it in the timeframe they were given, but we would have lost something else; what that would have been, who knows?

+Sounds reasonable,I'm sure he wouldn't apply this principal to saving the fuckin game.It's a basic feature not a "save system".The original DMS had saves that were 1-2 hours apart depending on how fast you played,there is no excuse for that.Even if you are 100% right,they should have cut something else and included the saves.

Additional content requires more time which requires more money that they didn't have since they had to take out an additional loan just to complete DMS as it was.

Refer to the plus signs above.

 

[SuicideBunny]

If you still don't understand the point

it's more like you don't understand.
dc has more missions and more story, which is additional content that needs to be written and implemented, including production of art assets. so unless they actually paid some writers and artists to sit around and do nothing when making df, the dc could not possibly have been made for the same money as standard df.

 

[Infinitron]

It seems increasingly obvious that creating large, non-linear RPGs requires a degree of experience and confidence with your engine, tools and processes.

The initial Age of Decadence beta was more teleporty than the current version. The initial Wasteland 2 beta was more plot-gated too.

Shadowrun Returns didn't have the budget for lengthy development, so Dead Man's Switch is essentially a kind of beta for what it eventually became.

 

[Bubbles]

True, not everybody can be as well funded as Iron Tower Studio.

 

[Alfons]

it's more like you don't understand.
dc has more missions and more story, which is additional content that needs to be written and implemented, including production of art assets. so unless they actually paid some writers and artists to sit around and do nothing when making df, the dc could not possibly have been made for the same money as standard df.

First you are talking about required time and now you are talking about content,pick a point and stick with it.
If I could think of another example I would have included it,but I think my point is obvious.I realize that additional content requires more money which they probably had after the initial sales but I was referring to the core of the game,ui combat etc.

It seems increasingly obvious that creating large, non-linear RPGs requires a degree of experience and confidence with your engine, tools and processes.

The initial Age of Decadence beta was more teleporty than the current version. The initial Wasteland 2 beta was more plot-gated too.

Shadowrun Returns didn't have the budget for lengthy development, so Dead Man's Switch is essentially a kind of beta for what it eventually became.

That might be true but at least Wasteland 2 did not release the beta as the finished product.

 

[SuicideBunny]

First you are talking about required time and now you are talking about content,pick a point and stick with it.
If I could think of another example I would have included it,but I think my point is obvious.I realize that additional content requires more money which they probably had after the initial sales but I was referring to the core of the game,ui combat etc.

content, money, and development time are all interchangeable. as for core mechanics, that would still require additional time since it's an engine mod of the core game and for df and the dc to cost about the same they should have done it right from the start in dms, which obviously they didn't think or didn't have time for (it was a very tight timeframe, afterall).

That might be true but at least Wasteland 2 did not release the beta as the finished product.

they also didn't sign a contract with microsoft in which they promised to deliver a game in so and so many months and they still managed to fuck up combat, story and area design. just read the wl2 thread.

 

[Roguey]

True, not everybody can be as well funded as Iron Tower Studio.

You're being snarky but ITS worked/works for free, and most people won't for good reason.

 

[Alfons]

they also didn't sign a contract with microsoft in which they promised to deliver a game in so and so many months and they still managed to fuck up combat, story and area design. just read the wl2 thread.

The problem of the game we're in the design,the idea,the vision, a thing that can exist and should exist prior to kickstarter.I don't know much about WL2 and if they release a shitty final product then fuck them too,so far they haven't, HBS did.
The final product is what counts,not the process.

We really neede to get a game done very quickly,Interplay was in a lot of trouble...So, overall I think Icewind Dale 2 turned out to be pretty good,pretty fun,I think for making it in ten month it was great(laugh).From the consumer perspective I think that players probably could have had a more enjoyable game with some changes in how it was designed because ultimately you know,people aren't buying a game to celebrate how quickly the team was able to get it done under duress tehy're buying the game because they want to have fun so if it's not fun it doesn't really matter how cool it is that you got it done quickly.

 

[DeepOcean]

people aren't buying a game to celebrate how quickly the team was able to get it done under duress tehy're buying the game because they want to have fun so if it's not fun it doesn't really matter how cool it is that you got it done quickly.

