Thieves Guilds: Morrowind did it right

[DragoFireheart]

Another example of Skyrim seeming nearly as bad as Oblivion on the surface, but actually being much better put together - you have a test of magical ability on entry and while it's irrelevant in unmodded game, modding magic skill to have more impact automagically makes it a requirement for entry without having to mod the quests themselves.

Inside Skyrim there is a proper RPG (or at least aRPG) struggling to get out.

And then I remember that they removed spell crafting while also making Master level spells shit.

Still, you seem to be a wise Dragon. Perhaps there is hope for the Elder Scrolls series. May Allah bless you with more wisdom.

 

[deuxhero]

>Retarded training cap in OB means you can't go on mad training binges like in MW

This really annoys me. Bethesda seemed to keep what was broken about training (raising hard to raise skills really quick is still pretty doable), but the least broken uses (learning a useful secondary skill from scratch, a gold sink) were destroyed.

 

[Jugashvili]

This really annoys me. Bethesda seemed to keep what was broken about training (raising hard to raise skills really quick is still pretty doable), but the least broken uses (learning a useful secondary skill from scratch, a gold sink) were destroyed.

Not to mention the fact that for the game not to become a broken mess due to level scaling, you pretty much had to focus on secondary skills to keep your char from levelling up too quickly and getting eaten by bloated enemies.

 

[DraQ]

I imagine any badge-sporting biker spotted on the streets in China or Teheran would find himself in a windowless room with his legs broken soon enough, but I digress.

Quoted the relevant part. I don't think anyone in Tamriel has heard of modern day human(oid) rights or US constitution.

It would be tricky to explain to a bunch of guards why, if they are going after TG, and they see a member of TG and know it, they can't drag him into the castle's dungeon or brain him with an axe if he doesn't want to go.
In general it's often baffling how civilized, in the modern day sense, supposedly rough fantasy regimes tend to be.

I remember it being extremely "we must protect the lower classes and bring justice to Tamriel!" from start to finish. It was part of the jolly fun time high fantasy aesthetic I hated so much about Oblivion in general.

They were pretty clearly keeping the locals in TG friendly area pleased, and you could keep the taxes, IIRC.
As much as I hate defending lolblivion (because it just sucks), this particular questline pretty much worked.

I like to ignore crafting in Skyrim, because nothing in the game world matches up. Crafting kills exploration or any sense of quest reward.

And I like to ignore unmodded Skyrim, because slapping Requiem and handful of other mods on it pretty much fixes most of its problems and turns it from a so-so game into massive pile of fun.

And then I remember that they removed spell crafting while also making Master level spells shit.

Which is one truly infuriating part (removal of spellmaker) along with removal of attributes, because those elements would be fucking stellar when combined with new casting modes.
(Also, removal of mysticism irks me because a lot of spells just don't fit anywhere else).

Shit master level spells, OTOH, are easily fixed with Requiem.

 

[DragoFireheart]

Which is one truly infuriating part (removal of spellmaker) along with removal of attributes, because those elements would be fucking stellar when combined with new casting modes.
(Also, removal of mysticism irks me because a lot of spells just don't fit anywhere else).

Shit master level spells, OTOH, are easily fixed with Requiem.

Mods will fix it, but can mods make me play the PC version?

 

[Turjan]

I remember it being extremely "we must protect the lower classes and bring justice to Tamriel!" from start to finish. It was part of the jolly fun time high fantasy aesthetic I hated so much about Oblivion in general.

They were pretty clearly keeping the locals in TG friendly area pleased, and you could keep the taxes, IIRC.
As much as I hate defending lolblivion (because it just sucks), this particular questline pretty much worked.

This was definitely the highlight of the faction quests in Oblivion for me. Most people seem to prefer the Dark Brotherhood one, but that struck me as somewhat cheesy, unfortunately not in the way that doesn't take itself too seriously. But the Thieves Guild in Oblivion worked well.

 

[DalekFlay]

I replayed the mages guild questline not long ago, maybe I'll load that character up and re-experience the thieves stuff in Oblivion here someday soon. Either way, I know I preferred Morrowind's seedy back ally club missions.

 

[Eyeball]

I imagine any badge-sporting biker spotted on the streets in China or Teheran would find himself in a windowless room with his legs broken soon enough, but I digress.

Quoted the relevant part. I don't think anyone in Tamriel has heard of modern day human(oid) rights or US constitution.

It would be tricky to explain to a bunch of guards why, if they are going after TG, and they see a member of TG and know it, they can't drag him into the castle's dungeon or brain him with an axe if he doesn't want to go.
In general it's often baffling how civilized, in the modern day sense, supposedly rough fantasy regimes tend to be.

In the case of Riften's TG, it's likely because of the protection of Maven Black-Briar who not only runs the whole damn town but also seems to use the local guild as her personal head-knockers. MBB's not a woman a lowly town guard would want to cross, in fact the only person who seems interested in fighting the guild is that warrior lady hanging around just inside the town when you first walk in the city gates.

Really seems like there was a cut subplot to help her in demolishing the TG like how you could turn on the Dark Brotherhood. It was probably removed in order to make room for more Derpgons.

 

[Somberlain]

some games do Thieves Guilds better than others. And by some games I mean one game. And by one game I mean Morrowind.

This is the leader of the Thieves Guild in Morrowind:

I see what you mean

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Gentleman Jim Crow

It would be tricky to explain to a bunch of guards why, if they are going after TG, and they see a member of TG and know it, they can't drag him into the castle's dungeon or brain him with an axe if he doesn't want to go.
In general it's often baffling how civilized, in the modern day sense, supposedly rough fantasy regimes tend to be.

They do that (I assume they are jailed as well but you don't get to see that). They just can't wipe them out completely (that is, kill the named thieves at Riften) because the local influent crime family gives orders to both the TG and the numerous corrupt guards (remember how a guard tries to extort you at the town's gates as if that was regular business).