From Software The Dark Souls II Megathread™

[Random]

Eh. Ninja Gaiden's not all that hard. Same with DMC. They both just have learning curves, but once you get past them, the games become simple. Ninja Gaiden Sigma was harder than Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 for me only because I didn't have the built up experience and skill from playing it before. Well, that, and in my opinion the first Ninja Gaiden had a bad clunkiness to how it controlled that 2 did away with.

 

[Jasede]

Aren't Sigma considered much, much easier than the X Box games?
Also if something requires a lot of practice before it becomes simple then it was hard.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Are we talking about the Xbawk Gaidens or the NES Gaidens?

Also, I'm convinced nothing is harder than Wizardry 4.

 

[Jasede]

The NES Gaidens are cake.

 

[Jasede]

Wizardry 4 isn't a fair game so comparing its difficult to games meant to be fair and theoretically beatable on the first attempt is iffy- though possible. But then, I'd say there's quite a few harder games: how about Tetris Grandmaster 3 where ALL THE BLOCKS ARE INVISIBLE at the final level?

Check out the speed of his fingers...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=jwC544Z37qo#t=263s

Invisible starts at 5:10, but I thought it might amuse you to see the speed at the stage before the last stage- which is pretty much blocks dropping from the top to the bottom so quickly you don't see them.

 

[Grimlorn]

They do need to make the Souls games harder someway. I beat several bosses on my first try and a lot of the bosses were trivial. It seems like my experience with Demon's Souls made this game too easy and it will be interesting to see whether people who have just played Dark Souls for the first time, find Dark Souls 2 challenging. I don't expect it to be much different though. Maybe on the new generation of consoles they'll do more with Dark Souls 3 or a new Souls type game.

Maybe high physical resistances (close to immunity) so you're encouraged to use magic, or pyros. Something where you have to change tactics and build a more balanced character instead of just running through the game with a +15 weapon or an elemental weapon or spamming the same magic spells or pyros. Maybe have weapon types matter a bit more, like slash, trust, smash, so you have to use more than one weapon type.

 

[Crooked Bee]

Wizardry 4 isn't a fair game so comparing its difficult to games meant to be fair and theoretically beatable on the first attempt is iffy

As someone who LPed Wizardry IV I feel like chiming in to say that, in retrospect, Wiz4 is suprisingly fair. It is still incredibly hard and fucked up, but after you solve all the levels and puzzles you can see they are actually quite beatable and even logical, you just have to be insanely knowledgeable about Wizardry and insanely good at puzzles and crazy inventive to beat it. That all puzzles make sense despite being completely fucked up, is one of the best things about Wizardry IV, actually.

So while I didn't beat it on my first attempt, I would say it is theoretically beatable on your first try. Heck, Brenda Garneau-Brathwaite-Romero claimed she beat it in two weeks without any hints back in the day.

 

[Damned Registrations]

I definitely wish they'd have made more use of the different physical resistances at the very least. You can note a difference between hitting a skeleton with a slashing weapon vs a striking one, if the weapon is weak enough, but it's not an overwhelming difference, and for high damage weapons it's nearly trivial. The fact that I don't even know the weaknesses/strengths for most creatures when it comes to different physical types is rather telling.

Hopefully they make use of more humanoid opponents as well. They tend to be the most interesting to fight conventionally, and if they tone down how ridiculously overpowered backstabbing and riposting are, they'd be a lot more challenging. The rapier knights in particular were brilliant.

I'd like them to overhaul the weapon upgrade system too, but I've got little hope for that. They'll almost certainly stick to the status quo there.

 

[Grimlorn]

Oh and they need to get rid of scripted encounters too. Crap like Bed of Chaos and Ceaseless Discharge. I remember them having a Great Dragon in Demon's Souls, which was fine because it was more of a stealth minigame where you had to sneak past the Great Dragon otherwise you got roasted which was fine, I guess but here they sucked.

And the first time I beat Ceasless Discharge it was straight up, then I saw a speed run on Youtube and saw some guy just punch his arm 4-5 times and he fell to his death and I was shocked. Why the hell would they put that in there? How does he even fall to his death? His legs clearly reach the ground over by the lava and it's not like there is any level change between the lava and the ground. Just completely retarded.

 

[Damned Registrations]

He falls to his death because he's not standing, the part where he's gripping onto the ledge is the huge chasm the lava lake drains into.

As to how or why he jumps in such a retarded way when he can just torch you from afar... yeah I hate that part of the fight too. Fighting him fairly was way more cool, and I'm glad I did it unspoiled and didn't luck into it.

Bed of chaos should have been some cool multi part boss. They obviously knew how to do that with the hydras (and the 'four' kings were basically an extension of that) and it would have been cool hacking off it's limbs as it gets progressively nastier. It was the whole gimmicky 'die in 3 hits' thing and the abundance of safe spots that made it so retarded.