I'd like to comment on this, this is true but the problems of DMS and Dragonfall are only in part fault of HBS and in part the result of a major problem among the RPG developers. This is a problem present on the old crpgs and continue to this day, a lack of theoretical game design knowledge on how to make a cRPG. Many times, RPG developers dismiss entirely the PnP world of RPG as something that doesn't work on the PC and miss a fucking rich knowledge of decades on how to make storytelling through game mechanics. Very little people even tried adapt the PnP experience to the cRPG format and the last attempt (the infinite engine games) was a really botched job but even as a botched job, Baldur's gate 2, while I hate Bioware storytelling, if a very good game.

DMS and Dragonfall are the way they are in part of A) KS culture (people think that games grow on trees for some reason and every single KS had to lie to get the money they need.), B)Lack of technical experience(HBS had no margin for error because of the budget but as inexperienced PC developers, as expected, tons of mistakes they did.) and C)The problem of existing only a really small audience demanding something more from developers(while we don't need to care about that, they sure do as they make a living of it.), most are just satisfied with cover shooting/story fagottry and rise some meaningless numbers up. (outside of the codex, Mass Effect 3 is considerated a RPG after all.)

 

[Ulminati]

why couldn't they have released df in this form from the start?

Not enough money is usually the answer to this question.

all the backers got df for free and dms had a very lukewarm reception. did those 0.9 more points on metacritic make such a huge difference that they couldn't have just taken some extra time and make it proper on their first try?

I think they realized they shot themselves in the foot by marketing it as DLC and not a standalone expansion/game.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

 

[Korron]

We live in the world of digital release. Release your game as many times as you want! Maybe it'll bump sales all over again. I really enjoyed it, and hope they release more campaigns. I rather like the idea of many shorter campaigns. I hope more RPGs do it in the future as I'm not big into replaying the same story to try a different class.

 

[mindx2]

New update:

Project Update #76: Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut Dev Diary #1: New Missions & Content

Posted by Harebrained Schemes LLC ♥ Like

This is the first of four Dev Diaries in which we discuss the new additions and improvements in Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut, a standalone release of our critically-acclaimed Dragonfall campaign which first premiered as a major expansion for Shadowrun Returns. Stay tuned each Thursday for another Dev Diary, leading up to the game's release on September 18, 2014.

------------------

Hi, I’m Andrew McIntosh, Lead Writer on Shadowrun: Dragonfall and the upcoming Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director’s Cut. As a long-time Shadowrun fan (I started playing with 2E, way back in 1992), working with Jordan and the team on Dragonfall was an incredible experience. Now, with the Dragonfall Director’s Cut, we’re thrilled to bring you even more of the magic-meets-cyberpunk storytelling that we delivered in Shadowrun: Dragonfall.

Today, I'd like to tell you about some of the brand new content we've added to the Director’s Cut. Don’t worry, I’ll keep this post spoiler-free; it’s safe to read on, even if you haven’t played through Shadowrun: Dragonfall yet.

Companion Story Missions - From the very beginning of our work on Dragonfall, we wanted to include missions that would tie directly into the back stories of the game’s major companion NPCs - Glory, Eiger, Dietrich, and Blitz. Unfortunately, during the development of the campaign, it became obvious that we weren’t going to have enough time to really do justice to the concept. Ultimately, we decided that if we couldn’t do these missions right, we shouldn’t do them at all.*

After Dragonfall was released, it became clear to us that our players wanted to experience these missions as much as we wanted to write and design them. This is why, when we decided to move forward with the Director’s Cut, companion story missions were at the top of our to-do list.

A location from Glory's mission.
In Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director’s Cut, you will find three new full-length missions that tie directly into the personal stories of Glory, Eiger, and Blitz. These stories range from supernatural horror to techno-thriller to dark comedy, and each mission touches on a different aspect of the Shadowrun universe.

Your companion characters can also earn unique rewards for completing their story missions. Blitz, for example, can gain the ability to corrupt hostile IC in the Matrix, forcing it to fight with him rather than against him. There are two different rewards for each story mission, but you’ll only be able to obtain one of them on any given playthrough. These rewards are separate from those gained in the Crew Advancement system (see below).

*The only concession to this idea that made it into Dragonfall was Dietrich’s involvement in an early mission of the game. By the way, don’t worry - we’re adding a unique reward for him, too.

Crew Advancement - You wanted more control over how your companion NPCs progressed in Dragonfall, and in the Director’s Cut, we’re delivering! Because Eiger, Glory, Dietrich, and Blitz are their own people, we aren’t giving you complete control over their character sheets; Eiger will always be a deadly ranged combatant, and Dietrich will never decide to give up magic and embark on an exciting new career as a decker. Instead, we’re implementing a system that will allow you to choose one of two all-new, unique enhancements for each of your companion characters every time they advance in skill.

For example, on a skill-up you might choose to grant Eiger the ability to fire a Dragon’s Breath round from her shotgun, penetrating armor and setting opponents on fire. Or you could give her the ability to fire an Interdiction round from her sniper rifle: a discarding-sabot HTI shot that completely ignores armor. Under this system, you will have the flexibility to choose how you would like to specialize your characters within their existing roles.

We’re also giving you the ability to customize the weapon, spell, and consumable loadouts for your companion characters, but I’ll leave the details on that for a future Dev Diary.

Additional Missions - In addition to the Companion Story Missions detailed above, two other full-length missions have been added to the game.

In “Trial Run,” you will undertake a mission for the mysterious Lodge, one of the side factions in Shadowrun: Dragonfall. Over the course of the run, you’ll learn how the organization conducts its business… but the Lodge will learn even more about you.

In “Lockdown,” you’ll get the opportunity to delve into the checkered past of the Kreuzbasar’s resident cybersurgeon, Dr. Xabier Ezkibel. Successfully completing this mission will unlock a variety of bleeding-edge bioware upgrades in Ezkibel’s clinic. Ever taken serious damage while out of range of a healer? Those shiny new Platelet Factories are just what the Doctor ordered… assuming, of course, that you have a big enough wad of nuyen to afford them.

Additional Endings - Without delving into spoiler territory, I can say that we’ve always wanted to explore some “what if?” scenarios related to Shadowrun: Dragonfall’s ending. There are two additional endings in the Director’s Cut; these new endings have been designed to give players even more agency in deciding how the story should unfold.

More Character Development - Several side characters from Shadowrun: Dragonfall have had their roles significantly enhanced, from the enigmatic Absinthe to the anarchistic Lucky Strike.

More Lore - There’s even more great Shadowrun lore in the Director’s Cut, including more easter eggs for long-time fans of the pen-and-paper game.

And that’s not all! But I’ll save the rest for our upcoming Dev Diaries.

I know that I speak for all of us here at Harebrained Schemes when I say “thank you” to you, the fans; if it weren’t for your enthusiasm and support, we wouldn’t have been able to spend these past few months revisiting the Flux State. We’re all looking forward to bringing you this definitive version of Dragonfall next month, so get ready to revisit the Flux State - or to dive in for the first time!

Tune in this time next week for our second Dev Diary, in which Jon Everist will discuss his experiences writing the music for Shadowrun: Dragonfall and the Director’s Cut!

All sounds pretty good to me, especially the additional endings and companion missions.

 

[Infinitron]

mindx2 Don't copy-paste URLs from your Kickstarter update email! People can log in as you.

 

[mindx2]

mindx2 Don't copy-paste URLs from your Kickstarter update email! People can log in as you.

Forgot to do that! Was too quick to try and harvest all those brofists instead of you... Did you edit it for me?

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Still a for me.
What's the ETA on this thing?

 

[Infinitron]

Still a for me.
What's the ETA on this thing?

Dude the thread title

 

[Bubbles]

2014? 2015? 2016? You never know with Harebrained Schemes.

 

[Major_Blackhart]

Still a for me.
What's the ETA on this thing?

Dude the thread title

Yeah I dont read that shit. Too many words.

 

[Jedi Exile]

Good. The game really needs more side missions. I am disappointed that they went full Bioware with the companions though.