 

[Jasede]

Wizardry 4 isn't a fair game so comparing its difficult to games meant to be fair and theoretically beatable on the first attempt is iffy

As someone who LPed Wizardry IV I feel like chiming in to say that, in retrospect, Wiz4 is suprisingly fair. It is still incredibly hard and fucked up, but after you solve all the levels and puzzles you can see they are actually quite beatable and even logical, you just have to be insanely knowledgeable about Wizardry and insanely good at puzzles and crazy inventive to beat it. That all puzzles make sense despite being completely fucked up, is one of the best things about Wizardry IV, actually.

So while I didn't beat it on my first attempt, I would say it is theoretically beatable on your first try. Heck, Brenda Garneau-Brathwaite-Romero claimed she beat it in two weeks without any hints back in the day.

This is a bold-faced lie. How do you beat the minefield without painfully dying every step to map it out? That's right, you can't. That's not "fair". Fair is if you can, in theory, get through it on your first try.

Now if you mean it's beatable? Sure! I can see that. If you're a huge Wizardry fan then it's exactly what it says on the tin: a great challenge only for the most skilled and dedicated.

Though I can't say I like the way instant death attacks can fuck you over.

 

[Crooked Bee]

Wizardry 4 isn't a fair game so comparing its difficult to games meant to be fair and theoretically beatable on the first attempt is iffy

As someone who LPed Wizardry IV I feel like chiming in to say that, in retrospect, Wiz4 is suprisingly fair. It is still incredibly hard and fucked up, but after you solve all the levels and puzzles you can see they are actually quite beatable and even logical, you just have to be insanely knowledgeable about Wizardry and insanely good at puzzles and crazy inventive to beat it. That all puzzles make sense despite being completely fucked up, is one of the best things about Wizardry IV, actually.

So while I didn't beat it on my first attempt, I would say it is theoretically beatable on your first try. Heck, Brenda Garneau-Brathwaite-Romero claimed she beat it in two weeks without any hints back in the day.

This is a bold-faced lie. How do you beat the minefield without painfully dying every step to map it out? That's right, you can't. That's not "fair". Fair is if you can, in theory, get through it on your first try.

I didn't mean that "on your first try" means "without dying". Clearly that's impossible in any Wizardry game. I meant it the way "beating a game on your first try" is usually understood; ironman has nothing to do with it.

Of course, if you're talking ironman, that'd be impossible. But I'm not sure why you would.

(Also a mine only takes away a part of your health so you don't die "every step")

 

[Jasede]

Oh, I didn't remember that. I never beat Wizardry 4!

 

[Grimlorn]

He falls to his death because he's not standing, the part where he's gripping onto the ledge is the huge chasm the lava lake drains into.

As to how or why he jumps in such a retarded way when he can just torch you from afar... yeah I hate that part of the fight too. Fighting him fairly was way more cool, and I'm glad I did it unspoiled and didn't luck into it.

Bed of chaos should have been some cool multi part boss. They obviously knew how to do that with the hydras (and the 'four' kings were basically an extension of that) and it would have been cool hacking off it's limbs as it gets progressively nastier. It was the whole gimmicky 'die in 3 hits' thing and the abundance of safe spots that made it so retarded.

Yeah but how does that make any sense? If I grab a table chest high with an arm and then fall in a similar way, do I die? It doesn't matter how much damage you do either, it's just 4 or 5 hits. It doesn't make sense. The only thing I can think, is he was somehow buggy or glitchy and they wanted to add an easy way to beat him in case he was too hard or something.

 

[Crooked Bee]

Oh, I didn't remember that. I never beat Wizardry 4!

You should try it, it's quite fun

(Or read my LP at LParchive.org -- I explain everything about the game there)

 

[Damned Registrations]

He falls to his death because he's not standing, the part where he's gripping onto the ledge is the huge chasm the lava lake drains into.

As to how or why he jumps in such a retarded way when he can just torch you from afar... yeah I hate that part of the fight too. Fighting him fairly was way more cool, and I'm glad I did it unspoiled and didn't luck into it.

Bed of chaos should have been some cool multi part boss. They obviously knew how to do that with the hydras (and the 'four' kings were basically an extension of that) and it would have been cool hacking off it's limbs as it gets progressively nastier. It was the whole gimmicky 'die in 3 hits' thing and the abundance of safe spots that made it so retarded.

Yeah but how does that make any sense? If I grab a table chest high with an arm and then fall in a similar way, do I die? It doesn't matter how much damage you do either, it's just 4 or 5 hits. It doesn't make sense. The only thing I can think, is he was somehow buggy or glitchy and they wanted to add an easy way to beat him in case he was too hard or something.

You're not understanding the geography properly. I'll see if I can whip up a picture for you.

 

[Occasionally Fatal]

Yeah but how does that make any sense? If I grab a table chest high with an arm and then fall in a similar way, do I die? It doesn't matter how much damage you do either, it's just 4 or 5 hits. It doesn't make sense. The only thing I can think, is he was somehow buggy or glitchy and they wanted to add an easy way to beat him in case he was too hard or something.

The ledge he grabs is over a pretty big drop, different from the area he is initially standing on. So you make him release his grip and he dies from the fall. I think he falls down past the cliff where you see the first goat machete dude.

 

[Jasede]

I really like the backstory to that boss, told solely through items.

 

[Linden]

I have a confession to make.



I have never beaten Dark Souls. I've never gotten past Bed of Chaos. It was not the boss itself that broke me. It was the long, pointless, ardous, boring, fucking frustrating run from the bonfire to the boss that finally broke me. It was a waste of time. It made my fingers hurt. It wasn't challenging in any way. It was just a long, pointless, ardous, boring, frustrating run from point A to B. It was... shitty design. So, so shitty. I can still feel cold contempt rise in me just thinking about it.

Of course I want to see the ending. I want to beat Gwyn (yeah, I spoiled myself). And I know I could beat BoC if I really wanted to. I have killed every other boss in the game ten times over. I have rolled at least twenty different characters, mastered every weapon and every spell. But every time I think of taking on BoC again, I think of the long, pointless, ardous, boring, fucking frustrating run from the bonfire to the boss... and I say to myself: no. Not worth it.

tl;dr Declinator and Stonewolf, my bros, I feel your pain.

now let the hate flow

 

[Grimlorn]

Yeah I just loaded up the game and checked. There is a place for him to fall. I remembered the layout wrong.

 

[Occasionally Fatal]

Eh. Ninja Gaiden's not all that hard. Same with DMC. They both just have learning curves, but once you get past them, the games become simple. Ninja Gaiden Sigma was harder than Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 for me only because I didn't have the built up experience and skill from playing it before. Well, that, and in my opinion the first Ninja Gaiden had a bad clunkiness to how it controlled that 2 did away with.

Ninja Gaiden Black is my personal favorite. The Sigma versions all have annoying differences from the Xbox versions, and foreshadowed the shit show that was Ninja Gaiden 3, since they all had the same director. As far as difficulty goes, NGB is quite difficult on Very Hard and Master Ninja. Normal is a cakewalk once you know the game, and Hard is a reasonable progression. The best part about the difficulties though is the departure from simply making the enemies hit harder and having the player do less damage. New enemies and bosses, different enemy placement, harder challenge areas, and nastier AI make it much more satisfying at increased difficulty levels than most games. For instance, I've put a lot of time into Dark Souls, but haven't done a single NG+.

 

[Damned Registrations]

Here, I took some screenshots:

This is where the thing is hanging on to, just left of the fog gate:

This is where the lava he starts out on ends and the giant chasm starts.

 

[Occasionally Fatal]

now let the hate flow

I feel no hate for you, only pity.

Anyway, if you can do the knight archers in Anor Londo without using ranged, you can definitely do the bed of chaos. Your progress is even saved if you die.

 

[Random]

Ninja Gaiden Black is my personal favorite. The Sigma versions all have annoying differences from the Xbox versions, and foreshadowed the shit show that was Ninja Gaiden 3, since they all had the same director. As far as difficulty goes, NGB is quite difficult on Very Hard and Master Ninja. Normal is a cakewalk once you know the game, and Hard is a reasonable progression. The best part about the difficulties though is the departure from simply making the enemies hit harder and having the player do less damage. New enemies and bosses, different enemy placement, harder challenge areas, and nastier AI make it much more satisfying at increased difficulty levels than most games. For instance, I've put a lot of time into Dark Souls, but haven't done a single NG+.

Yeah. That's one thing that most action games have that Dark Souls doesn't, easily adjustable difficulty settings. I wouldn't mind if they made it so you could select a Hard or Insane mode from the menu whenever you start a new game that makes the enemies more aggressive, numerous, etc. AS LONG AS the basic Normal Mode is roughly as difficult as the previous games have been normally.

 

[DragoFireheart]

I have a confession to make.



I have never beaten Dark Souls. I've never gotten past Bed of Chaos. It was not the boss itself that broke me. It was the long, pointless, ardous, boring, fucking frustrating run from the bonfire to the boss that finally broke me. It was a waste of time. It made my fingers hurt. It wasn't challenging in any way. It was just a long, pointless, ardous, boring, frustrating run from point A to B. It was... shitty design. So, so shitty. I can still feel cold contempt rise in me just thinking about it.

Of course I want to see the ending. I want to beat Gwyn (yeah, I spoiled myself). And I know I could beat BoC if I really wanted to. I have killed every other boss in the game ten times over. I have rolled at least twenty different characters, mastered every weapon and every spell. But every time I think of taking on BoC again, I think of the long, pointless, ardous, boring, fucking frustrating run from the bonfire to the boss... and I say to myself: no. Not worth it.

tl;dr Declinator and Stonewolf, my bros, I feel your pain.

now let the hate flow

Sissy.